Christians - Can you Ever Lose your Salvation?

by gumby 64 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • gumby
    gumby


    Below is a common view of a christians viewpoint of salvation.

    See if you christians here agree, and answer how you feel about whether salvation can be lost.

    Section 7: Salvation

    We believe that all those who have truly placed their faith in Christ are eternally secure in their salvation, kept by God’s power, secure and sealed in Christ forever (John 6:37-40; 10:27-30; Rom 8:1, 38-39; Eph 1:13-14; 1Pet 1:5; Jude 24).

    Question: "Is eternal security a "license" to sin?"

    A nswer: The most frequent objection to the doctrine of eternal security is that it supposedly promotes the idea that Christians can live anyway that they want to - and still be saved. While this is "technically" true, that is not the "essence" of eternal security. A person who has truly accepted Jesus Christ as his or her Savior "can" live a sinful life - but he or she "will" not do so. We must draw a distinction between how a Christian should live - and what a person must do in order to receive salvation.

    The moment a person truly believes in Jesus Christ, they are saved and secure in that salvation

    To claim that we must obey God's Word or live a godly life to maintain our salvation is equal to saying that Jesus' death was not sufficient to pay the penalty for our sins. Jesus' death was absolutely sufficient to pay for all of our sins - past, present, and future, pre-salvation and post-salvation (Romans 5:8; 1 Corinthians 15:3; 2 Corinthians 5:21).

    How could anyone, knowing the price Jesus Christ paid for us, go on to live a life of sin (Romans 6:15-23)? How could anyone who understands God's unconditional and guaranteed love for those who believe, take that love and throw it back in God's face? Such a person is demonstrating not that eternal security has given them a license to sin, but rather that he or she has not truly experienced salvation through Jesus Christ. "No one who lives in Him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has either seen Him or known Him" (1 John 3:6).

    I would have serious doubts about a person who claims to be a believer yet lives a life that says otherwise. Christians are forgiven no matter how many times they sin, but at the same time Christians should live a progressively more holy life as they grow closer to Christ.

    There is nothing that can prevent a believer from one day being glorified because God has already purposed it in heaven. Once a person is justified, his salvation is guaranteed - he is as secure as if he is already glorified in heaven.

    Salvation lost? 1 John 5:16 is one of the most difficult verses in the New Testament. Of all the interpretations out there, I have not found one that seems to answer all the questions concerning this verse. This best interpretation I have found is comparing this verse to what happened to Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5:1-10 (see also 1 Corinthians 11:30). The “sin unto death” is deliberate, willful, continuous, unrepentant sin. God, in His grace, allows His children to sin without immediately punishing them. However, there comes a point when God will no longer allow a believer to continue in unrepentant sin. When this point is reached, God sometimes decides to punish a Christian, even to the point of taking his or her life.

    ( I thought this comment was amusing)

    Is a person who lives a life of continual sin a believer? No. When a person becomes a Christian, their life will change. Any person who is living a sinful lifestyle and claims to be a Christian – that person is either lying, is self-deceived, or really is a believer who is going to experience God’s judgment and discipline (Hebrews 12:5-11).

    1 John 5:16
    If you see a Christian brother or sister F15 sinning in a way that does not lead to death, you should pray, and God will give that person life. But there is a sin that leads to death, and I am
    There is a sin unto death;

    which is not only deserving of death, as every other sin is, but which certainly and inevitably issues in death in all that commit it, without exception; and that is the sin against the Holy Ghost, which is neither forgiven in this world nor in that to come, and therefore must be unto death; it is a sinning wilfully, not in a practical, but doctrinal way, after a man has received the knowledge of the truth; it is a wilful denial of the truth of the Gospel, particularly that peace, pardon, righteousness, eternal life, and salvation, are by Jesus Christ, contrary to the light of his mind, and this joined with malice and obstinacy; so that there is no more or other sacrifice for such a sin; there is nothing but a fearful looking for of wrath and fury to fall on such opposers of the way of life; and as the presumptuous sinners under Moses's law died without mercy, so must these despiteful ones under the Gospel; see (Matthew 12:31,32) (Hebrews 10:26-29) not saying you should pray for those who commit it.
    Whosoever is begotten of God sinneth not, 5:18.

    The new nature, the spiritual being born of the new birth, is not disposed to sin, and will be destroyed if the sin is wilful and continued. One born of God cannot engage in willful sin. Nor can he who abides in Christ. He who becomes a wilful sinner does not abide in Christ, nor remain a child of God.
    So, can you lose your salvation?
    Gumby

  • Ianone
    Ianone

    Of course salvation can be lost. Free will is the greatest gift we have next to Christ's sacrifice on the cross.

