Posts by Spiral

21

Are older women holding the congregations together (at least in the US)?

by Spiral in

so i went and had a facial yesterday, and the aesthetician (and business owner) was a 30 something women, and we got on very well from the start.

the conversation came around to how many new churches are being built in this area, and i said i was surprised by it all.

she had a very interesting take on the situation.

Spiral

Data-Dog, I agree with you. It's the sad, mean truth of this religion. If anyone stays with an organization that gives back so little, then you are indeed weak. JW.org is a just a parasite, and if you're too lazy to rid yourself of a parasite, well?

I'm curious about what you said about your KH not appointing anyone in the 30+ group, skipping them over for younger more socially connected guys. I've seen that here too. So why stay? Nothing for you here. Again, mental lethargy at play.

So JWism is losing its prime alphas, and keeping its older females who cannot repopulate the species. JWism’s only hope is to cut back spending and rebrand into something completely unrecognizable. They can’t rely on 3rd World growth. That cake won’t bake...

Yep.

LongHairGal: You can't be a thinking person and have camaraderie with those types. That brings back some memories.

21

Are older women holding the congregations together (at least in the US)?

by Spiral in

so i went and had a facial yesterday, and the aesthetician (and business owner) was a 30 something women, and we got on very well from the start.

the conversation came around to how many new churches are being built in this area, and i said i was surprised by it all.

she had a very interesting take on the situation.

Spiral

Giordano, do you foresee the GB either diluting the dogma (even further) or revamping the idealogy to allow women a bigger share? I think they need to as a way to keep members, but they sure seem like a stubborn group of old men.

21

Are older women holding the congregations together (at least in the US)?

by Spiral in

so i went and had a facial yesterday, and the aesthetician (and business owner) was a 30 something women, and we got on very well from the start.

the conversation came around to how many new churches are being built in this area, and i said i was surprised by it all.

she had a very interesting take on the situation.

Spiral

Finkelstein Its makes one wonder why there are more woman/females JWS than men, when the WTS degrades woman in such a misogynistic fashion.

Yes, it does.

21

Are older women holding the congregations together (at least in the US)?

by Spiral in

so i went and had a facial yesterday, and the aesthetician (and business owner) was a 30 something women, and we got on very well from the start.

the conversation came around to how many new churches are being built in this area, and i said i was surprised by it all.

she had a very interesting take on the situation.

Spiral

@joe134cd, I agree, Christians in general seem less concerned about dogma, and more concerned about believing in Jesus. Not a bad thing.

I bet that church with music brought a lot of people in. Although I'm sure some wouldn't attend without the night club atmosphere, I have to say that a place of worship should be joyful, as an expression of faith. If I had any faith in God left, I would want to go somewhere to worship that had a happy vibe to it. The churches here are into all sorts of things, some practical (food banks and shelters) and many social (spaghetti dinners, book clubs, zumba classes, breakfast socials). These events are run, for the most part, by women of the 55+ age group.

@bamse, IDK. I don't think the younger generation wants to go for years, just hoping that maybe, just maybe, the GB will relent and (as Finkelstein proposes) get to hold the microphones.

There's just not much excitement in this religion. Only a special few get to be really involved in what goes on. You can't even go to an International Convention, on your own dime, if you don't have permission. And it's all just drab, repetitive meetings, service, clean the hall, man the cart, etc. Nothing much exciting for women at all, just service, giving basic pre-scripted talks, cleaning the hall, etc. The older generation of women accept that this is their "place", being in subjection to all men, but I just don't see loads of younger women growing old in this organization. I don't think they'll be interested.

21

Are older women holding the congregations together (at least in the US)?

by Spiral in

so i went and had a facial yesterday, and the aesthetician (and business owner) was a 30 something women, and we got on very well from the start.

the conversation came around to how many new churches are being built in this area, and i said i was surprised by it all.

she had a very interesting take on the situation.

Spiral

So I went and had a facial yesterday, and the aesthetician (and business owner) was a 30 something women, and we got on very well from the start. The conversation came around to how many new churches are being built in this area, and I said I was surprised by it all. She had a very interesting take on the situation. She feels that the influx of well-off retired people (55 plus) contributes to the new churches, because the women especially want to go to church, and enjoy lots of church activities. The men go along to keep the women happy (although not nearly as engaged in the religion) and then they are free to golf as much as they want. She had several well-thought out reasons behind her assertion, including the fact that this age group of women may be the last that will follow men (subjection as wives) but they really do have their own agenda, and this is how they achieve it. On the surface the men are still the preachers (mostly) and "take the lead" (not her exact words, but of course that's the phrase that comes to my mind) but the women do the actual work.

