New JW phrase: bouquet of truth

by ohnightdivine in

i heard it from someone who attended the latest wt study, and quickly posted it with - you guessed it - a picture of a lovely flower bouquet.

.

"how big is your bouquet of truth?".

jonahstourguide

WooHoo

DATA-DOG wins the eternal meat tray and carton of the best beers for winning the un-challengeable challenge. Even before any potential losers accept

jtg

2

GB of catholic church in USA

by jonahstourguide in

hi all, spotted this in australia abc news.

i doubt the gb of jwism will follow suit,, hmmmm.. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahukewjmg8ro6txfahuffnakhfuwbheqxfqbmab6bagaeam&url=https%3a%2f%2fwww.abc.net.au%2fnews%2f2019-01-04%2fus-catholic-church-names-over-1000-priests-in-sex-abuse-cases%2f10683870&usg=aovvaw19gyjg2hp7aj9jdbjv4i6m.

us catholic church names more than 1,000 priests accused of child sex abuseupdated fri at 6:57am catholic church interiorphoto: more than half of the 187 dioceses in the us have released the details of abuse cases.

jonahstourguide

Hi All, spotted this in Australia abc news. I doubt the gb of jwism will follow suit,, hmmmm.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjMg8ro6tXfAhUFfnAKHfuwBhEQxfQBMAB6BAgAEAM&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.abc.net.au%2Fnews%2F2019-01-04%2Fus-catholic-church-names-over-1000-priests-in-sex-abuse-cases%2F10683870&usg=AOvVaw19GYjg2hp7aj9jDbJv4i6m

US Catholic Church names more than 1,000 priests accused of child sex abuse
Updated Fri at 6:57am

Catholic church interior
PHOTO: More than half of the 187 dioceses in the US have released the details of abuse cases. (Flickr: Greg Westfall)
RELATED STORY: Priests in Pennsylvania have sexually abused hundreds of children since the 1950s: reportRELATED STORY: Pope Francis praises resigning US Cardinal amid sexual abuse cover-up allegationsRELATED STORY: Pope accepts Cardinal McCarrick resignation following sex abuse scandal
Over the past four months, Roman Catholic dioceses across the US have released the names of more than 1,000 priests and others accused of sexually abusing children in an unprecedented public reckoning.

Key points:

The recently disclosed accusations date back six or seven decades, the earliest in 1910
Most of the priests were long ago removed from ministry and the statute of limitations on their cases has run out
Experts praised the release but said more needs to be done to hold abusive priests accountable
Nearly 50 dioceses and religious orders have publicly identified child-molesting priests in the wake of the Pennsylvania report issued in mid-August, and 55 more have announced plans to do the same over the next few months.

Together they account for more than half of the nation's 187 dioceses.

The Associated Press also found nearly 20 local, state or federal investigations, either criminal or civil, have also been launched since the release of the Pennsylvania grand jury findings.

Those investigations could lead to more names and more damning accusations, as well as fines against dioceses and court-ordered safety measures.

The Pennsylvania investigation, led by state Attorney-General Josh Shapiro, identified nearly 300 "predator priests" dating back seven decades and accused church leaders of covering up abuse, in some cases by returning priests to duty after short stays in treatment centres or by reassigning them.

Advocates said the report had a big impact because it was the largest to date in scope, encompassing most of the state.

"People saw what happened in these parishes in Pennsylvania and said, 'That happened in my parish too'," said Tim Lennon, national president of the board of the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests, or SNAP.

"They could see the immediate connection, and they are demanding the same accounting."
Space to play or pause, M to mute, left and right arrows to seek, up and down arrows for volume.

VIDEO: Pennsylvania victims were silenced by 'weaponisation of faith' (ABC News)
The recently disclosed accusations date back six or seven decades in some cases, with the oldest from the 1910s in Louisiana.

Most of the priests were long ago removed from ministry.

An Associated Press examination found that more than 60 per cent are dead and in most cases, the statute of limitations for bringing criminal charges or suing has run out.

Nevertheless, advocates say exposing molesters nearly two decades after the scandal first erupted in Boston in 2002 is an encouraging step, in part because it gives some victims a sense of vindication after decades of official silence or denials.

Also, it could increase pressure on dioceses to set up victims' compensation funds, as the church has done in Pennsylvania already, and it could result in the removal of molesters from positions outside the church that give them access to children.

"This is a milestone," said Joe McLean, who filed a lawsuit with other victims seeking to compel the US Conference of Catholic Bishops to release files on alleged abusers nationwide.

