And all I can say is sod it to bloody buggery hell!
And I very rarely swear (sorry mum) but I've had it with everyone.
xxR
And all I can say is sod it to bloody buggery hell!
And I very rarely swear (sorry mum) but I've had it with everyone.
xxR
christendom church: what's wrong with this picture?
so, were you considered spiritual?
were they proud of you?
what was your reputation like in your congregation?.
A big-mouthed, opinionated, 'doesn't-know-her-place', brain-dead trouble-maker
xxR
the local needs part dealt with this need.
too many are saying we don't want to confide in the elders and let them shepherd us.
perhaps, if the elders realized that they are nothing but a pain in the butt, they would just leave everybody alone!
Angharad,
You hit the nail on the head! Who needs the newspapers when you have elders wives.
xxR
so, the organization never makes any mistakes, the elders are appointed by god, you should attend all the meetings.
because "it's the truth", blah blah, blah.. .
in my experience, as long as you're not too aggressive about it, there are three serious problems in the organization.
Garybuss,
I understand why you dislike the JW organisation, but you can't dislike all JWs. After all, most on this board were JWs once. I know I was. I still am, technically, as I am not DFd or DAd yet (just a matter of time though). I am not a bad, horrible, evil person. As a practising JW, I didn't want to harm anyone or break up families - I truly believed it was the only acceptable way to please God. When I found out that it wasn't, I opted out. That doesn't make me a bad person. My husband and son are JWs. I love them with all my heart. They are not bad people.
What I was trying to say was that JWs always say that the hatred comes from non-JWs against them. I am saying that it is the other way around. I have never met anyone that HATES JWs just because they happen to be JWs. I don't see this rampant persecution that my husband talks about. I don't see people actively stirring up trouble for JWs - most people I know will talk to them when they call and are polite to them. People on the outside do not know about the corruption or hateful policies so why would they hate JWs or persecute them. I know of some individual JWs who make me sick because they are arrogant and unloving and cruel. I also know of some RCs, C of E people, Muslims, Jews etc who are arrogant and unloving and cruel. That doesn't mean that all people of those religions are bad. We are all individuals.
I hate the WTS and what it does to people. But I don't hate JWs - many are misguided and will end up contributing to a forum like this eventually. I understand that you have suffered at the hands of some JWs, but there are many that are good and kind and are trying to do what is right. These are the ones that will eventually escape the clutches of the WTS and realise that there is a better way to live.
If my husband and son want to carry on as JWs, what right is it of mine to stop them. By doing this, I would be behaving in exactly the same way as the hateful organisation they belong to. I will worship in my way, they can do the same. Everyone has a right to choose. As long as they don't try to force me to join in their form of worship (which hubby does but hopefully he will give up eventually as it will get him nowhere) I won't try to force my views on them. To say that you hate a group of people just because they belong to a certain religion is wrong. Hate the organisation by all means, but don't hate the members, many of whom are too scared to leave for fear of what will happen to them. If you have a partner, children, granchildren etc in the organisation, to leave is a huge wrench and takes a lot of guts and courage because they know they will be shunned by their family and friends. It is a horrible situation to be in.
Just my thoughts
xxR
one of the techniques that the society uses to justify their errors and prophetic failures is the redefinition of words.
when they say something that turns out to be wrong, they merely go back and "clarify" their original statement, showing that what you thought it meant, didnt really mean that at all.
they say that babylon the great has "fallen", yet an objective observer could not in any way say that it fell in 1918. it has more members and wealth than it did 100 years ago.
RunningMan,
I agree with you that the WTS have changed the meaning of the word 'presence'. If you look at Matthew chapter 24, verse 26 says that when Jesus comes, he will not be in the inner chambers. In other words, he will not be hidden. Verse 27 says that his presence will be like lightning and will show up from the eastern parts to the western parts. Well, I don't know about anyone else, but to me that definitely says that his presence will be visible to everyone. I don't know how the WTS can say his presence is invisible when there are many scriptures to prove this just isn't true.
I also find the expression 'present truth' to be hilarous. Something is either the truth, or it isn't. Does 'present truth' mean that the old truth wasn't the truth? If so, it must have been lies. The more I look into their teachings and interpretations of the Bible, the more I realise how stupid I was to go along with it in the first place.
xxR
so, the organization never makes any mistakes, the elders are appointed by god, you should attend all the meetings.
because "it's the truth", blah blah, blah.. .
in my experience, as long as you're not too aggressive about it, there are three serious problems in the organization.
