ScenicViewer

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Posts by ScenicViewer

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  300

  ALERT: NEW LAWSUIT settlement - $13 MILLION

  by Watchtower-Free in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/135m-awarded-to-bible-teacher-gonzalo-campos-alleged-abuse-victim-jose-lopez-281031832.html.

  (published thursday, oct 30, 2014).

  thursday, oct 30, 2014 updated at 11:58 pm pdt.

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  ScenicViewer

  BOTR: No legal case is ever presented accurately on this forum.

  Really? Not ever? That's kind of a sweeping statement. Often court documents are presented here for download; there must be some accuracy in those.

  Cofty: How much would you love to see a member of the GB on the stand being grilled by a tenacious lawyer?

  Wouldn't that be delicious, but he probably wouldn't say much, if anything. Sudden lapse of memory. It would probably be much worse for Watchtower if he actually talked.

  That would be satisfying too because it would show how inept the GB really is.
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  300

  ALERT: NEW LAWSUIT settlement - $13 MILLION

  by Watchtower-Free in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/135m-awarded-to-bible-teacher-gonzalo-campos-alleged-abuse-victim-jose-lopez-281031832.html.

  (published thursday, oct 30, 2014).

  thursday, oct 30, 2014 updated at 11:58 pm pdt.

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  ScenicViewer

  Rocky Copley, Esq. (To the Court): "These are just men who get together and discuss spirìtual concepts. That is it. It's like the Dalai Lama. The Dalai Lama, for their religion.

  I'm a little puzzled why the Dalai Lama defense would be a sound angle of argument. The Dalai Lama is an actual person, and I get the impression that Watchtower lawyers were trying to argue that the Governing Body is simply a spiritual entity that can't be brought to court.

  On another note, Watchtower has made many remarks regarding the Dalai Lama. To them he is a substitute for God; they have called him a 'god-king,' and a 'god among men who is deified and reverenced.' Here are 2 quotes from the Watchtower, but there are many more.

  "...Tibet’s exiled Buddhist “god-king,” the Dalai Lama." (Watchtower 8-1-1990, page 22)

  "...many men and women alive today are raised to the position of gods among men; they are deified and reverenced and hailed as saviors and world benefactors. This goes not only for political figures...but also for religious figures such as...the Dalai or Grand Lama of Tibet." (Watchtower 11-1-1951, page 656)

  By making the Dalai Lama argument, the lawyers were acknowleging that the Governing Body is a god-like entity that is to be deified, reverenced, and viewed as a savior. We all knew that the GB has made itself a substitute for God and Christ (savior), but to see Watchtower admit it is kind of satisfying.
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  300

  ALERT: NEW LAWSUIT settlement - $13 MILLION

  by Watchtower-Free in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/135m-awarded-to-bible-teacher-gonzalo-campos-alleged-abuse-victim-jose-lopez-281031832.html.

  (published thursday, oct 30, 2014).

  thursday, oct 30, 2014 updated at 11:58 pm pdt.

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  ScenicViewer

  BOTR: "It was a default judgment. Unbelievable. $13 million award in a default case. It will be interesting to see what CA appeals courts do."

  I noticed in the news article, linked by sir82, that the appeals courts have already upheld Judge Lewis' rulings, at least to some extent. Perhaps there are other things to be contested besides the "rulings on the court orders," and maybe there are other levels of appeal available to Watchtower, but when attorneys continue to refuse to hand over documents and witnesses what is the judge supposed to do? That can't go on forever.

  Here is a quote from the article, found near the end of the second page.

  U-T San Diego: Both the state appeals court and state Supreme Court upheld Judge Lewis’ rulings on the court orders, which the Watchtower continued to rebuff.

  Here is the link to the article again, http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2014/oct/31/jehovahs-witness-sex-abuse-judgment-lopez/
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  20

  What Kingdom Halls do you know of that have been closed down recently?

  by 4thgen in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  recently, we drove by the kingdom hall in galena, il, the sign was removed and it was closed down.

  a while back, the hall in taylor mo was also closed.

  one congregation in peoria, il was dissolved last year.

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  ScenicViewer

  How about a hall that never got built?

  There are 4 conregations using my old Hall, 2 English and 2 Spanish. About 10 years ago all bodies of elders decided it was time to build a second hall. Donation slips were passed around to get an idea of how much money would be contributed on a regular basis, and property was located. A couple of years later the 2 English congregations began to shrink while the 2 Spanish were growing rapidly. It was the growth of the 2 Spanish congegationrs that was the main impetus behind getting a new Hall, because they were anticipating needing to make a 3rd congregation.

  As of today I don't believe the 2 English have recovered, the likelihood is they are smaller than before, so not much financial support coming from the English side, and the Spanish congregations can't finance it all on their own. I am not sure of the state of the 2 Spanish, whether they are still growing or if they have started to shrink. I am told that the Circuit Overseer axed the project.

  It's pretty dismal that 4 to 5 congregations together can't afford a new Hall, but the fact is it was never built due to lack of support.
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  92

  San Francisco Giants vs. Kansas City Royals - World Series Winners ?