"We are getting closer and closer to what this ought to be, the true coming to terms that would have to be at a national level."
Pope Francis calls for unity in US church

Cardinal Wuerl stands smiling next to Pope Francis.
PHOTO: Cardinal Donald Wuerl (left, with Pope Francis in 2015), was named 200 times in the Pennsylvania grand jury report. (AP: David Goldman)
In his Christmas address last month, Pope Francis made an unprecedented call for priests who had abused children to turn themselves in and vowed the church would "never again" hide their crimes. The world's bishops will hold a summit at the Vatican next month to forge a comprehensive response to the crisis.

Pope Francis has since called on the US church to show unity as it tries to tackle a sexual abuse crisis, saying internal bickering had to end over the scandal which has decimated the credibility of the American Church.

In a long and highly unusual letter sent as US bishops started a week-long retreat to reflect on the spreading crisis, the Pope said the handling of the scandal showed the urgent need for a new approach to management and mindset within the church.

"God's faithful people and the church's mission continue to suffer greatly as a result of abuses of power and conscience and sexual abuse, and the poor way that they were handled," the Pope wrote, adding bishops had "concentrated more on pointing fingers than on seeking paths of reconciliation".

"The church's credibility has been seriously undercut and diminished by these sins and crimes, but even more by the efforts made to deny or conceal them."
Details released vary across dioceses

The biggest list of names has come from the Jesuits West Province, a religious order that encompasses nine Western states. It identified 111 priests.

The New Orleans archdiocese and the diocese of Syracuse, New York, named 61 and 57 respectively.

The Great Falls-Billings, Montana, diocese disclosed 47 names, including those of a few nuns, while the Los Angeles archdiocese reported more than 50 from the past decade or so.

Some dioceses, like Peoria, Illinois, released only names with no information on the allegations or the church's response.

Others detailed such things as parish assignments, numbers and dates of allegations — including an Omaha priest with 20 to 35 accusations against him — and attempts at treatment, restriction and punishment.

In the 16 years between the Boston scandal and the Pennsylvania investigation, only about 30 dioceses around the country had released lists of priests they deemed credibly accused of abuse.

Shining the Spotlight

US journalist Walter Robinson was part of the Boston Globe's Spotlight team which uncovered widespread sexual abuse by priests. Here's how he took on the Catholic Church.
Most of those dioceses came clean because they were forced to do so by lawsuits or bankruptcy filings.

Some dioceses declined to name any deceased priests, since they could not defend themselves, and some would not identify any clergy members at all.

While praising the release of names, many experts said the lists were often incomplete.

Terence McKiernan, co-director of BishopAccountability.org, which has tracked abuse for more than a decade, said many dioceses have left off names of known abusers his group has published in its online database.

"It's not enough," Pennsylvania's Mr Shapiro agreed.

"I do not believe that the church is capable of policing itself though. They need outside forces, ideally law enforcement, to hold them accountable."
Mr Shapiro said he has spoken to 45 other attorneys-general since his report, and 14 had publicly acknowledged some form of investigation.

jtg

sorry folks cant get the link to work.

43

Is A Major Restructuring At Warwick In The Works Due To Years Of Governing Body Ignorance & Delusion?

by Brokeback Watchtower in

the possible financial ruin to which faithful & discreet slave/governing body has brought wt corporation, due to all the underhanded/illegal/thoughtless policies as g.o.d(guardians of doctrine) seems to be a very real possibility, as court cases mount against the wt and it's different corporations.. montana just gave a very clear $$$$30million+ shout out to wt, about it's fucked up policies, which lay at the feet of those in charge.

it seems that some type of no confidence should be expressed and a complete over haul should be happening.

they can not keep this information secret any more and they are totally delusional ass holes if they think they can talk their way out of this.. therefore i think we shall see some desperate measures to keep this fraudulent organization financially stable and a removal from power those responsible for the mess..

jonahstourguide

Right on smiddy3.

I'm in a cong of 130. they send about $1500 Au dollars each month to 'bethel oz'.

So afta some serious sock removing maths, I figure they're getting $2:80 per pub per week.

This is a Melbourne western suburbs working class area with quite a few refugees etc.

I'm sure the 'wealthy' side of town kicks in a few extra bucks.

In fact a associate often rambles how the C.O.'s love the east side of Melbourne,,,,, bigger green handshakes.

It's all about da cash.

My two bob's worth

jtg

13

Capitalizing names

by john.prestor in

just a random thought here but does anyone else notice than when the name "elder" or "circuit overseer" appears in the organization's magazines and books they're always lower case even though they're proper nouns and should be elder and circuit overseer... but branch committee member, governing body helper, governing body member, they get to be capitalized.

another subtle indication of how the governing body and other high-ranking elites see themselves, i think.

