Yep. I started re-evaluating and checking a lot of stuff for myself too. And as regards Christmas - it is of pagan origins. In fact, Christian denominations only started to "celebrate" Christmas just in the last three centuries or so since it was looked down upon as riddled with pagan and wordly customs.
Posts by Roddy
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31Christmas...pagan? or non-pagan?
by FreedomFrog ini just read a thread where one of the posters was saying christmas is not pagan.
from my research and what i remember reading up on it, it was taken from the pagans.. let me explain.
first, i apologize because i researched this about 4 years ago and i don't have all of my research material at hand.
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6
Seven years left to 2014!
by Roddy ini haven't been on the board for a while and i haven't been following the jws closely for a while either.
but it doesn't mean i'm not curious.
i've just been very busy.
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Roddy
My answer: Eight years to 2015 and yet another potential embarrassment. Then they will wipe it out like they did for 1975 and focus on 2034. Then they will have that bust when 2035 comes without incident. And then they will have to think of some way to pull out another date, perhaps using 1971 instead of 1914 as the Beginning of the End date and plugging in 2051. From there, they could run this up to 2091, pulling dates out of their magic hat only to have the following year come without incident.
Yeah. I figure the infamous 1914 date will just no longer enjoy any air time and will just fade away. When I was really active with the JWs it was more you had to pay attention as to what was being said and notice what is not emphasised anymore. When a prior teaching is either superseded or quietly dropped, it's "old light". Every time that happened I just had a gut feeling something was wrong. Anyway, I was just wondering if the JWs are now evolving into the mainline. I'm also curious if the rank and file are a bit more tolerant, especially since the Old Guard are basically either died-off or have gone senile. It has to dawn upon them by now that the past predictions and teachings were not true. I'm curious. What are these new 2035, 2051, and 2091 dates all about? What's their background? Thanks in advance for such info. I'm sure there is a funny story behind each of them. Considering all the fiascos they had with date setting before, haven't they learned their lession yet?
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How to stump someone that believes the noah's flood happened.
by 5go inone of the key peices of evidence that people sight to try to prove the flood happen is the fact the most cultures have a flood myth or story as they put it.. i was just watching a program that also points out the most, if not all cultures believe in dragons.
even cultures that evolve in isolation have beliefs in dragons and they are all simular though not the same.
just like the flood myth.. so if they believe the flood happened because so many cultures have flood stories.
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Roddy
So if they believe the flood happened because so many cultures have flood stories. Then by the same stroke they most also believe that dragons walk the earth.
Why not dragons? No one seriously denies that dinosaurs walked the earth.
Besides, let's suppose that smaller dinosaurs -- about the size of the very large mammals of today -- were represented in Noah's ark too. If we don't see these repitles today that means a number of reasonble things anywhere from they failed to adapt to their environment to they were all finally hunted to extinction by humans; perhaps by knights and other similar men seeking to prove their manhood by one of the most primordially fearsome creatures they knew of.
Too bad, really. Maybe if we had more dragons to slay today we'd spend less attention at killing each other.
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Seven years left to 2014!
by Roddy ini haven't been on the board for a while and i haven't been following the jws closely for a while either.
but it doesn't mean i'm not curious.
i've just been very busy.
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Roddy
Hi
I haven't been on the board for a while and I haven't been following the JWs closely for a while either. But it doesn't mean I'm not curious. I've just been very busy.
I'm curious. With the 1914 prediction nearing the 100 year mark, what are JWs saying about 1914? And I'm also curious what has this done to the rank and file JW membership in general with regard to end-time teachings, their teachings in general, and their view of their Governing Body?
Thanks!
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67
Oh MAN are they ever annoyed in Brooklyn!
by MinisterAmos ini called the information dept politely asking if mr brown was still a witness after commiting verbal apostasy during the interview with ldh.. i got transferred to one of their legal staff and he dropped the "f" bomb and hung up!
i on the other hand was a complete gentleman.. i would call this a golden opportunity to play up what has to be one of the most embarrasing moments for the dub leadership but is actually an important issue that any current dubz should be concerned about.
what is the actual policy of the org?
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Roddy
I called the Information Dept politely asking if Mr Brown was still a witness after commiting verbal apostasy during the interview with LDH.
Please excuse my ignorance but what is "LDH"?
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Taped Call w/ JR Brown on Cano
by Synergy inon the silent lambs site there is a taped call with a media person and jr. brown.
he stated that jw's don't proclaim or feel that they have special chosen ones to lead nor do they feel as though they are the sole organization to get to god.
what crap!