BUT - once this age group dies out, the churches will shrink, because younger women like herself just don't want to follow men around like puppies in a religious environment. Far too independent, and many more are single.

I think this is really an interesting observation. And what about the JWs? What will happen to the congregations once the older generation of women die off? I really don't know any young women in the congregation at present, but are younger ones as interested in being tied to following men? Are they able to be more independent? Are they getting any higher education? Do they like the way single women are treated (I'm sure not)? What will happen if there continues to be a shortage of "capable men reaching out" (ugh)?

I'm sure the GB has no intention of including women in any meaningful way in the congregations, so could this contribute to the shrinkage? Your thoughts......

19

Help me with the disfellowshipping topic, how is it NOT scriptural

by LevelThePlayingField in

many have said that jesus never shunned anyone.

yet it seems that the apostle paul said to shun an unrepentant sinner, "stop keeping company" and "not even eating with such a man" 1co 5:9-12. it seems like shunning is what paul wanted us to do.

but honestly, it doesn't seem right to me.

Spiral

Level, that is the problem with the Bible, not all of the Bible writers had the same attitudes. Paul has always seemed mean spirited to me. I think he had his own extra ideas, to add to Jesus'.

49

"You owe Jehovah humility and HONESTY" - an email from a JW

by Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho in

hey forum goers.

i'd like your opinions on constructing an email reply to this shocker below.

bit of background about the sender: she is a middle-aged, cheery uberdub whose siblings left when a schism occured in her congregation in canada way back when.

Spiral

I would say that these righteous types are "getting their reward in full" now, trying to lord it over all of us "spiritually weak" types.

"OK?" (ugh)

No, it's not ok.

I'm sure you'll get a few of these, as I did. I always want to ask why God created everyone just so he can test them constantly. Doesn't the greatest being in the universe have anything better to do with his time? Apparently not. So, if you "please him" you look forward to eternal life constantly trying to stay on his good side, because that is all we are created to do.

I ignored emails (or texts) like this when I received them, and they stopped coming.

19

J.W's Brain LOCKDOWN

by Phizzy in

i know we often talk of the mind control and how jw's believe what they are taught because they are controlled as to the information they receive, but i think the mind control goes frighteningly beyond simply keeping information away from them.. the jw mind is in lockdown.

it simply cannot accept facts, evidence, reasoning or whatever that goes against what they believe.

they cannot assimilate and consider an argument, it is not that they are being awkward, or willfully blind, their minds are so shut down they are incapable of taking in what is being presented.. i am aware of how, in common with other cults and high control groups the j.w org achieves this state among its members, but how on earth do we open such a solidly closed mind ?.

Spiral

sparrowdown4 hours ago4 hours ago

JWs like to get "reactions" then, they can judge you based on the reaction. They like to think just their very presence causes admiration and guilt from onlookers. Admiration at their being so good and guilt at not being as good as them. Because of course everyone is watching them - very narcissistic!

I find indifference to their beliefs and their culty social games really gets to them. They really have no idea what to do with indifference. As I said they need a reaction any reaction so they can interpret it and label you as either "guilty" or "bitter" or "pathetic loser" or "weak and ashamed" etc etc. If they are met with smiling indifference to their religious beliefs combined with calm assertiveness ie giving them nothing they can "read" it's like they become genuinely intrigued with why you are immune to their guilt-inducing superpowers.

I'm with sparrowdown on this one. For our relatives, "living well is the best re[sponse]". Mr. Spiral and I just don't care any more and it's been noticed..... but funny thing is, no one argues with us any more. I also guess our JW relatives gave up on expecting our lives to explode, so now they don't know how to respond. We hear from them from time to time and we are responsive, but they don't bring up JW dogma to us any more. Their brains are still on lockdown, yet they have to see that there's another way of looking at the world, and it's working for us. We don't give them any resistance, but we don't try to engage in any JWisms (is that a word?) either.

14

JWs studying with a neighbor: what should I do?

by john.prestor in

so let me introduce myself first: i've lurked here for years because i'm working on a long-term research project concerning jehovah's witnesses and i've collected data from this site (seriously, you guys are awesome, i've learned so much from this forum i never would have learned otherwise).

i've also collected data at multiple kingdom halls and read scholarly works on jehovah's witnesses and non-scholarly works as well (e.g., crisis of conscience).

so i have a pretty good sense of jehovah's witnesses even though i was not raised in this faith nor did i ever join up.

Spiral

Show her today's article:

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/jehovahs-witnesses-sexual-abuse-children-beliefs-rules.html

39

Major Article in Today's Philadelphia Inquirer on JW Child Abuse

by Room 215 in

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/jehovahs-witnesses-sexual-abuse-children-beliefs-rules.html.

Spiral

Excellent article! I hope other news sources pick it up.