.

jonahstourguide

Yep, total bullshit.
jtg

6

New Year's Day Party

by Giordano in

for what it's worth:.

we just held our 3rd annual new year's day party.. we kept the list down to thirty invites this year with the provision that they could bring guests.

so the final count was well up there.

jonahstourguide

That's a fabulous read. Thank you. It's as it should be.

jtg

4

So I'm Wondering.

by jonahstourguide in

by the way, happy new year to all.. so, i'm wondering, if all the current global population converted to jwism what would happen to the approximately 300,000 births and 150,000 daily deaths?.

and, where are the 'false gods' today and where is yahweh nowadays?.

just my mind wanderings.. oh, and if the governing body has the global solution, why aren't they preaching to world leaders directly?

jonahstourguide

By the way, Happy new year to all.

So, I'm wondering, if all the current global population converted to jwism what would happen to the approximately 300,000 births and 150,000 daily deaths?. And, where are the 'false gods' today and where is yahweh nowadays?

just my mind wanderings.

Oh, and if the governing body has the global solution, why aren't they preaching to world leaders directly? Like, you know, lobbying as Paul did when he went to Caesar?.

jtg

Bugger it, I'm gonna mow the lawn instead and have a refreshing beer thereafter.

43

Is A Major Restructuring At Warwick In The Works Due To Years Of Governing Body Ignorance & Delusion?

by Brokeback Watchtower in

the possible financial ruin to which faithful & discreet slave/governing body has brought wt corporation, due to all the underhanded/illegal/thoughtless policies as g.o.d(guardians of doctrine) seems to be a very real possibility, as court cases mount against the wt and it's different corporations.. montana just gave a very clear $$$$30million+ shout out to wt, about it's fucked up policies, which lay at the feet of those in charge.

it seems that some type of no confidence should be expressed and a complete over haul should be happening.

they can not keep this information secret any more and they are totally delusional ass holes if they think they can talk their way out of this.. therefore i think we shall see some desperate measures to keep this fraudulent organization financially stable and a removal from power those responsible for the mess..

jonahstourguide

I agree with Brokeback Watchtower.

If a pimo rank and filer, I, can see it and some of my undecided pimi can also look with disbelief at what I show them (and, we ain't no lawyers). What do legal eagles see??. A fair bit of bullshit I reckon.

jtg

15

2 BOE's--Atlantis!

by Atlantis in

one of these boes is ( old news ), the london letter on the annual totals, and the other concerns pioneering in 2019. just for your records.. .

https://transfer.pcloud.com/download.html?code=5zowyx7zcrnigmamezkzadcbzehe7xedeley1uityg5jwpjr0dwyx.

atlantis!.

jonahstourguide

Much appreciated. Thank you Atlantis.

13

April 2019 Watchtower article 'Uphold the TRUTH about death'

by Listener in

it appears this study article has been written because the organization is still having trouble teaching african jws that they are not to follow their traditional customs when someone dies and not to believe in spirits.it has been speculated for some time that it is african jws that have attributed to the increase in 'anointed' partakers.interestingly, no-where in this article does it even mention their two class system and the anointed having a heavenly hope.

it is amazing that they title the article as upholding the truth about death and fail to mention their two hope doctrine.the following are some quotes -.

satan, “the father of the lie,” has deceived people since the start of human history.

jonahstourguide

Yes indeed. In answer to smiddy3.

There are no deeper doctrines. There is no intrinsic substance to the 'current understanding' bullshit.

Types and anti-types got flushed down the dunny,, about 43 of them at last count.

I can now say that even though I'm not fit to tie a scholars boot or sandal lace, I have "perused" the bible as we have it and am convinced that no logical, reasoning, sane human (please accept this as a bit of a rant) could put faith in a book written in a lost language with so many options for translating any particular word or phrase. The so-called exegesis of scripture is up for criticism for that in itself. Then we get to the eisegesis of particular translators to support their view. Twisting words.

And then there's the nwt study bible bullshit study notes and added footnotes which are more often than not quotes of Barnes, Gill et al Worldly scholars ruled by Satan...ha ha hilarious in my view. Guys that support the trinity teaching,,,,well, many of those scholars quoted by wt did. Classic cherry-picking at it's best.

Yes, take the bible for what it is and has and keep your wallet tight in your back pocket. Remember the words of the predecessors ,,,, "Religion is a snare and a racket" In any guise I add.

