by Schizm 137 Replies latest jw friends
Eternal Life On Earth? God told the first human couple their destiny if they disobeyed. He did not discuss their eternal future if they obeyed. -- http://www.commentarypress.com/essay-lifeonearth.htmlThe above statement was made by Raymond Franz--which is the most unreasonable thing I've heard anyone say in my entire life! The man is actually suggesting that the Bible holds no sure promise of living forever on planet Earth.
Just for you Funky.
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Actually, Raymond just "shot his wad" insofar as future book sales. Once people get a whiff of things such as this that he's said they won't trust anything else he says.
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Schizm:
Maybe I'm just being stupid (one of us certainly is) but I still don't see where what would have happened to Adam and Eve if they had obeyed was discussed by God. You highlighting what you wrote and think Ray Franz was suggesting doesn't help. Can you - without calling me unreasonable - answer the following questions. They all have yes/no answers:
1. Did God discuss what the eternal future of Adam and Eve would be if they obeyed Him?
2. Is that discussion in the Bible?
3a. (If the answer to Q2 is yes)Where in the Bible?
3b. (If the answer to Q2 is no)How do you know there was such a discussion?
Keep talking, Funky. I'll tell you for sure that you're remarks aren't helping the reputation of this web site.
Now, carry on.
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I think we may be getting bogged down in semantics. To Schizm, "unreasonable" clearly means, "not conforming to my views." Once you understand the definition of the word, that should clear things right up. You are all being totally unreasonable.
SNG
SNG,
You are all being totally unreasonable.
That's a lie!
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Schizm:
Keep talking, Funky. I'll tell you for sure that you're remarks aren't helping the reputation of this web site.
Whatever. Maybe it's a cultural thing, or maybe it's semantics as SNG said, but I really don't see your point and can't understand why you can't see mine. It would help me greatly to understand you if you answered the questions I asked. Do you have some objection to doing that?
This has thus far been quite entertaining. Reminds me a bit of one of Hibiscusfire's threads.
I want to make clear that I am not contradicting Schizm's position that the Bible allows for belief in eternal life. I do, however, agree that the sole reasoning he supplies is not convincing. That God told Adam and Eve they would "positively die" upon eating the forbidden fruit does not conclusively prove that he intended they live forever. Though he might have. For instance, Paul stated that it was through one man that sin and death entered the world. To me, that (at least) suggests that Paul believed death came only as a result of Adamic sin.
Schizm, with a little thought, you could put together a fairly good argument for your position. But your sarcasm and gratuitous assertions do little to advance it. Simply acting all shocked and incredulous at Ray Franz's words will prove nothing.
Uh, lest anyone misunderstand, the only unreasonable person I see here is Schizm, with his obviously skewed definition of the word.
I just thought it was funny that in Schizm's world, anyone that doesn't agree with him is "unreasonable." Sounds a lot like the JWs...
SNG
Schizm's words so far, seem to be for the purpose of annoying us here, no real point to be made.
First of all the Genesis account is bullshit anyway, just myths reworded, second, what sin did animals commit since they get sick and die. I think that this world we live is such that everything has its cycles, we are born, grow, and eventually die, none live forever, why should man? I believe we go into another realm when we die, but that's just me, you are free to believe whatever you want.
IC