Garybuss,
I am sure I know the scripture you mean - where Jesus says that he did not come to bring peace but to divide mothers, fathers, children etc and if you have greater love for your family than for Jesus, you are not worthy of him. (or something like that) This is the exact same scripture my husband used on me. I posted a query about it to this board and the response was brilliant. My husband implied that by becoming a JW, you were putting yourself at risk of being disowned by your family. He said that being a JW was difficult as you often had to choose between your family and the 'Truth' and you would be persecuted for the rest of your life.
He got it completely wrong! The only ones I know that are forced to choose between their family and the real truth are those that can no longer go on living a lie by remaining a JW. They leave the WTS knowing that they will be either DFd or forced to DA themselves. They know they will be shunned by family and friends and treated like a piece of garbage. They are the ones Jesus was talking about - not JWs at all. I don't know anyone who objects to their family members mixing with JWs or even becoming a JW. JWs are not the poor, persecuted individuals they make themselves out to be. The only ones who are treated badly and persecuted are those that no longer want to be a JW. They are the ones who are treated like dirt.
I don't dislike JWs (I dislike the corrupt organisation though). I don't know anyone who dislikes JWs. I know plenty of people who HATE non-JWs. The ones who are full of hate and venom, who split up families, who think they are better than everyone, who can't bear it if you disagree with them, who hate to see you living a happy life away from the WTS - they are none other than JWs!
I wish I could make my husband understand this.
xxR
remember.........pick your answer before you scroll down.. here it is.
this is a story about a girl.
while at the funeral of her own mother,.
I thought the guy turned out to be her long lost half-brother and she never knew he existed until her mother's funeral. She fell in love with him and her sister objected as this would be incest so she had to kill her sister to shut her up????
Not sure what that makes me!
xxR
i honestly want your answers to the following questions.
(i am trying to find out what jw's think on these things to determine what my parents may say in response if i ask them any of these)
question #1can individuals read & understand the bible alone, or do they need an organization and its publications to do so?
SOJ,
I don't doubt that you really believe what you say. But doesn't it ever occur to you that you and your organisation could be wrong? And even if you are correct, and the WTS is the one true religion (which I find very hard to believe), why do JWs have to make things so unpleasant for those that want to leave?
I have been really sick for the past 2 weeks. I am still feeling really poorly now. An hour ago my husband informed me that some elders will be 'popping' in to see me this week. I was so upset and asked him when they were coming (so I could be out when they come), but he didn't know. Now I am faced with the prospect of having to see people who make me sick and nervous (and I already feel sick and nervous) and I don't even know when they are coming! I have told them before that I don't want to go to meetings at the moment. Why do you and your elders persist even when it is clear that people do not want to know? Why can't we just be left alone? I don't go around to all the JWs in my area, telling them what crap they believe, so why do they feel the need to INSIST that I am wrong and they are right? Who cares?
Don't you see how unbalanced and warped this organisation is? If my husband wants to carry on as a JW, he knows he can and I won't interfere. But he won't let me just get on with my life. He feels he has to make me go back to the KH. The elders say I must go back to the KH. What is it with you people? I realise now why I never fitted in as a JW - I have always been too willing to listen to other people and understand their views and feelings - this is not something you should do as a JW and that is precisely why I was always an outsider. I just couldn't accept (as you do) that I was superior to 'worldly' people and that they would all perish at Armageddon whilst I would be just fine - that is a sick and shameful belief. Why can't you just have your beliefs and let everyone else have theirs? Why do JWs refuse to let people leave their organisation with dignity?
You can go on defending this organisation till the cows come home, but it won't change the facts - it is a cruel, unchristian, unfeeling, warped and sick organisation. Maybe one day you will realise this and escape like the rest of us on this board. Until then, I will pray for you.
xxR
i have been to lots of sales meetings and sales training sessions and they are exactly like the watch tower publishing corporation's franchise book distribution division, jehovah's witnesses, meetings.. .
all the corporation's meetings focus on the books or the writers of the books.
the books are all written about the writers of the books and how all prophecy and all history relates to them.. .
Hi everyone,
It's funny, but I never knew how brainwashed I was until I took a few steps back and looked at the organisation from the outside. I was at a sales meeting the other day (for work purposes) and we were encouraged to always have some company literature with us, just in case somebody wants to know what we do etc etc. It reminded me of the TMS and the way we were always encouraged to have tracts, magazines and brochures with us all the time.
Gary - I like the way you described the meetings and field service - it was spot on! I still can't believe I ever did any of that, and it's not that long ago since I stopped going to meetings. I have been semi-free from the WTS for about 7 months now (I don't think I will ever be fully-free - some of my family are still in) and I am so grateful for finding out the truth about 'The Truth'.
xxR