Posts by Saintbertholdt

29

Why do most Christians churches have masonic and/or pagan symbols?

by kabwell in

has anyone looked at the local churches in their area and seen pagan and freemason symbols both inside and outside.

i am not a jw but at least they don't seem to follow this trend.

why do "christians" wear a symbol of torture and death ?

Saintbertholdt

Hi there kabwell,
"Has anyone looked at the local churches in their area and seen pagan and freemason symbols both inside and outside."

Freemasonry has actually adopted many Christian symbols over the centuries. For example:

The Cross and Crown (Used in the early days of the Bible students)

Eye of Providence (Comes from the time of the renaissance representing the trinity)

That is also why there is a Bible on the altar of most masonic lodges.

Why do "Christians" wear a symbol of torture and death?

The symbol of the naked cross indicates the triumph of Jesus over death. That is why it is depicted as being empty. It therefore primarily serves as a symbol of victory and not of torture.

Most world religions have a Mary and child type god so this is just another pagan part of mainstream Christianity.

The veneration of a female deity is as you pointed out very old. One has to remember that the Bible is also full of this type of imagery. In Revelations the Bride of Christ and the woman giving birth in the desert features strongly and has given the impetus to Christianity for its usage.

Would any Christian give away everything to someone in need as Jesus did?

Some have I guess.

63

Raining before the Flood?

by GrownMidget in

i remember at my teen years when i was studying with a brother that he said to me that there was no rain before the flood.

instead there was this mist that you have.

never before or after this have i heard something like this.

Saintbertholdt

(Genesis 2:5, 6) 5 Now there was as yet no bush of the field found in the earth and no vegetation of the field was as yet sprouting, because Jehovah God had not made it rain upon the earth and there was no man to cultivate the ground. 6 But a mist would go up from the earth and it watered the entire surface of the ground.

183

JWs have more good points than bad

by lsw1961 in

1) many who were on the destructive path have been transformed by their teachings (this includes me who was once vicious, and presumptuous and atheistic).

2) equal monthly pay to all members of the bethel community regardless of whether they are bc members or sweepers.

this is something that still remains as an unattainable dream for the world.

Saintbertholdt

Hi lsw1961,
Cultic aspects fall into details.

The details they say, is where the devil resides. You have acknowledged two important points:

1. That shunning is wrong

2. Information control is in effect which you regard as a detail.

These two points are what most people on this site protest about. Why? Because it has negative lasting practical impacts upon their daily lives which the Watchtower organization perpetuates on purpose. If the two points mentioned above disappeared from the Watchtowers dogma most ex-Jehovah's Witnesses would not care about what the organization did or did not do or even believed.

After that, looking back at the organization through your hurt eyes will not give you correct vision. Transcend your personal hurt, you will be amazed at the results—you will not see your hurt, but will see the grand, beautiful, core cause the JW system stands for. Its all have to do with our view.

What you would have to remember is that this 'grand, beautiful, core cause' which you are promoting on this site is a promotion that you are not allowed to undertake under the Watchtowers own set of rules.

So what you are left with if you discard all the rules which you disagree with is basically worldwide promotion of the Bible. And here is where things get very interesting because:

When it comes to the core distribution of the Bible, the Watchtower organization is by far not the leading organization in this regard. Gideon International is by far the pinnacle organization.

Since its inception Gideon International has distributed: 1, 300, 000, 000 bibles

The Watchtower has distributed: 300, 000, 000 bibles

Regarding the Watchtowers other publications, none of these have lasting value because the dogma undergoes significant changes over time which makes the older publications valueless.

Every Bible that Gideon International has placed is usable from its first day to its very last.

183

JWs have more good points than bad

by lsw1961 in

1) many who were on the destructive path have been transformed by their teachings (this includes me who was once vicious, and presumptuous and atheistic).

2) equal monthly pay to all members of the bethel community regardless of whether they are bc members or sweepers.

this is something that still remains as an unattainable dream for the world.

Saintbertholdt

Hi Isw1961,
Communism could not withstand the overwhelming and hostile environment around it.

