Thirdwitness -- An Agent of the Governing Body?

by AlanF 156 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • AlanF
    AlanF

    Thirdwitness -- An Agent of the Governing Body?

    This evening I was talking with an old friend about recent postings on this forum by JW defenders. We concluded that something unusual is going on. Consider that on July 28, thirdwitness posted three new topics dear to the hearts of JW critics: on the Society's involvement with the UN, on 607 and Watchtower chronology (the original poster seems to have been an igniter), and on the "faithful and discreet slave". Also, listen posted a new topic defending the Society's child abuse policy.

    It occurred to us that we may be seeing the beginning of a covert effort on the part of certain Watchtower officials -- perhaps even Governing Body members -- to counter the effects that JW critics on the Internet have had in bringing to light the Watchtower Society's many failings. It may be that some 'young' bucks have been assigned or given the go-ahead to get on the Net and post defenses of various Watchtower doctrines and practices, and especially the ones that JW critics have been so successful in criticizing. Perhaps these guys are Bethel whiz-kids, perhaps passionate non-Bethelites. Whoever they are, they certainly seem to have the Society's backing.

    Why do I say that they seem to have the Society's backing? First, because some of the posts contain claims that directly contradict published Watchtower doctrine, and a normal JW would never think of doing this, but one given the green light by a covert Bethel connection would not fear to do it. Second, the posts on the UN and child abuse are slick, well written and well researched -- albeit roundly dishonest in leaving out crucial information that would disprove their theses if included -- and this implies that a great deal of time had to be spent in researching them. The posts contain material that would be extremely hard to come by unless the writers were Watchtower insiders. Third, the writers' style is very reminiscent of that of Watchtower writers, who are past masters at making nonsense sound plausible on a quick reading. Fourth, because of the timing. This summer's district assemblies have loudly proclaimed that "the end is near!" -- much louder than the Society has proclaimed in the last decade or so, and it's pretty obvious that this is an extremely stupid tactical move by Watchtower leaders, because when next year rolls around and nothing has happened, how are they going to explain the great buildup of expectations? -- and this summer could be considered as a good opportunity for some 'young' JW Turks to sally forth in defense of the Mother Ship. When I say 'young', I mean in terms of the Bethel hierarchy, where anyone under 50 is considered young.

    The last fifteen years have seen the death of many long time Watchtower policy makers. With their deaths, a new generation of leaders is gradually coming into power and influence, especially under the influence of that arch-conservative Ted Jaracz. Jaracz and his cronies appear to be singularly unaware that certain critical Watchtower doctrines and practices have no support in the Bible or in terms of secular arguments, and they seem to have lost a sense of history in terms of proclaiming "the end is near". It makes sense that normal people would avoid such a proclamation, but the present JW leadership is far from normal. They've lost the experience and perspective of the previous generation of JW leaders, and so it seems logical that such new leaders might attempt to defend "the faith" aggressively, and combine it with a proclamation that "the end is near".

    Any such defense would have to be covert, in the sense that whatever GB member or WTS official leading the charge, or giving the green light, would have to keep all connections to those in the field secret from other JWs. This would be necessary because the Society has directly instructed JWs to avoid the Internet at all costs. It is also a WTS tradition that only those directly appointed by it are allowed to publish public defenses.

    Given the above, I have a strong suspicion that thirdwitness and his collaborators are either Bethelites, or JWs with extremely close ties to Bethel, or both, all of whom have been given the green light by Watchtower officials to get on the Internet and do battle with JW critics.

    Unfortunately, these defenders have bitten off more than they can chew. Having been steeped in the JW cult for a long time, they've lost the power for independent thought. They think that whatever nonsense the Society puts out should be accepted on the authority of the Society alone. They think that facts are there only to support the Society's claims, and when the facts don't fit, they follow the Society's tradition of ignoring them. They've made an extreme tactical blunder in posting their defenses on a open forum, where critics pay no attention to the Society's claims of authority, and deal with the facts. These defenders simply aren't used to getting their asses kicked in doctrinal debates, because in the JW world, debate does not occur.

    What do you think?

    AlanF

  • Skimmer
    Skimmer

    Would it not be interesting to track the locations of the IP addresses of these posters?

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat

    Nice

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat

    Nice idea, but no cigar.

    There is a precedent for this sort of thing though. Remember Nelson Herle and his defense of the Witnesses' Christology, and John 1:1 in particular? His arguments were later incorporated into the 1984 reference Bible Appendix.

    Then again, just because the Society says Witnesses should not defend the religion independently does not mean some don't do it anyhow.

    And apologists are not averse to sacrificing small points of detail in disagreeing with the Society over something minor in order to defend something fundamental.

