Dear E***, and A*****,
I feel the need to address your stand regarding shunning Katie. You state
the reason is that she has lied about the Silent Lambs/Mammoth Cave weekend.
This is not true. (sister) and I planned that weekend to take the girls to
Mammoth Cave months prior. When we found out about the Silent Lambs Vigil we
decided to attend and then go to Mammoth Cave. G****** pushed for (my sister) to
come home early so we cut our trip short and rescheduled our trip to Mammoth
Cave for a few weeks later. You have taken misinformation from other
sources and used it for your own benefit without checking the validity of
it. It gives you the excuse you are looking for to punish Katie.
You know, it is funny how some of the JWs jumped up and down in glee when
the media exposed what was going on in the Catholic Church regarding the
pedophiles; some were saying that Jehovah must have been behind it showing
the Catholic Church for what it was. Yet a short time later, when Jehovahs
Witnesses were exposed it was persecution. Changes need to be made within
the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society regarding this policy. There are
cases in which victims were told not to report the crime to the proper
authorities, when they went to the proper authorities against the elders
advisement they were disfellowshipped on the grounds of causing division
among the organization. The victims now became victims of the organization.
The real fear was the bringing of reproach upon them because of what was
going on within it.
Now for the issue of my not allowing Katie to visit without an adult to
intervene. I never said Katie could not come visit, nor has she said that
she didnt want to visit. Again you have used misinformation for your own
benefit without checking the validity of it. After what happened at Moms
house this summer I feel a need to protect her. When Katie was at Moms
house this past summer during the assembly Mom took it upon herself to see
where Katies religious stand was. By the time Mom was done Katie was
heartbroken. Katie tries to be diplomatic and tries very hard not to hurt
anybodys feelings. When she became silent towards Moms inquisition Mom
told her that this had put a wedge between them. Katie asked to be excused
and she and (cousin*) went to one of the bedrooms and then retreated outside.
She was out there for two hours crying. Mom never went to check on her and
(cousin*), if she did she made no attempt to resolve what was going on. I asked
Katie why she did not call me or (my sister} to come and get her, she said she was
afraid that Mom had locked her out of the house. She said that Mom was that
angry at the time. Mom has made no attempt to contact Katie since that time.
Katie finally called her last week. If it werent for Katie there would
still be no contact between them.
A*****, you went on and on about not realizing that you were pressuring
Katie, when Katie said she would think about the Bible Study, you should
have left it alone and let her approach you if she were ready. You seem to
have a different perception of pressure then Katie does. The reasoning for
having a Bible Study is to progress a person towards baptism as one of
Jehovahs Witnesses.
Their very questions at the time of baptism are:
(1) On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of
your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?
(2) Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one
of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed
organization?
That dedication belongs to Jehovah, not a man made organization. The
question changed in the mid 1980s. Why was it changed from:
(2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation
have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as
he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the
enlightening power of the holy spirit?
There is a big difference in being baptized as a servant of Jehovah and
baptizing or dedicating yourself to an organization.
Katie has never been baptized as part of the Jehovahs Witness organization.
Do you shun former members?
Those who simply leave the faith are not shunned. If, however, someone
unrepentantly practices serious sins, such as drunkenness, stealing, or
adultery, he will be disfellowshipped and such an individual is avoided by
former fellow-worshipers. Every effort is made to help wrongdoers. But if
they are unrepentant, the congregation needs to be protected from their
influence. The Bible clearly directs: "Remove the wicked man from among
yourselves." (1 Corinthians 5:13) What of a man who is disfellowshipped but
whose wife and children are still Jehovah's Witnesses? The spiritual ties he
had with his family change, but blood ties remain. The marriage relationship
and normal family affections and dealings can continue. As for
disfellowshipped relatives not living in the same household, Jehovah's
Witnesses apply the Bible's counsel: "Quit mixing with them." (1 Corinthians
5:11) Disfellowshipped individuals may continue to attend religious services
and, if they wish, they may receive spiritual counsel from the elders with a
view to their being restored. They are always welcome to return to the faith
if they reject the improper course of conduct for which they were
disfellowshipped.
