ScenicViewer

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Posts by ScenicViewer

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  51

  Did we ever fulfill Mathew 24:14?

  by raymond frantz in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i know ... many mistakes and a nasty leadership ,but did jehovah's witnesses fulfill even partially matthew 24:14 :"the good news will be preached in all the inhabited earth and then the end will come "are we to expect a final or a completely different fulfilment of this verse ?

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  ScenicViewer

  I remember a CO attempting to explain this prior to 1975.

  He said there are 3 basic national groups, referring to the descendants of Noah's sons, Ham, Shem, Japheth. His point was that Mt 24:14 had been fulfilled because these 3 goups of people had been witnessed to.

  I was new in the Organization then, but I thought...

  'What does that prove? Isn't it the people that matter? Much of mankind will be killed at Armageddon, even though they have never heard the msg of JWs, just because someone else of their race has?'

  That was one of the early signals to me that JWs can rationalize anything. I should have taken it more seriously and made an exit sooner than I did.
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  15

  Sometimes sorry isn't enough...

  by cedars in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i thought you might like to see a rare example of the society saying the actual word "sorry" in the literature.. in 1992 someone wrote in to the awake!

  and their comment was published in the july 8th edition in the "from our readers" section, page 30.. their comment read as follows.... "your suggestion that sex education be considered a 'family secret' could accidentally result in great difficulty for some of your readers.

  social workers, teachers, nurses, and other professionals are now trained to watch for signs of child abuse.

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  ScenicViewer

  Caliber makes an very good point.

  Rather than admitting what it did, and making a straight forward apology, the Society is being hedgy by saying "...we are sorry if we caused any alarm...".

  A person before a judicial committee giving such a half-hearted apology for a wrong committed would likely not be seen as contrite and probably would be DF'd.

  From Watchtower though, it's the closest thing to a real apology we will get.
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  52

  Expectation is not a false prohecy, Is the Watchtower Society in the clear ?

  by wasblind in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  because there is a difference.

  to expect somethin' doesn't mean it will happen.

  for years the wts made a direct prophecy and have claimed to meet the qualifications.

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  ScenicViewer

  There are a couple more interesting points from Jeremiah 28 that Wasblind referred to in his excellent post.

  (verse 15)
  And Jeremiah the prophet went on to say to Hananiah the prophet: “Listen, please, O Hananiah! Jehovah has not sent you, but you yourself have caused this people to trust in a falsehood.

  How many times has Watchtower done that? 1914, 1925, 1975, the 'generation', there are only a 'few remaining months til armageddon' etc. All of these are now known to be "falsehoods" that all of Jehovah's Witnesses trusted in.

  (verse 9)
  As regards the prophet that prophesies of peace, when the word of the prophet comes true the prophet whom Jehovah has sent in truth will become known.

  Watchtower claims to be God's true prophet* today, but no prophet can be a true prophet until his words come true. A long list of Watchtower's predictions have already failed. None have come true. There is no way the Organization can be taken as a true prophet.

  *The Society claims to be a true prophet
  (W 4-1-72, p197)
  “So, does Jehovah have a prophet to help them, to warn them of dangers and to declare things to come?
  
  “These questions can be answered in the affirmative.
  
  “This prophet was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah’s Christian witnesses. They are still proclaiming a warning, and have been joined and assisted in their commissioned work by hundreds of thousands of persons who have listened to their message with belief."
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  67

  elders wife swapping question

  by unstopableravens in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i hear of these stories of elders swapping wives, i remember when i was young hearing of three elders in florida doing this and getting dfed.

  my question is this how is it possible to bring this up in conversation?

  it seems impossible, how can there be multi elders that know each other willing and the wives?

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  ScenicViewer

  kurtbethel said ,

  Call me cynical, but it is just as likely the Society made this claim as a recruiting pitch.

  Now that's an angle I hadn't thought of. Very funny!
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  67

  elders wife swapping question

  by unstopableravens in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i hear of these stories of elders swapping wives, i remember when i was young hearing of three elders in florida doing this and getting dfed.

  my question is this how is it possible to bring this up in conversation?

  it seems impossible, how can there be multi elders that know each other willing and the wives?

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  ScenicViewer

  In the 1980s the Society made the admission that such things do happen.

  (W 1-1-1986 p13, par12)

  12 Shocking as it is, even some who have been prominent in Jehovah’s organization have succumbed to immoral practices, including homosexuality, wife swapping, and child molesting.
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  50

  Are you now ashamed of how gullible you were as a JW?

  by biometrics in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  now that you realise how idiotic some of the jw beliefs are/were, do you feel ashamed of how gullible you were to believe them?.

  if anything my past as an adult jw makes me understand how easily manipulated people are by the people and environment around them.

  and that even intelligent people can be influenced beyond what is rational..