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  once again for the 3rd time in 5 years my favorite baseball team the s.f.

  giants are headed to the world series !

  so who do you think will win this years series and your reasons for your predictions ?

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  ScenicViewer

  These are fun games to watch. Very good World Series.
• 
  24

  SAY WHAAAAT? YOU CRAZY DUDE!

  by sparrowdown in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  seriously, endured a torturous conversation with an active jdub yesterday.

  and he was frothing at the mouth about how "muslims are doing the right thing with .

  executing the....." he then went on to list everyone from drugdealers to thieves to fornicators.. he said "countries where this sort of thing is happening have got it right!

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  ScenicViewer

  Of course the same Muslims that behead alduterers, etc, would also behead Jehovah's Witnesses for being infidels.

  There are no Jehovah's Witnesses in Afghanistan or Somalia, both Muslim countries.
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  24

  SAY WHAAAAT? YOU CRAZY DUDE!

  by sparrowdown in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  seriously, endured a torturous conversation with an active jdub yesterday.

  and he was frothing at the mouth about how "muslims are doing the right thing with .

  executing the....." he then went on to list everyone from drugdealers to thieves to fornicators.. he said "countries where this sort of thing is happening have got it right!

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  ScenicViewer

  Who in the world says "those ones?"

  People who have been programmed by cult like thinking, that's who.

  He thinks that cutting off peoples heads is happifying to God!
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  7

  LET'S ASK the anointed GB some questions . . .

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  okay mr. anointed governing body elder, tell me exactly.

  q: how you know what jehovah wants "channeled" into the watchtower?.

  1. j. f. rutherford, preparation, watch tower bible & tract society, 1933, page 64, 67, "enlightenment proceeds from jehovah by and through christ jesus and is given to the faithful anointed on earth at the temple, and brings great peace and consolation to them.

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  ScenicViewer

  Okay Mr. Anointed Governing Body Elder, tell me EXACTLY...

  Only if they would answer! Sadly, anyone seeking "waters of truth" from Watchtower's Governing Body will be sorely disappointed.

  In 2011 the Organization stopped answering questions that were written in. Frankly I doubt that the actual Governing Body was ever bothered with answering questions in the first place, but now you get nothing from any part of the organization.

  From the Watchtower:

  "Neither the branch office nor world headquarters is in a position to analyze and answer all such questions that have not been considered in our literature.

  “Of course, there are some topics and scriptures that our publications have not specifically addressed. And even where we have commented on a particular Bible text, we may not have dealt with the specific question that you have in mind. Also, some Bible accounts raise questions because not all the details are spelled out in the Scriptures. Thus, we cannot find immediate answers to every question that arises…" (W 10-15-11 Regular Edition, Questions From Readers)

  So, if the canned answers in the literature aren't good enough, and they admit they haven't answered every question, then we are out of luck.

  To not answer questions, from an Organization that claims to be 'God's channel of truth' and 'God's spokesman,' is embarassing.

  It seems the Watchtower well of truth and knowlege had dried up.
• 
  92

  San Francisco Giants vs. Kansas City Royals - World Series Winners ?

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  once again for the 3rd time in 5 years my favorite baseball team the s.f.

  giants are headed to the world series !

  so who do you think will win this years series and your reasons for your predictions ?

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  ScenicViewer

  When my team isn't in the playoffs I tend to latch on to an underdog team that catches my interest. This year it's the Royals. They are young, enthusiastic, and fun to watch.

  Most of the games they've played until now have been very close, 1 run games, and quite a few have gone into extra innings. But the series they've played haven't been close, they have swept them all. They seen to be tenacious, and know how to hang in there until they win it.

  The Giants have won 2 World Series very recently, but it's been 29 years for KC, so the Royals are a sentimental favorite, but I think they have the team that can go all the way.

  BTW, I wish my team, who I'm not mentioning because they were embarassing, had Buster Posey catching. He is the one thing I love about the Giants!
• 
  24

  Let's Say 1914 Was The Establishment of God's Kingdom....what is the significance?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as hillary clinton might say, what difference does it make???.

  even if god's kingdom was established in 1914, why is that such a big deal?

  other than unprovable actions in heaven, what can jws say is the significance of it all...with a straight face?.

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  ScenicViewer

  There is another event that coincides with Jesus becoming King in 1914 that matters too, and unlike Jesus' invisible appointment as King it is a visible event.

  It also happens to be the only thing about 1914 that Watchtower says today that it also said in C.T. Russel's time. And that is it's the end of the Gentile Times. That means it's the end, or the farthest limit, of mankind's rulership of itself. Here's how Russell explained it.

  "In this chapter we will present the Bible evidence proving that the full end of the times of the Gentiles, i.e., the full end of their lease of dominion, will be reached in A.D. 1914; and that date will see the disintegration of the rule of imperfect men." (The Time Is at Hand, Studies in the Scriptures, Volume 2, 1907 ed., page 76, par 2) -bold emphasis added.

  Here we are, 100 years later, and the Nations (Gentiles) have not disintegrated at all, but are still clearly ruling themselves. Unless I'm missing something this visible event, that did not happen, should prove that the coinciding invisible event of Jesus becoming King also did not happen.

  1914, and all that Watchtower has said about it, has been a complete failure.