    Slim

  • avengers
    avengers

    Hello Alan.

    Some deductions you made. WOW!

    the posts on the UN and child abuse are slick, well written and well researched -- albeit roundly dishonest in leaving out crucial information that would disprove their theses if included

    I read the articles these guys wrote. When I was reading them I thought at first that they were quoting the WT.
    I started realizing though that these are their own words, well written and in the exact same style as the Watchtower's writings..
    I'm not a very good writer and I make a lot of mistakes in my grammar. These guys though are good.

    As to what you say here Alan.

    It occurred to us that we may be seeing the beginning of a covert effort on the part of certain Watchtower officials -- perhaps even Governing Body members -- to counter the effects that JW critics on the Internet have had in bringing to light the Watchtower Society's many failings. It may be that some 'young' bucks have been assigned or given the go-ahead to get on the Net and post defenses of various Watchtower doctrines and practices, and especially the ones that JW critics have been so successful in criticizing. Perhaps these guys are Bethel whiz-kids, perhaps passionate non-Bethelites. Whoever they are, they certainly seem to have the Society's backing.

    You might be right. Here's a quote from ThirdWitness:

    But further research into this matter of the WTS and their child abuse policy has revealed the truth about our policy

    You don't hear the R&Fsay things like "further research into this matter" and "our policy"

    Maybe I'm wrong, I don't know, but when it looks like a dog, acts like a dog, smells like a dog, maybe it is a dog.

    It would be fun to find out who these guys are. Just for fun, because the value of the articles posted is zero.
    I don't think anybody on this DB with an inquiring mind buys into this well-written crap.

    Personally I think these kind of WT apologists are making fools of themselves.

    just my 2 cents.

    Andy

  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    They are very much in damage control mode at the moment, so you may well be right on the button with your suggestion.

    Buy now, these posters will know that their position is dishonest (if they didn't already know that). You can't come up with well written arguements if you are completely brain dead.

    The GB have been making mistakes of judgement lately. Re-studying Rev Climax with updates that highlight the sillyness in the original is a classic one.

    Methinks these mistakes are the result of a wee tinge of panic.

    Thanks for your thoughts Alan.

    Cheers

    Chris

  • KW13
    KW13

    Both he and scholar have similar styles in posting. although they both appear intelligent and possibly even concerned about one thing 'sharing the truth' they are obviously biased for the Watchtower.

    Both ignore big facts and questions that dont suit them, how is this right?

    I get the impression, if they've been instructed to do anything on this and other sites, then they are also instructed not to get into deep arguments but rather just put the information out there in hope it will catch peoples eyes.

    I've done some research with Google - thirdwitness (otherwise known as 3rdwitness) has been at several sites trying to post the same things.

  • Dismembered
    Dismembered

    Greetings AlanF,

    I just hope you continue in your challenges. It's amazing who you, Jeffro, and Hillary are "smoking out".

    Keep the fire burning!

    Dismembered

  • Scully
    Scully

    Alan,

    If your friend is who I think it is, then that person has a great deal of personal knowledge regarding how the WTS works - including tactics that have been used historically by the WTS / Bethel to discredit critics.

    The idea that the WTS would "assign" Bethelites to post articles of this nature for the sole purpose of causing lurking JWs to doubt the veracity of exJWs' experiences regarding child sexual abuse, the research regarding 607 BCE, the blood transfusion ban, etc. is not that far fetched. Our friend's assessment of these individuals as WT moles is incredibly perceptive, and could only come from someone who intimately knows the inner workings of the WT monster.

    Cheers, Scully

    PS: Just because the IP addresses don't resolve to a location in Brooklyn, NY, doesn't mean that isn't where these people are located. After all, even JR Brown admitted (regarding the Jesus Manuel Cano scandal) that anyone can have an internet connection from their room in Bethel residences. ISPs such as AOL and RoadRunner all resolve to the respective head office addresses, regardless of the members' actual physical/geographical location. (Let the reader use discernment.) It's not that much of a stretch to reach the conclusion that individuals involved in these kinds of activities would take advantage of that fact to obfuscate their locations.

  • jayhawk1
    jayhawk1

    No doubt you bring up a strong possibility. Certainly the Society would have lurkers here, so why not have posters as well. I do see a fatal flaw in doing so, if they don't at least attempt to answer direct questioning, it shows large holes in their arguements. There seems to be an air of frustration coming from posters like thirdwitness and scholar because they can't answer every question honestly.

    Hopefully some webmaster guru can track down the IP address and see if it leads to a Watchtower computer. That would be interesting one way or another.

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