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  ScenicViewer

  It is by far my greatest regret in life.

  I should have looked into the past of the Organization; it would have made a big difference.
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  44

  California TV Personality Huell Howser Dead at Age 67

  by kurtbethel in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/huell-howser-death-california-gold-185922911.html.

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  ScenicViewer

  900 episodes is incredible.

  When you comare that to other long-running television shows it stands out. A few examples from this website are,

  Gunsmoke, 633

  Lassie, 588

  The Simpsons, 500 and counting

  Law and Order, 456

  Bonanza, 430

  Cheers, 275

  Andy Griffith Show, 249

  His viewership was necessarily limited mainly to Californians, but to his audience he had the same 30 year staying power of broadcast legends such as Walter Cronkite and Johnny Carson.

  Now that's a-MAAY-zing!
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  72

  My Husband Said "Victims Of Pedophiles Come Forward Soon, Not Fifteen Or Thirty Years Later!" Right?

  by AuntConnie in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  my husband had gotten into a fight with a couple of victims of different pedophiles, he said in all his years of elderhood, "men and women who were sexually assualted came forward when they were old enough, they did not wait for decades to report they were abused.

  you must have some kind of false memory or you are just trying to bring shame to the congregations.

  " what is the truth of this?.

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  ScenicViewer

  Crisis of Conscience, that's what my eyes do when I'm confused; they're doing it now!
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  72

  My Husband Said "Victims Of Pedophiles Come Forward Soon, Not Fifteen Or Thirty Years Later!" Right?

  by AuntConnie in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  my husband had gotten into a fight with a couple of victims of different pedophiles, he said in all his years of elderhood, "men and women who were sexually assualted came forward when they were old enough, they did not wait for decades to report they were abused.

  you must have some kind of false memory or you are just trying to bring shame to the congregations.

  " what is the truth of this?.

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  ScenicViewer

  AuntConnie,

  "...he said in all his years of elderhood "men and women who were sexually assualted came forward when they were old enough, they did not wait for decades to report they were abused."

  My goodness, how many child abuse cases has he been in on "in all his years of elderhood"? Is it enough to amount to a large enough sampling to be meaningful? That would take quite a lot of cases, more than he would want to admit to as an elder since it would indicate there is an extremely large pedophile problem among Jehovah's Witnesses. He should be more careful with his words if he is concerned about protecting the Organization's reputation.

  - And -

  "...please tell me why he would say this."

  In reality he is being defensive and attempting to protect his religion, although carelessly. Perhaps he is thinking about the Candace Conti case, and his intentions are to discredit it since Candace is an adult now; maybe he wanted her to come forward at a much younger age.

  I doubt he personally knows of enough pedophile cases to have a truly informed opinion about when victims should come forward. He is doing what most JWs do when confronted with a problem, he is shooting straight from the hip and going headlong into denial, making up whatever argument seems to make sense at the moment.

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  "I listened to him say "Jehovah would not have allowed him to remain a elder if he was really that bad, would he?""

  What a ridiculous and dangerous way of thinking. It is cognitive dissonance for sure.

  Yes, forgiveness is possible but it should be remembered that the vast majority of pedophiles repeat if given the chance, therefore the pedophile should be watched by informed parents, and it is their call if they will associate with him or not. He may be truly repentant but that won't stop another offense.

  He abused a 4 year old girl? We have to protect our children first and foremost, and JWs aren't doing that.

  The arguments that your husband is making to defend Watchtower are very troubling.

  Edit: I wonder if FHN is right. There are posters here that are quick to spot pretenders. Are we being played?
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  40

  Cut and Paste of "The List" by Prominent Bethelite of Previous Watchtower Predicted Dates

  by TMS in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  " {watchtower sep 1 1989 12}.

  " {tiah 240-1, also references in wr oct 1879 3941, tkic 84}.

  '" {zions watchtower mar 1880 repr 82}.

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  ScenicViewer

  Here is a similar list, posted in 4 parts, plus an reference page.

  Go to any of these pages and the other pages are linked.

  - Part 1, 1776-1913, http://home.tiscali.nl/t661020/wtcitaten/part1.htm

  - Part 2, 1914-1924, http://home.tiscali.nl/t661020/wtcitaten/part2.htm

  - Part 3, 1925-1974, http://home.tiscali.nl/t661020/wtcitaten/part3.htm

  - Part 4, 1975-2000, http://home.tiscali.nl/t661020/wtcitaten/part4.ht

  - Key and Literature Abbreviations used, http://home.tiscali.nl/t661020/wtcitaten/key.htm