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Roddy
I wouldn't rush to that conclusion. I saw how things worked at headquarters for 40 years, and I just can't imagine Ted Jaracz and some of the others in power stepping aside. If they did, it would be easily observed at Bethel, and the disillusionment of seeing "the anointed" no longer in control would be leaked to elders, circuit overseers, district overseers and the branches. That would give the worldwide organization a tremendous setback. No, I think headquarters is too tightly knit together for that to happen. For years the legal departments have experienced frustrations due to the limitations placed upon them by "the old men" of the ;GB. I really doubt that has changed.
I believe a lot of consultation continues to take place, but in the final analysis the GB and persons like Don Adams and Max Larson still have the final say.
I respect your 40 years at headquarters. But I think the GB powers are on the wane for some time now. No one will admit it. Just like they don't admit being a United Nations NGO or their compromise of the blood issue with Bulgaria.
When Franz died there was no strong president at the helm since. Nor a strong voice from the GB. The GB is interested in maintaining the status quo and are too old to take on the tough issues anymore.
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Taped Call w/ JR Brown on Cano
by Synergy inon the silent lambs site there is a taped call with a media person and jr. brown.
he stated that jw's don't proclaim or feel that they have special chosen ones to lead nor do they feel as though they are the sole organization to get to god.
what crap!
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Roddy
> My thought on this is that any current Witness who is lurking here or even an active Witness who is involved but not out, needs to write the Governing Body and ask them when the change took place. Reference JR Browns quotes directly and tell them his words have stumbled you ..you need answers. Theocratic warfare is lying plain and simple. Call a spade a spade cos that's what it is. The Elder in alamb's court case lied opening in a court of law - this also flies in the face of what Brown stated, that they work with governments and so on. A lie is a lie is a lie...and doesn't Jehovah know that? sammieswife
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Forget it!!!! The GB is not the power behind the WTS anymore. It's the Legal Dept that has the political clout for a long time now. The WTS is run by their lawyers! JR Brown gets his cues from the Legal Dept and not from the GB.
It is really interesting. When I first saw the "re-organiztion" of the WTS years ago I said to myself that the GB is over! I think the lawyers sold the GB into taking the back seat to "protect" them from liabilities and so they could 'concentrate on Spiritual matters' when actually it is to get these senile old men out of the way before they say or do something stupid.
If there is going to be a new generation of GB, they will be hand picked figure-heads and yes-men of the Legal Dept.
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Greek Scriptures Apply Only to Annointed?
by Perry ini was expressing some excitement about some feature of the promises in the nt with an elder shortly before my baptism when he interrupted me and said, "now, you do know that the greek scriptures apply to 144,000 first and then only to us by extension".
does anyone know where this doctrine is stated in wt literature?
any help appreciated.
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Roddy
>
There is precious little proof that there are two classes of Christians, for all we know there is only one church and one body of believers heading in the same direction.
There is nothing in the Bible about an eternal existence confined to this earth. The whole idea is that the believers will enter the much more dynamic and glorious heavenly body and dimension.>
Well, I'm more confused than ever. I've been trying to reconcile the NT and its heavenly hope and Genesis with its original hope for mankind on Earth. Either Man was made for Earth or for Heaven? What's the answer?
Sometimes I wonder if the apostacy foretold by Paul had an effect on the Bible itself. After all, the whole Bible wasn't compiled and canonized until by the Roman Catholic church in the 4th century, I believe. What if apostate letters which only spoke of the heavenly hope were the only material approved for the NT?
I don't know. I'm still looking for answers. It sure would have helped if Jesus Christ wrote more than he sermoned - if you catch my drift.
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KM citing scriptures that don't exist...
by slimboyfat indoes anyone remember the km a couple of years ago that cited a scripture that doesn't exist?
it was something like 2 tim 3:36, and they had mixed up 1st and 2nd timothy.
i was telling a sister about it today, and i think she didn't believe me.
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Roddy
Yep, another one of those hush-hush corrections to the 'original' that makes it to the bound volumes and the WTCD.
I understand why WTS watchdogs prefer the literature fresh off the presses rather than the compilations such as the bound volumes and the WTCD as you can better trap what the WTS has said before they had a chance to revise their statements.
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Anyone Remember Dr. Jim Howard, Bethel Doctor in the 80s??
by Seeker4 injim howard was a psychiatrist who became a jw.
he was from a congregation near mine here in vermont, and i knew him long before he was invited to become the physician at bethel.
he had a lovely wife and a terrific young teenaged daughter at the time.
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Roddy
I've heard of him. That rang an old bell. Yes, when he was mentioned it was always in high regard. Like you said that was back in the 80s.
Funny you mention him now. Come to think of it, it was in the 80s when I last heard of him. I am curious what happened to him and his family.
From what you described he sounded like a terrific guy. Terrific guys don't last long in the WTS.
Funny thing about the WTS: People tend to "disappear" and no mention made. You just assume there are gone and don't ask.
Strange mentality in that place.