waton

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Posts by waton

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  77

  A question about the contemporary generation teaching following a conversation with a JW apologist

  by Giles Gray in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i would like to ask the ex-jws on this site to put their ‘apologists hat’ back on for a moment, so that i can go through the overlapping generation teaching in an attempt to make sense of it.

  i apologise if these points have already been addressed on this site.a quick background for the reason for my request… having never confronted a jw apologist on the topic, i recently engaged with a jw regarding the official understanding of a ‘generation’ and unfortunately he didn’t have an answer to the points i was making.

  i was left a little confused as to what the official jw response would/should be.so i was hoping that my thoughts below might be considered from an apologist’s perspective.the point in question relates to this section of the watchtower article below from 2008, as well as the jw.org video explanation of the overlapping generation:---:w08 2/15[box on page 25] can we calculate the length of “this generation”?the word “generation” usually refers to people of various ages whose lives overlap during a particular time period or event.

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  waton

  Why do they ignore all the other anointed who were alive in 1914 and only focus on Franz in the chart in the video?

  GG For wt weiters, any pre -1914 characters are an embarrassment, and not even part of their 1919 F&DS. Forward overlap is bad enough, why add the backflip overlap too?

  Splane only named F.Franz, but said other older ones may exist. and

  did I mention in defence of wt, that the contemporaries in Joseph's generation lived to 145, 110, 120 years old, just like some people today????? so

  dont despair, that would bring the last group of the comtemporary generation well into the 22 century.

  I hope you noticed my tongue firmly planted in cheek, hoping for a long lived generation for all.
  
  
  
  
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  77

  A question about the contemporary generation teaching following a conversation with a JW apologist

  by Giles Gray in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i would like to ask the ex-jws on this site to put their ‘apologists hat’ back on for a moment, so that i can go through the overlapping generation teaching in an attempt to make sense of it.

  i apologise if these points have already been addressed on this site.a quick background for the reason for my request… having never confronted a jw apologist on the topic, i recently engaged with a jw regarding the official understanding of a ‘generation’ and unfortunately he didn’t have an answer to the points i was making.

  i was left a little confused as to what the official jw response would/should be.so i was hoping that my thoughts below might be considered from an apologist’s perspective.the point in question relates to this section of the watchtower article below from 2008, as well as the jw.org video explanation of the overlapping generation:---:w08 2/15[box on page 25] can we calculate the length of “this generation”?the word “generation” usually refers to people of various ages whose lives overlap during a particular time period or event.

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  waton

  I once argued, to my satisfaction for the Superior authorities of Rom 13 to be no other then J No.1 and Jesus , the very day I later found out reading my just arrived wt that it was not so, Babylon the great had it right. so

  let me defend the wt teaching:

  The F& DS teaches the 2 groups making up the current anointed generation. But is it not true, that these groups, this generation lives alongside a much larger group of contemporaries that are not partakers?

  Did not Brother Splane mention that among the anointed 'brothers' might be even hardy individuals living longer, or (getting anointed earlier) than the late president? who served' from 1914 to 1992, 78 years ?

  Could we not find in literature, broadcasts example for "contemporaries " being called "generation" stretching a long way? I am thinking of me, being born during the 'great depression' suffered the consequences. but people that lived through that calamity also were at the end, not the beginning of of their long lives. Were we, these not my contemporaries? could not Joseph's "generation " have been made up of such groups too, when they entered Egypt? so:

  A young zealous 'Bethelite partaker' could have easily shared Brooklyn air with Old Br. Franz in 1992, be his contemporary, be part of that generation of that kind of witnesses with great 'understandings' and 'faith". so:

  what are you complaining about? this generation sharing the time around 1992 will last at least 78 years from then, perhaps even to 2075. remember that number?
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  23

  Gerrit Loesch video from this week's meeting

  by neat blue dog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  he talks about how a group of 5,000 broke away from the organization due to distrust of government agents infiltrating the jws.

  they weren't regarded as apostates, just distrustful.

  he uses phrases like "their leader" and "his elders", and how they had a meeting with the governing body and made the decision for all these thousands to reintegrate them into the jws, splitting them up among congregations.

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  waton

  Ir was easy for commies to fake belief in a paradise Earth, they too taught a worker paradise to be established worldwide by hard work, killing of opposers. sounds familiar? and under educated, bullying leaders.

  even the Nazis had their 1000 year Reich and the 144 columns.
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  23

  Gerrit Loesch video from this week's meeting

  by neat blue dog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  he talks about how a group of 5,000 broke away from the organization due to distrust of government agents infiltrating the jws.

  they weren't regarded as apostates, just distrustful.

  he uses phrases like "their leader" and "his elders", and how they had a meeting with the governing body and made the decision for all these thousands to reintegrate them into the jws, splitting them up among congregations.

