Do you believe ...

by AhHah 89 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • ianao
    ianao

    1. Do you believe in God (or that the universe has a Creator)?

    yes

    2. Have you ever regularly attended meetings of Jehovah's Witnesses (either baptized or not)?

    no

    3. Do you personally agree with all current teachings and practices of Jehovah's Witnesses?

    teachings - yes
    practices - no

    4. Do you believe that the modern-day organization of Jehovah's Witnesses has God's blessing?..

    maybe - I believe they actually researched and started reading MOSTLY what God had intended to be written.

    5. Do you believe that the modern-day organization of Jehovah's Witnesses is God's ONLY channel of spiritual revelation to mankind?..

    definately not, but I believe that they are one of the channels.

    6. Do you believe that Christianity is the only form of worship approved by God?...

    According to God himself, (at least as written in his Bible), yes.

    7. Do you believe that the Bible (or parts of it) are inspired by God?

    yes

    8. Do you believe that any religious book(s) other than the Bible are inspired by God?...

    no

    9. Do you believe that there will be a judgment day from God -- when God will judge living humans and put to death any that are not approved?...

    yes, his word says so.

    10. Do you believe that mankind is living in the Bible's prophesied "last days" and that a judgment day from God will come in the near future?...

    well, yes. If you mean near future as in God's timetable, then we may be talking a few hundred years, or 10 minutes. No way of knowing. Jesus didn't even know. :)

  • Pathofthorns
    Pathofthorns

    This is interesting that you believe in all of the teachings, yet you don't believe their core teaching that they are "the only channel".

    The problem with believing their teachings are right is that when they have "new light" and change their teachings, there's no way that the old teaching and the new teaching could be right. If you believe the present teachings are 100 percent correct and cling to these, tomorrow you may find yourself kicked out of the religion if they change their mind and you decide to you don't want to change with them.

    Think carefully my friend. Keep an open mind. Look at all sides. There's no need to rush into anything.

    Path

  • ianao
    ianao

    Hello Path.

    If I am led astray by my leader's msapplication of 'new light' then so be it. When judgement day arrives, they will be in error, not me. I would rather follow what I understand to be the best way to God than to be lost forever in darkness. So many xtiandomites LOVE to argue about 'flickering light', but they forget that they themselves will be judged on their own merrits. Look at the light, no matter how much it flickers. I don't think you will be seeing any Jehovah's Witnesses engaged in civil war. I don't count ex JWs or JWs wanting reform as true JWs, as their faith seems to have simply 'fallen away', and true JWs would not consider them JWs anyway.

    The organization of JWs truly does keep the Christian congregation meshed together into a 'collective' of sorts. What do you expect? Why do you think their are SO MANY DENOMINATIONS of Christianity?

    Sounds strange eh? So is Christianity. The Laws that God set down for the Jews and Gentiles alike are demanding, and cult-like in structure. (Or as it is perceived). The question comes down to:

    Is God True, or is he False?

    *sniff sniff* - I smell satan, and it sounds like he truly is misleading MANY in these trying days. Our thoughts and perceptions do seem to be centered around questioning our creator, and playing God. Sometimes I wish I were never born...

    -ianao

    Edited by - ianao on 18 December 2000 10:40:18

  • Pathofthorns
    Pathofthorns
    If I am led astray by my leader's msapplication of 'new light' then so be it. When judgement day arrives, they will be in error, not me.

    Right here you acknowledge a human leader. If you are a christian you have no need of another leader other than Christ. I find your non-chalant attitude toward being led astray almost disturbing. All genuine Christians should test and be careful that they are not led astray.

    As for passing off your own responsibility toward God on your "leaders", the Bible shows you can do no such thing. YOU will be judged for YOUR own actions on judgement day. And it "they are in error" YOU also will be in error. "If a blind man leads a blind man, BOTH will fall into a pit".

    By your reasoning, any Christian religion could be considered correct. Sit down and think and use your God-given mind to logically weigh all this out. Once you "sign on" there's no going back.

    Path

  • ianao
    ianao
    Right here you acknowledge a human leader. If you are a christian you have no need of another leader other than Christ. I find your non chalant attitude toward being led astray almost disturbing.