  • gumby
    gumby

    But but but......what about all those scriptures that say otherwise?

    Gumby

  • Robdar
    Robdar

    If Jesus died for the sins of the world, then the whole world is forgiven. Xtian or not.

  • gumby
    gumby
    If Jesus died for the sins of the world, then the whole world is forgiven. Xtian or not.

    Robdar ya little spiritual hussy and whoremonger of the Great Harlot Whore! That's just what Satan WANTS you to think. I just guess we don't remember the part where it says 'god loved the world so much he gave his only beggoten son and that ........hear it comes.....whoever would believe in him would have life'. He ain't lettin no dadgum Muslims and Buddhists, and Hindu's and Jews in his Kingdom...... ya hooter puffin knucklehead! Gumby

  • Robdar
    Robdar

    Now slow up, Gumby. This little whoremonger of the Great Harlot whore wants to climb off. Riding the beast all day has made my butt sore. You've got a boney back, beastie boy.

  • carla
    carla

    define sin. what is your interpretation? some say for instance that those that are true alcoholics or smokers are sinners and are not worthy of salvation. Yet, they believe in Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. Being human their personal sin is 'out' there for the world to see. What about those who sin, inwardly, shall we say. Such as lust, greed, etc... these are not outward sins for the world to see. May I call them sins of the heart? They are still there, forgive me but, it seems so many people have this 'top ten' list of sins they deem worse than others and are happy they are not like that 'other fellow' who is a sinner. I agree murder, rape, and of course the ten commandments are in fact the 'top ten' list. But, man has added what should be deemed the 'next top ten'. True if one is a follower of Christ and loves Him we would try to please Him. Just as you love and try to please your spouse or s.o., yet we fail them. It is exactly because of being human we will fail those we love, including Christ. Do we try to do what is right? yes, Paul also had this struggle. To do what is right but our bodies don't seem to cooperate. If Christ came and lived as a human and was tempted as are we, do you think He cannot understand the failings? Even though He did not fail? How can you still love someone that fails you? It is for that reason, love. Love covers all. I can only go by what I read here and other exjw board and living with one, there seems to be a common struggle with, accept Christ, then what? Go on sinning? I would read Romans for that answer. All of us, I believe, are in a different walk with the Lord, just a different pace. Sometimes I think we are so busy judging where others are and where they should be, we lose track of where we are ourselves. That log looks pretty big sticking out of your eye, here, let me help you. As they whack you in the face with the whole damn tree sticking out of their eye! I just can't believe I could ever have more compassion than Jesus Christ. It is just not possible. I do not think our minds are truly capable of comprehending Jesus, God, and even really Love. Maybe if we could harness that other 90% of our brain that they say we don't even use?

  • gumby
    gumby
    define sin.

    Ok Carla...I'll give you some true to life scenarios.

    A couple lives together but are not married and they are christians and they play nasty in bed.

    A couple does not live together but they still play nasty once in awhile.

    A guy is a christian and he smokes weed

    A girl is a christian and she smokes weed

    A guy is a christian and he drinks booze and once in awhile he gets drunk.......like 10 times a year!

    A couple are christian and they are homosexual

    A teenage christian boy continually reads nasty books and looks at porn and plays with his monkey a whole bunch.

    A christian man regularly cheats on his taxes

    Those kinda sins

    Gumby

  • FlyingHighNow
    FlyingHighNow
    That's just what Satan WANTS you to think.

    Okay, how many scriptures are there that show Satan doing bad things? How many scriptures are there showing Jehovah doing bad things? Jehovah wins! He is recorded as doing a lot more bad things. So, who do we believe?

  • oldflame
    oldflame

    Just because a person is a christian does not make them perfect without sin. The Lord say's we all fall short of his glory. But it is like you said quoting John 3:16, it is having faith in Christ that he lived, performed miracles, died on the cross and was raised from the dead 3 days later. It is true however that once a christian excepts the Christ as their messiah that they put on the new wardrobe. This wardrobe is the fruits of the spirit.

    This does not mean that someone stops sinning but each moment of their lives they try to be more like Jesus even though that feat is not completly possible as we are not the messiah. This is where asking and claimong your sin to God for his forgiveness comes to play. If your not a christian your not going to ask God for forgiveness as this person does not have a faith in a God.

    Jesus told his deciples when he was asked " How many times must a man forgive) Jesus said as many times as he ask for it. Asking forgiveness is part of Christ death on the cross and was part of his purpose.

    oldflame

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