I pulled this directly from the FAQ at the Watchtowers website:
http://www.jw-media.org/beliefs/beliefsfaq.htm
Katie is still the same sweet gentle person that she has always been. She
does not steal, get drunk, take drugs, or have sex. (She isnt even dating
yet). She is the same person she was two years ago, ten years ago etc. Is
the issue because she said she doesnt want to be one of Jehovahs
Witnesses? Again, Katie has never been baptized into the organization.
Shunning her is your personal decision.(Matthew 7:1-3) Based on what the
WBTS teaches I would like to know what your real excuse is for shunning
Katie. I will not raise her in a way that teaches her to live with, nor to
offer conditional love especially regarding family members. I would have
thought that my family members would have welcomed me back when I was
reinstated, yet I had to pretty much be the one to initiate contact if there
was to be any. There was never any real encouragement. Katie has been at
your house when (our brother) name has been mentioned regarding his taking Mom to
a play, and meeting (his girlfriend). Mom went although I cant imagine why, since she
was uncomfortable doing so. (our brother) was under the impression that Mom had a
good time. Katie overheard this being discussed while she was visiting at
the same time Mom was there.
Katie when asked by A**** the other night if she was planning on serving
Jehovah Katie replied not in the way that you mean. A**** replied
There is only one way. Who are you to judge Katies relationship with
Jehovah? Just because it isnt in the way that you see fit? When Jehovahs
Witnesses go to the doors, they encourage others to examine what they are
taught from the Bible, but once you are in you arent allowed to question
anything. Their prophecies change and it is simply called new light. They
claim divine direction and yet they cant get their prophecies right, hence
they have new light. The time of intervention belongs to Jehovah, and to him
alone, we should be serving him out of love and not out of fear that we
could be destroyed at a guesstimated time. The very scriptures that
Jehovahs Witnesses use against other religions could also apply to them.
They have hypocritically judged other religions for being a part of the
governments and yet they have had an NGO membership with the United Nations.
They claim the purpose was access to the UN library, yet, the UN said it
wasnt necessary. When it became more public the WBTS pulled that
membership. They have downed the UN in some of their literature, yet when an
article is to be turned in for access to the library they wont show their
disfavor of the UN. Why were the JWs in Malawi allowed to suffer persecution
and sometimes death versus being disfellowshipped if they signed a
political card, and yet during this same time the JWs in Mexico were allowed
to purchase political cards to keep from going to prison? The Watchtower
Bible and Tract Society is another man made organization that claims that
they are Gods directed organization. I feel that I need to reexamine the
Bible under better conditions. I am seeking Jehovahs truth.
E*** and A****, I love you both and A***** and D**** unconditionally and I
would love to have all of you in my life. I will always be here for you. If
what you feel you have is the truth then I will respect that, I always have,
because it is your decision to make.
All my love,
Karla
Posts by myself
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17letter to my brother the elder
by myself indear e***, and a*****,.
i feel the need to address your stand regarding shunning katie.
you state .
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myself
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12
more useless shunning
by myself inmy brother and his family have taken it upon themseves to judge my unbaptized daughter (16 years old).
they did not have the guts to tell her personally, but instead chose to do so thru her jdub father (who in turn didn't tell her), and a cousin who did let her know.
this cousin stands by her and remains very close to her.
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myself
My brother and his family have taken it upon themseves to judge my unbaptized daughter (16 years old). They did not have the guts to tell her personally, but instead chose to do so thru her jdub father (who in turn didn't tell her), and a cousin who did let her know. This cousin stands by her and remains very close to her.
We set up a phone call so they would have to tell her themselves, and yes I taped it! They had many excuses none in my opnion were scriptural nor valid. It is another case of no control. What a shame. My daughter once thought of her uncle and aunt as another set of parents. She is coping well after the initial shock that they could be so hateful, but she has learned such is life, it is time to move on.
My next post is my letter to them, it is legnthy due to the need to address their reasons for shunning. I found out after I sent it that they have gone camping. so much for timing LOL
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32
Women Only, Please.
by Robdar inhas anybody on the forum ever had a hysterectomy?
i am getting one this winter.
i am scared shitless.