    Well, this 'non chalant' attitude has come to me after the realization that NO form of Christianity in existance today is 100% correct. To assume that all are correct is a contradiction to what God said. To assume that only one is correct is dependent upon faith in your beliefs. To assume that none is correct is also dependent upon faith in your beliefs. I know that I will be judged on my own actions, and as I said before, if *I* am led astray by *MY* own actions in persuing truth as Jehovah God has laid it out due to an error on my *LEADER'S* part, then the error was made by my leader, and *I* was faithfully following God. If God condemns *ME* for following what I truly believed to be *HIM*, then he is not as JUST as he says he is, he is false, and a liar, and this whole Christianity concept is for the birds and I am a mammal that was put here after being bred with aliens and monkeys, and I am nothing, never have been, never will be. Do I believe this? No.

    I *KNOW* I am responsible for my spirituality, which is why I choose to study with Jehovah's Witnesses. The JW's mentality (at least in the GB) is to seek truth. You cannot seek 'truth' if you suddenly decide you are WRONG and then you do not change your thinking. Catholics are finding out today that NOT changing and basing themselves on tradition is a road to ruin. This is also why I am not planning on being baptized as a JW, because I do not believe that Christians should write themselves into scripture. I am greatful for them opening up my eyes to what I could not see in regards to trinity, hell-fire, etc. etc. I have done nothing but grown in faith to Jesus and integrity to Almighty Jehovah God since studying with them.

    All genuine Christians should test and be careful that they are not led astray.

    I agree. I will say, that for someone with an open mind, being suddenly flooded with the controdictions that xtiandomites face leads to two roads:

    1. Forget the whole thing, assume 'his thoughts are higher than my thoughts', and go home and sin your way to destruction. My sister, who constantly reminds me of her pagan holy trinity is a prime example of such a path.

    2. Seek what is Truth, and what is Just, and more importantly CORRECT! Right now, the DOCTRINES and most teachings of the WTBTS are the closest thing to accuracy that I have come across. The only 'DOGMA' involved is belief that God will live up to his name, and 'Cause it to Become!', which to a TRUE Christian, is fact, and not dogma.

    As for passing off your own responsibility toward God on your "leaders", the Bible shows you can do no such thing. YOU will be judged for YOUR own actions on judgement day. And it "they are in error" YOU also will be in error. "If a blind man leads a blind man, BOTH will fall into a pit".

    By your reasoning, any Christian religion could be considered correct. Sit down and think and use your God-given mind to logically weigh all this out. Once you "sign on" there's no going back.

    When the Bible was composed, I imagine that the point was 'Jews and pagans are no more, only Jesus Christ is the way'. I wonder if God ever had imagined that so many 'followers' of Christ would in and OF themselves stray so far away from that WAY.

    If Jehovah condemns me for seeking truth and looking for truth because I was following a blind man, and I fell, then that is his problem. I will have done the best I could have in my sinful nature, a nature that I never asked for when I was born. I would be DEAD anyway, and wouldn't be around for any of this to matter at all. Let it be God's will, no matter what we perceive it to be. This is all any Christian can do.

    Believe me, I WANTED to turn my head and not listen to what the WT teachings say, and it would have been very easy and to my 'worldly' advandage to do so. I would have many more friends in this 'world' and I would be much more popular. I have chosen a path to seek God. In seeking God, one who is TRULY seeking God does not just 'stick with an idea' if it controdicts THE OTHER HALF OF THE BIBLE! And I am definately NOT catholic, and I do NOT believe that God has one specific channel, except for his Annoited Firstborn of all creation (you know who I mean! ;) ). The problem is, you have a spiritual channel vs. Man's self-made religious channels, and the WTBTS is definately one of those self-made channels to get closer to understanding our mediator with God. Are they inspired by God? Yes, because they think so. Are Catholics inspired by God? Yes, because they think so. Are Mormans inspired by God? Yes, because they think so. God is the common inspiration for all Christian denominations. I look to the denomination (whether they want to admit it or not) that is trying to follow God and use the Bible as a guide, and this is the good ol' JWs.

    My old pastor trying to take 10% of my money and explain to me that people who are supposedly already in heaven would rise from the ground to meet Jesus thinks he is inspired by God, even though his VERY TEACHINGS controdict the Bible directly. Should I have listened to him and keep on thinging that God 'shoved them down to earth real quick'? No. Nor should I believe that someone with a Father - Son relationship are the same entity. I get nothing but confusion from everywhere else. From WT, I get clarification. AT LEAST THEY ARE USING THE BIBLE AS A BASE OF KNOWLEDGE!