In other words the system could not compete and is inefficient. If you want to drive a car that constantly breaks down, has a 900cc engine, is grey in color, comes in a single model and is rarely available to the general populace because its frightfully expensive, then communism is certainly for you.

When I asked him what he liked the most in Bethel, he said “the equal pay.”

You wrote "...they were materially very rich". So they could leave Bethel with impunity. Then carry with their luxurious lives and refer to their time at Bethel as a wonderful and liberating experience which everyone should adopt. Have you ever wondered why most worldwide missionaries and relief agency's hail from rich capitalist countries? Because philanthropy comes from surplus and not from want.

You have not addressed the matter of the control of and denying access to information by the Watchtower organization. That is the outstanding quality of any cult organization (see my previous posts).

BTW is the PM you're referring to Tulsi Giri?

17

Told a JW about ARC in August, finally got a reply - Return to Jehovah booklet!!

by Xanthippe in

so i've mentioned this friend of my husband's who started writing to me out of the blue about three years ago, decades after we d'aed.

last august i wrote to her about the arc and jackson's summons.

i gave her the website details so she could see for herself.

Saintbertholdt

... folks we're not even close to at the KH are asking my wife "how I am"

Well Kurt you're fine cause you're working on your next book: The return of the Kilgore Trout

9

Could Have Been Worse

by Perry in

jw
friends

leah rimini spent a lot of money before she ditched her cult: .

over the years she says she spent about $2 million for services and training courses and made another $3 million in donations.

among her expenses was $40,000 to compensate scientology for sandwiches... article.

Saintbertholdt

Really? How many people are DEAD because of Scientology doctrine?

Google Narconon deaths.

The Watchtower has killed more people hands down though.

When compared to Scientology strong arm tactics and disconnect, the Watchtowers shunning is still quite tame.

10

Who is the worst storyteller in the Bible or what book?

by James Mixon in

for me the book of nehemiah, he got to be the worst storyteller ever.

how he made the final cut of the bible, he knew someone.

so a wall is built around.

Saintbertholdt

For me as a scientist, it has to be Genesis chapters 1 & 2.

Yeah its difficult to square the Genesis circle.

Revelation...

Naw that's where most of the gnarly imagery resides... The four horsemen, the seven seals... The New Jerusalem... heavenly battles, great surrealist stuff.

My vote is for the book of Numbers for pure boredom: Zebukak begat Jehuvim, and Jehuvim begat Hosfarilib. And Hosfarilib begat Johisodak, who slew the Philistines on the plain of Moab, but he was struck down by a commuter train...if only.

17

Told a JW about ARC in August, finally got a reply - Return to Jehovah booklet!!

by Xanthippe in

so i've mentioned this friend of my husband's who started writing to me out of the blue about three years ago, decades after we d'aed.

last august i wrote to her about the arc and jackson's summons.

i gave her the website details so she could see for herself.

Saintbertholdt

Hi Xanthippe,

This booklet says ' (big J) wants me to experience the relief of a clean conscience.'

You can always write that you went through the booklet but after you saw the testimony of the elders, overseers and the governing body member Geoffrey Jackson, you would never be able to have a clear conscience if you returned to the organization. How would your local congregation elders be able to address your concerns if a Governing Body members testimony did just the opposite?

9

Could Have Been Worse

by Perry in

jw
friends

leah rimini spent a lot of money before she ditched her cult: .

over the years she says she spent about $2 million for services and training courses and made another $3 million in donations.

among her expenses was $40,000 to compensate scientology for sandwiches... article.

Saintbertholdt

SecretSlaveClass: I think you mean the HBO documentary, "Going Clear."

Going Clear - Scientology and the Prison of Belief

I used to watch a lot of Tory Magoo and Mark Bunker videos on YouTube.

When you compare disconnect and the OSA (Office of Special Affairs) tactics to shunning, the Watchtower looks like Scientology lite.

15

Too Much Discontent in the Congregation Part 2

by Simon Templar in

here is part 2..

so you will have some understanding of the boe i will reference in future posts, the following is who they are:.

the coordinator.

Saintbertholdt

Ah hahahahhahaha...

I hope you tell us many adventures.