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myself
Robyn, in my case it was a success. I had a hysterectomy in 1995 at the age of 32. My health improved greatly because of it. I had an excellent doctor (did also get 2nd opinion at his insistance). It was suggested 3 years prior but we were able to buy some time. He was able to salvage one ovary to keep me off of hormone therapy, as I had a terrible time on hormones (treatment for endometriosis and cysts). I dropped about 30lbs in two weeks after the surgery (water weight mostly from hormones). I even at my insurance companys request had to see a shrink because of my early age to make sure I could handle the surgery. The shrink said I was more then ok for the surgery but to come back as there were other issues that should be settled
Karla
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22
How many would have stayed?
by freedom96 inmy lost new posting topic made me think of this question:.
if the wts was more normal, how many would have stayed?.
was it in fact the teachings that made you leave?
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myself
Was it in fact the teachings that made you leave? Yes Or more so the way they act and hurt people.Yes to this too If there was not a df'ing program,could consider it if there was more love shown, if the rules were not so extreme, like lets say that holidays were allowed.not really an issue, but learning to enjoy them You could be in the military, etc.N/A In fact, if the witnesses were like any other religion, only the beliefs were different, would you have stayed? Like any other religion? No I do not have faith or trust in any "organized religion."
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25
Therapy
by Moxy inim breaking a long absence to ask a question during this evening of soul-searching in what i believe to be the best place to ask it.
i dont know how many people are still here who remember me well, so first a 'hi and miss you guys' to those who are.. im wondering about therapy.
i always thought i had a pretty good handle on my life despite the upheaval of leaving the witnesses.
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myself
WB Moxy. One of my brothers finally saw a therapist after some self-destructive behavior. At least 80% of the problems went back to the jw religion (cult). He was never baptized, and left in his late teens. The issues in my opinion were pretty much resolved with therapy and time, although I think some may always haunt him.
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133
Why Im ignoring my friends.
by refiners fire inive basically kept this under wraps in so far as this board is concerned, but ive decided to tell about it because, frankly, im under stress at the moment,am posting (when i post at all) a bit strangely and i wish to explain why im hardly posting, nor am i hardly responding to emails or chat requests from my friends here.
i apologize for the latter.
in a nutshell, my wife is sick, shes been sick a year now and the situation is getting worse.
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myself
((((((refiners & refiner's wife)))))) So sorry to hear about this. Please let us know how everything is going. We care and are hoping to hear good news.
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27
I'm 40 today----YIKES!!!
by BoozeRunner in.
well, here i am....the big 40!!!
hey, this aint so bad.. boozy
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myself
Happy Birthday to you Boozy!!!! I agree, with scootergirl, life just gets better especially with so much to look forward to. Have a great weekend!
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5
Make-A-Wish / IMPORTANT
by myself ini received a letter from a locally owned business that touched my heart.
craig sheppard is 7 years old and has a brain tumor.
he has little time to live.
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myself
Kenneson, you mean <gasp> the round bin, file 13?
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5
Make-A-Wish / IMPORTANT
by myself ini received a letter from a locally owned business that touched my heart.
craig sheppard is 7 years old and has a brain tumor.
he has little time to live.
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myself
Thanks SixofNine.
Ok everybody: Nevermind!!!
Thanks for saving me the postage Six Now what to do with the cards? LOL I actually received it in a letter form from a local company. I will call her Monday.
Karla
Edited by - myself on 18 October 2002 22:18:6
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5
Make-A-Wish / IMPORTANT
by myself ini received a letter from a locally owned business that touched my heart.
craig sheppard is 7 years old and has a brain tumor.
he has little time to live.
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myself
I received a letter from a locally owned business that touched my heart.
Craig Sheppard is 7 years old and has a brain tumor. He has little time to live. He contacted Make-A-Wish Foundation expressing his desire to have an entry in the Guiness Book of World Records for the largest collection of business cards from an individual. He is allowed only one business card from each company.
I started asking for cards today when I found out and I have probably collected between 200-300 cards today. I am going to sort thru them this weekend to make sure there aren't any duplicates and then I am going to mail them to the foundation. Anyone who can help with this, even if it is sending just one card please send it to :
Craig Sheppard
C/O Make-A-Wish Foundation
30 Perimeter Center East
Atlanta, GA 30346
Time is of the essence. Please help me and others join together to make Craig's dream come true.
Thanks,
Karla aka Myself
Edited by - myself on 18 October 2002 22:8:3
Edited by - myself on 18 October 2002 22:10:55