    True Christianity is an answer to all, and I agree is a way of life. Some will say that JWs 'conveiently package everything together', and to that I say that I would rather read a package of honest truth seekers than to duke it out with supposed fellow Christians for another 1,000 years!

    Oh, and Path, the search for God is my task. I do NOT delegate that responsibility. With a modern society bent on the world, and no longer at God, it is VERY difficult to totally dedicate oneself to Christ's ideals, let alone God himself. While I research things myself, I leave a great deal of it in the hands of people who have dedicated their lives to such research. My main concern is comprehension and understanding. I've been down the road of trying to learn Greek and researching the origins of manuscripts. You will spend your whole life never understanding God's whole message. You come to a point of YE or NE, and I am tired of holding onto BELIEFS and I am ready to grasp UNDERSTANDING.

    Does this make any sense? Hope I haven't rambled too long. I know I seem hypicritical, but dogma has ruined me mentally, and I'm sick of it.

    -ianao

  • Pathofthorns
    Pathofthorns

    I'm trying to understand where you are coming from. You make alot of good points. I'm not sure how compatible your own ideals are with Jehovah's Witnesses.

    If you do decide to get baptized you are no longer free to come to your own conclusions based on your own research. You always must come to the same conclusions they do, unless they tell you otherwise.

    If you just associate and do not get baptized, you will soon realize how difficult and nearly impossible this course is. You will never be accepted by Witnesses and are slated for destruction if you after having recieve "accurate knowledge" do not become a member.

    Now i'm not saying there is no benefit in associating and learning different viewpoints. All i am saying is to make sure the reality of things is compatible with your own ideals. And i must say, that many of your ideals seem to be quite good.

    Path

  • ianao
    ianao
    I'm trying to understand where you are coming from. You make alot of good points. I'm not sure how compatible your own ideals are with Jehovah's Witnesses.

    Oh I know they are definately not. That is why, as I said in my earlier post above, I was learning their teachings. I never said I would be baptized as a JW.

    If you do decide to get baptized you are no longer free to come to your own conclusions based on your own research. You always must come to the same conclusions they do, unless they tell you otherwise.

    This hippocrisy in the workings of the religion itself (when they tell you to keep searching for yourself, that is until you are baptized a JW) are one of the MAIN reasons why I would never become one, at least not in their current incarnation.

    If you just associate and do not get baptized, you will soon realize how difficult and nearly impossible this course is. You will never be accepted by Witnesses and are slated for destruction if you after having recieve "accurate knowledge" do not become a member.

    All I have to do is subscribe to the WT magazines, read, apply (carefully) what I have read, and live by what I have learned. I have no dire need to become 'one' with anyone but Jesus' Father in purpose. The friend of mine who is a JW once told me that some people never get baptized a JW, yet they still attend the KH. I am not looking for a social life, I already have that. (I think!)

    Now i'm not saying there is no benefit in associating and learning different viewpoints. All i am saying is to make sure the reality of things is compatible with your own ideals. And i must say, that many of your ideals seem to be quite good.

    I agree. As stated above. And thank you for you kind comments. I try my best to follow God as I'm sure every SINCERE person does.

    (I wonder why it always seems as if I am justifying myself. Been this way since I was an athiest, and now as a Christian. Odd, really.)

    Well, interesting thread!

    -ianao

  • RR
    RR

    1.Yes
    2.Yes
    3.No
    4.No
    5.No
    6.Yes, the Christianity of the Bible
    7.Yes
    8.No
    9.Yes
    10.Yes

    "People in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones"

  • thinker
    thinker

    The founder of Watch Tower, Charles Taze Russell, said, If we were following a man undoubtedly it would be different with us; undoubtedly one human idea would contradict another and that which was light one or two or six years ago would be regarded as DARKNESS; but with God there is no variableness, neither shadow of turning, and so it is with truth; any knowledge or light coming from God must be like its author. A new view of truth never can contradict a former truth. "New light" never extinguishes older "light," but adds to it. (Zion's Watch Tower, February 1881, (p..3).

  • Scorpion
    Scorpion

    Good quote thinker.

    To put faith in an organization like the WTBTS is pure spiritual suicide. They have had very little right from the beggening. It is a shame that even though facts are presented to the rank and file JW about the shifting tides of the WT, they will still look to the WT and the elders for guidance. It shows how much Satan has really blinded the minds of those that do not wish to believe but chose to stay in the blinded state they are in.

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