The so called moral lessons therein are no more than reminders of the moral conscience that resides in all humans and even some animals ( I dunno, but sometimes the animal world exhibits behaviours that we might do well to emulate) and It's up to us if we choose to use that faculty or not.

jtg

P.S. yes The Fall Guy, it is all about 'runs on the board',not real fruitages as you point out.

P.P.S. I didn't intend to deviate from the OP ,,,, It's frustrating at times. Yes they have a problem with the cultures mentioned in the OP. We see it here in Oz where quite a few of them are turning up with 'suspect' recommendations from their homeland.

jtg

6

The Vatican`s third ranking highest official Convicted Of Sexual Assault

by smiddy3 in

australian cardinal george pell, the vatican's third-highest ranking official, was convicted of sexual assault by a victoria court on december 11, 2018.. but australian media aren't reporting on the trial or its outcome.

despite pell's mammoth status in the catholic church and as a public figure, his trial has been held in secret, following a victorian county court suppression order that applies australia-wide.

it was imposed after the court accepted that knowledge of the accused's identity in the first trial might prejudice a further trial being held in march.. i believe this suppression order only applies to australia whereas this case may have been reported upon overseas ?

jonahstourguide

I'm trying to cut and paste what I found smiddy3.

Cardinal Pell found guilty of sex abuse, expected to appeal, reports say

Dec 12, 2018

by Catholic News Service

Accountability

20181212T1214-22929-CNS-PELL-TRIAL c.jpg

Australian Cardinal George Pell leaves the Melbourne Magistrates Court Oct. 6. (CNS/Mark Dadswell, Reuters)

Melbourne, Australia — Australian Cardinal George Pell reportedly has been found guilty on five charges related to serious sexual misconduct involving two boys at St. Patrick's Cathedral in Melbourne in the 1990s.

Support independent Catholic journalism. Become an NCR Forward member for $5 a month.

The trial, the specific charges, the testimony and almost all other details involving the accusations against the 77-year-old cardinal are covered by a court-issued "super injunction," which forbids all media in Australia from reporting on it.

Pell is expected to appeal the conviction.

Sources said Pell pleaded not guilty to all charges but was found guilty Dec. 11 by a jury of 12 people, who delivered a unanimous verdict, as required by Victoria state statutes; the jury had deliberated for more than three days.

The trial took place before Judge Peter Kidd of the County Court of the State of Victoria; it was one of two trials Pell is reportedly facing on accusations of abuse that allegedly occurred in the 1970s and in the 1990s.

Following a monthlong pretrial hearing in May, the court ordered Pell to stand trial on multiple charges of sexual abuse of minors, charges the cardinal consistently denied. The trial was split in two: one for the events in Melbourne in 1990s and one for the events in Ballarat in 1970s.

The first trial, for the Melbourne events, began in August, but resulted in a hung jury, sources said.

One of the alleged survivors has died since the events and the other gave evidence via video link to the court. Neither has been named.

Lawyers for Pell, led by Robert Richter, are understood to have indicated they will appeal, but that would take place after the cardinal is sentenced in February. The second trial, focusing on the alleged events in Ballarat, reportedly will begin in March.

Catholic News Service was told that Australian media organizations are petitioning the court to release details of the trial and verdict. The court had issued the gag order to "prevent a real and substantial risk of prejudice to the proper administration of justice."

Although some of the initial charges brought by prosecutors were dismissed, including what Pell's lawyer described as the most "vile," Magistrate Belinda Wallington announced May 1 that she believed there was enough evidence presented in connection with about half the original charges to warrant a full trial.

Pell was appointed head of the Vatican Secretariat for the Economy by Pope Francis in 2014 but took a leave of absence from his position in mid-2017 to face the charges. His lawyer told the court May 1 that he had already surrendered his passport.

Before leaving Rome, Pell had told reporters at a Vatican news conference, "I'm innocent of these charges. They are false. The whole idea of sexual abuse is abhorrent to me.

"These matters have been under investigation now for two years," Pell told the press. "There's been relentless character assassination, a relentless character assassination."

Following his time as archbishop of Melbourne, 1996-2001, Pell was named archbishop of Sydney in 2001. He was made a cardinal by St. John Paul II in 2003 and is, at present, the only Australian cardinal.

Pell has been an important and, at times, polarizing figure in Australia. Supporters say his opposition to abortion and gay marriage have made him many enemies, and they believe that while he was archbishop of Melbourne he was the first bishop in the country to proactively address the clergy sex abuse issue.

A version of this story appeared in the Dec 28, 2018-Jan 10, 2019 print issue under the headline: Cardinal Pell found guilty of sex abuse, reports say .

jonahstourguide

Posts by jonahstourguide

Cardinal Pell found guilty of sex abuse, expected to appeal, reports say