Posts by Daniel1555

21

Interview with an Apostate: OnTheWayOut

by OnTheWayOut in

tell us a little about yourself and your family.. my mother joined the frenzy when the end of the world was coming in 1975. her sister-in-law was first recruited and got her in.

when the end didnt come, mom was disfellowshipped shortly afterward, but she went back a few years later.

i did not care to go with her.

Daniel1555

dear OTWO

Thanks so much.

I always enjoy reading your truly reasonable posts. They already helped much for me.

Daniel

75

I told the elders that I would take blood and donate blood

by Daniel1555 in

i found it important to be honest with my wife.

so i told her about my conscience decision that in a medical urgency i want blodless medicine but if a transfusion of blood or the 4 prohibited components is necessary to save my life or health i would accept it.

this would apply especially also for our child (that is not such a problem as in our country the wts recommends to comply with doctors as they have the right to decide concerning minors).. i showed her the reasons why i came to that conscience decision (biblical and logical reasons) and that jehovah and jesus do not like anyone to die because of this wrong bible application.. .

Daniel1555

Rebel8: By reading JWN it's without doubt table of demons. Well, he means any kind of information apart from WT.

75

I told the elders that I would take blood and donate blood

by Daniel1555 in

i found it important to be honest with my wife.

so i told her about my conscience decision that in a medical urgency i want blodless medicine but if a transfusion of blood or the 4 prohibited components is necessary to save my life or health i would accept it.

this would apply especially also for our child (that is not such a problem as in our country the wts recommends to comply with doctors as they have the right to decide concerning minors).. i showed her the reasons why i came to that conscience decision (biblical and logical reasons) and that jehovah and jesus do not like anyone to die because of this wrong bible application.. .

Daniel1555

Konceptual

Thanks very much for your points. I am curious if they leave me like this. Maybe another elder will urge them to talk to me again this time by 2 elders, I don't know. I am also wondering if to have the conviction of unrepentantly taking blood would be action enough to disassociate by action. I think I will soon find out.

75

I told the elders that I would take blood and donate blood

by Daniel1555 in

i found it important to be honest with my wife.

so i told her about my conscience decision that in a medical urgency i want blodless medicine but if a transfusion of blood or the 4 prohibited components is necessary to save my life or health i would accept it.

this would apply especially also for our child (that is not such a problem as in our country the wts recommends to comply with doctors as they have the right to decide concerning minors).. i showed her the reasons why i came to that conscience decision (biblical and logical reasons) and that jehovah and jesus do not like anyone to die because of this wrong bible application.. .

Daniel1555

So I had the meeting with only 1 elder (it was originally planned with 2 elders. He couldn't find a second one who had time (maybe those that had time were not in a mood for a blood discussion).

I must say the elder who talked with me (COBE) is a very loving and caring person. His intention is not to have me df or da.

We discussed some reasons why I believe a blood transfusion in a life threatening situation is not contradicting the scriptures (1. Cor. 10:25-28, Lev. 17:15-16, Matth 12) and things I find illogical concerning fractions.

He kind of objected that I am just picking the things from the scriptures because I want to have a guarantee for life.

I stated a few times that I think to refuse it is against the sanctity of life.

I read Matth 12 and asked how would Jesus react today in a life threatening medical situation?

We also talked about why ultraorthodox jews accept a blood transfusion because in there eyes it is not nourishment.

He said that there are several interpretations of the scriptures. So I stressed that I feel the interpretation of the organisation is wrong.

During the discussion he said once "but you can't be a witness and think like this."

I asked him how he would react if the fds would in future allow the components? He said he can't answer that question.

I explained that I don't want to refuse a treatment which might be accepted in the future by the fds. Moreover I have to follow my conscience and not an interpretation of men.

He couldn't answer why white blood cells are prohibited whereas they are in mothers milk.

He answered why large fractions like hemoglobin is permitted and smaller components are prohibited just by saying "because it is a fraction."

He was worried because I don't find a blood donation is against the bible.

He kind of understood that I feel this is hypocritical to just take it but not give it. This he couldn't deny.

I made it clear that I have to follow my conscience and it would mean for me to be bloodguilty if I refused life saving treatment.

Finally he mentioned 2 points.

We can not be eating from table of demons (as I was eating from that table).

We should not be driven by doubts (I said I have no doubts about that topic).