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  waton

  The sad part is, that each and all that would support the material smuggled ,mimeographed , would be disfellowshipped to day. Good bye to the claim be wt writers to be for the guardian and dispenser of 'enduring truth for the eternal creator'.

  all these sacrifices for what? a false hope.

  The mood of the video reflected that G. Loesch realizes that the idea of this wt ideal ist geloescht. Fervent hope extinguished.
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  7

  PURITANS - why we need them right now

  by Terry in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  puritans!.

  we need them to help us become more righteous.we need to feel the sting of their whiplash and suffer the tongues of flame, branding irons, and denouncement.why?gosh - we aren't as pure as they are, that's why!.

  8th century christian orthodox iconoclasts smashed statues used by catholic christian worshipers - to save them from idolatry.let us us cheer that intervention!

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  waton

  Finnish people are the happiest in the world, because they are a kind of puritan, read it on BBC or The Guardian.
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  11

  Why are UK Chiropodists not allowed to treat patients?

  by BoogerMan in

  1. social
  2. humour

  because there will be only 2 feet between them and the patients!.

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  waton

  There is actually more than 2 feet distance, , because the feet that smell, and the nose that smells can be more than 6 feet apart. ,

  (particularly for the proud and/or lying ones in the congregation, Pinocchio et al, )

  they are just not allowed to treat toddlers.
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  129

  Overlapping Generation

  by pandorasbox1914 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the september 2015 broadcast had david splane explain matthew 24:34 “truly, i say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place”.

  his explanation of this scripture was by means of a chart to indicate an overlapping generation.. .

  no scripture was used to show the overlapping generation concept, and as a result it makes no sense.. to illustrate how crazy this concept is, look at the lyrics of the song my generation.. my generation.

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  waton

  sbf, TD, right so:

  since the anointed in question and the general population lives through the same rime, the people in general during that stretched out time have ro be in overlapping groups too.

  2) the scripture speaks of the generation passing away. (but not until). so, it could not be the Other Sgeep, because they will "never pass away" but

  The anointed will pass away before "all these things occur", so

  assuming that the bible prophecy would ll have a second fulfillment, wt is already proven wrong.
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  30

  Would Watchtower Ever Risk Setting Another Date

  by Number 6 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  there was a 50 year gap between the failed dates of 1925 and 1975.. memories fade, people die, and who cares what was said 50 years ago.. most jw's now in the religion werent there when 1975 was a thing.

  even my mother who was baptized in 1974 who i do remember speaking about it back in the day, can barely remember what the fuss was about.

  for active jw's who are doing all there studying online now, its practically impossible to find any wt contemporary reference to 1975.. i read recently (sorry i cant source it right now) that at the time, even watchtower may have taken the view that even if they knew 1975 was wrong, the short term gains would far outstrip those who left leading to an overall net gain so it was a risk worth taking.

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  waton

  Actually they did set another date for Armageddon....prior to the year 2000 Vdh:

  Frederick Franz died in 1992. Davis splane used him and older 'anointed' than him as an example of the "this [1914] generation" groups that overlap.

  In doing so he set another date: 2075. No risk in that.
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  35

  Noah’s flood

  by dothemath in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  a few years ago at one of the conventions, there was a talk on gods remarkable creation.

  one of the slides showed a giant sequoia tree, approximately 5000 years old!.

  later another talk was about noah etc.

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  waton

  do the math: Everest has been rising for 100 million years, it was flooded, with water rising for 40 days, everywhere. Even the 2 polar icecaps would have floated off their bases. The Colorado flowed once into the Atlantic.
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  35

  Noah’s flood

  by dothemath in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  a few years ago at one of the conventions, there was a talk on gods remarkable creation.

  one of the slides showed a giant sequoia tree, approximately 5000 years old!.

  later another talk was about noah etc.

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  waton

  all creation” meant the world as it was then known. dtm:

  to bible writers with their myopic vision and limited knowledge.

  that would exclude India China, the Himalayas. but

  wt uses 'Jesus', 'Peter's endorsing the deluge, and comparing it to the ending of the 'present world'. --- now think about that, ---if the flood waters did not really cover Mount Everest, Armageddon will be only local too, Black Sea, Megiddo area.

  about those giant old trees, with the first rain, falling on Noah at 10 meter heights an hour*** , they would be all uprooted and floating above Mount Everest too. probably big enough floats for the pandas, kangaroos, sloths to get off early and float back to their homeland rather than have to walk, hop back to their homelands.

  *** dothemath, do the math: 24 hours by 40 days = 960 hours of rainfall. Everest ~ 9600 m high. 9600 meters : 960 hours= 10.meters/h that is 3 stories submerged every hour, quite a story that is.