He mentioned that I want a guarantee for life but instead we should lay our lives into Jehovah's hands.

He will talk to the other elders about our talk.

75

I told the elders that I would take blood and donate blood

by Daniel1555 in

i found it important to be honest with my wife.

so i told her about my conscience decision that in a medical urgency i want blodless medicine but if a transfusion of blood or the 4 prohibited components is necessary to save my life or health i would accept it.

this would apply especially also for our child (that is not such a problem as in our country the wts recommends to comply with doctors as they have the right to decide concerning minors).. i showed her the reasons why i came to that conscience decision (biblical and logical reasons) and that jehovah and jesus do not like anyone to die because of this wrong bible application.. .

Daniel1555

Paralipomenon: Thanks for your goog idea. I already sent a letter 2 months ago not exactly with what you suggested but with some very hard questions. I didnt get a reply. 3 years ago I sent another letter about an easier subject. They replied quite fast. Either they don't answer or they answer the CO or body of elders to tell me. Any way thid morning i will meet with the elders. I will tell you how it goes (maybe in the evening or tomorrow).

17

Circuit Assembly Questions

by DATA-DOG in

i have to go to the ca this weekend for family reasons... the only bright side is that i may spot some hypocrisy to share with others.

if my suffering helps just one person then it's worth the effort.

i know why the caged bird sings... .

Daniel1555

DD

I also have to endure these boring 2 days this weekend. I will think of you when I m there.

53

I am free!!! What Shall I do on this Meeting Night?

by KateWild in

jw
friends

so i am at a loose end tonight.

i am not going to the meeting and sitting on the back row looking repentant no way!.

here are some options... care to add some if you wish, help me to decide.. 1. go to the meeting and sit in the middle, reading "einstein and religion" paperback, go in early and stay after the prayer.

Daniel1555

Before you go bowling watch "The Big Lebowsky." Don't worry too much like the Dude.

Go to a fitnesscenter with sauna. Exercise is great and reduces stress. If you don't like to train just relax in the sauna.

If you want to do something good for human rights the planet or community join an amnesty international or greenpeace group.

In all of this you meet new people.

75

I told the elders that I would take blood and donate blood

by Daniel1555 in

i found it important to be honest with my wife.

so i told her about my conscience decision that in a medical urgency i want blodless medicine but if a transfusion of blood or the 4 prohibited components is necessary to save my life or health i would accept it.

this would apply especially also for our child (that is not such a problem as in our country the wts recommends to comply with doctors as they have the right to decide concerning minors).. i showed her the reasons why i came to that conscience decision (biblical and logical reasons) and that jehovah and jesus do not like anyone to die because of this wrong bible application.. .

Daniel1555

Syme: thanks for warning me especially of the 2 witness rule. I didn't really think about thsz

75

I told the elders that I would take blood and donate blood

by Daniel1555 in

i found it important to be honest with my wife.

so i told her about my conscience decision that in a medical urgency i want blodless medicine but if a transfusion of blood or the 4 prohibited components is necessary to save my life or health i would accept it.

this would apply especially also for our child (that is not such a problem as in our country the wts recommends to comply with doctors as they have the right to decide concerning minors).. i showed her the reasons why i came to that conscience decision (biblical and logical reasons) and that jehovah and jesus do not like anyone to die because of this wrong bible application.. .

Daniel1555

Problemaddict: Thanks for your points. I wrote them everything you mentioned plus some more reasons. thanks for your care.

16

Transfusion Experience from France

by Bells in

long story short - my in-laws know that i strongly disagree with their blood doctrine.

i received 3rd degree burns as a toddler and without blood, i would have died.

no doubt this is much of the reason that i feel the way i do.. my mil sent me an article, saying that i might find it of interest - in other words, it is an example to 'refute my contradictions about blood transfusions'.

Daniel1555

Bonjour bells

Bloodless medicine is of course recommendable. Most hospitals in Switzerland use alternatives to blood. But of course there are situations where alternatives won't work and only infusions of blood or the components forbidden by wt are saving the life or health of the patient.

Many witnesses believe that it is only because of jw's that there is bloodless medicine. They don't realize that praise for that does not belong to the jw but to the medical community who was searching for ways to save lives, even those who would be ready to sacrifice it for a mistaken doctrine.