allelsefails

Joined

• started 12 topics
• posted 394 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by allelsefails

• 
  206

  i am a regular pioneer in my cong reading crisis of conscience.here goes...

  by MsGrowingGirl20 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm on page 90 right now...the info is definitely new and gives me a totally diff view as to how i used to think of faithful and discreet slave.

  i was thoroughly disgusted with the way the brothers handled the oral sex and leadership problem and the insight on the scriptures book...... still have alot of questions though.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails
• 
  1495

  An Old Argument.... does it hold water?

  by AK - Jeff in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  estimates range from 4 million to 15 million children die from starvation each year on this planet.

  that's between 500 and 1700 children a day, depending on what numbers you accept.

  still, no matter which numbers you use, doesn't this make you arrive at one of the following conclusions?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  I know it was five days ago, but when I answer the original question it is a difficult one. I believe in a god - creator. He has allowed the suffering of mankind with the knowledge that he can undo all that has been done. He grieves for the child who starves ..... just as he did for his own son on the cross. In a "new World" either heaven or earth all the former things have passed away and even the memory of suffuring is done away with.....

  At the same time the Atheist has the more reasonable arguement "prove it" or I won't belive it. I can't prove it. I believe science has stated "life comes from life" and we disproved spontaneous generation of life a few hundred years ago. With evolution we go back to that life comes from no life. No science has shown that possible or likely. The spark of life and the consciousness of man force me to accept something more than "survival of the fittest" or "evolutionary imperative" to explain. I do believe in the evolution of species, but life from no life? Can't find the science.....

  I do believe in a personal god. A god who has revealed himself in a variety of ways. Not the most benevolent and kind, but real enough. It is not beyond a reasonable doubt, but "a peronderance of the evidence" I think.
• 
  34

  Are you an "apostate"?

  by cedars in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm quite new to this site, and i've noticed that many of you are more than happy to call yourselves "apostates", even though many of you evidently believe in the bible and in jesus as saviour, etc.. i'm aware that the society brands anyone who disagrees with them as being an "apostate", but just because they choose to do this, does this mean we should be comfortable with being so branded?

  should we "bend over" and take it?.

  here is what the insight book says on apostasy:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  For me I know that I am not an apostate from God or Christ, but I am an apostate from the JWs. I joined them then rejected their idiotic teachings - "I stand away from them" - an apostate. Most JWs are apostate Catholics or Baptists (JWs rarely convert a pagan, Jew, Muslim or atheist) That is what the word means. I don't define any language I use with the "Insight Book". Should all religions be offended because the are "Babylon the Great"? Only if they believe insane misapplication requires a response....
• 
  42

  Im being disfellowshipped

  by newcomer1982 in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i was supposed to go to a judical meeting on sat but i told the elders i wasnt going but they held it anyway.

  its going to be announced that im going to be disfellowshipped at the weekend.

  hate the fact my parents wont talk to me anymore.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  Interesting thoughts from everybody. We all have different ways of handling this kind of thing. I went to my JC got convicted of "apostasy", but was privately reproved..... WTF???? Anyway I did it on purpose so that I could maintain contact with my family (adult children, syblings, parents) also I work for and with witnesses that I like having free communication with as well. Technically I'm still "IN" but they leave me alone.

  We on this site are here for you. Many different beliefs and range of stories, but we understand and we don't judge. ( Almost never...)

  Allelsefails
• 
  30

  SEX! and the DC Sunday Drama

  by Red Piller in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the sunday drama at the dc was a parallel ancient (joseph in egypt) and modern (jw kid in high school) drama.

  or was it extremely eroticized?

  i've been seeing these my whole life and have never felt this way.. conversation between joseph and fellow prison inmate:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  Good point Folllowedmyheart I knew one bethelite as a close friend and he turned out to be gay. I felt this drama was idiotic all the way around. I know the elders are instructed not to weigh the evidence from "worldly" people or "internet gossip" the way they would a real accusation (from a witness). I was an elder for 6 years I would have went to the young brother - if he was a"good" boy and denied it - that would be the end of the judicial matter. If he was a "bad" Kid he would probably be DF'd. BTW - that is why I won't be an elder again...
• 
  14

  Elder's Manual

  by outsmartthesystem in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  first and foremost....if anyone out there has access to one and trusts me...please pm me.

  i am dying to get my hands on a full copy.

  but if not....can someone at least confirm.....does it expressly say (somewhere in the manual) that simply not accepting society based doctrine is grounds for disfellowshipping (on charges of apostasy?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  I recently had a Judicial Committee for Apostasy. I have written a letter to the branch asking questions. The branch decided they were "too busy" to answer my questions. They had the local elders come to me and NOT try to answer my questions. Then they were instructed by the branch to have a judicial committe with me. To determine what kind of "help" they could offer me.

  The ONE and Only question they cared about was "Do you believe the Governing Body is the group Jehovah is using to cokmmunicate with men today in fulfillment of Matt 24:45?" I said yes because my wife asked me not to get disfellowshipped.

  I was convicted of Apostasy (which I denied constantly) but given a private reproof. Interesting fact of Judicial committee - You can't appeal a private reproof (or public) only disfellowshipping can be appealed. So no chance to appeal. Now I am not allowed comments at meetings or any of the other things I had to "spread" my ideas.

  If you would like any of the specifics here just PM me and I can forward copies of letters and research I gave GB and elders and received. I was an elder for 6 years and I know "both sides of the table".
• 
  67

  Sept. 15th WT - Burdened with Earning a Living? Here! Have MORE Burdens !

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  as if the other sept. 15th wt thread i started weren't controlling enough - in another study article titled " run ..... that you may attain it " were you aware that just eating and wearing clothes on your body - might be a " stumbling block " to you ?

  in a prior article on pg.

  12 , paragraph 6 the wt society sets up what they are trying to get across by stating, " people of the world tend to seek personal interests first as " men of this system of things, whose share is this life.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  It is because of crap like this I am where I am. "You're never going to graduate HS" "You don't need to worry about retirement or the future financially" stuff burned into my mind. Now I'm sitting here with all the ability in the woeld at 35 yrs old and can't provide my wife the kind of life we want together. Not looking for luxury, but a little education would have went a long way.....
• 
  12

  How are Bible Studies Conducted?

  by Band on the Run in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i never found a victim and then i was out.

  may i ask you how it felt to have the umbrage to go to someone's house, bring a bible, and witness lit, and teach another person about the bible.

  the witness lit was always so dorky.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  Its funny. JWs actually teach you to read the bible more at bible studies. It is very easy to make the Bible say... whatever you want it to say. There is a gradual build of "facts" from scripture that work to "principles" we follow that lead to nonsense we believe. But if you reject the nonsense you have to reject the scriptural facts that it was built on. If you are willing to do that then you are dumped.
• 
  39

  on the subject of elders reading this message board

  by cptkirk in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i'm still laughing to myself thinking about elders/bethelites reading this messageboard.

  yet another contradiction to throw in the basket.

  didn't they always say how dangerous it is to read anything that contradicts the teachings of the wts?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  In my years I think there are 2 groups of witnesses. The "in" Bethelites, COs, DOs, Elders, MSs, Pioneers. And the "others" not quite right. Both groups believe or disbelieve at the same rate. I have found many a "other" that doesn't believe everything. I also have talked to elders and pioneers that don't believe everything. I heard of the "586 apostasy from a CO" he downplayed it, but it was interesting that he knew all about it and would discuss it.

  I do believe that "others" would have no problem looking at a site like this. They don't believe everything anyway, but they will be the same people that might turn in someone they find out on this site. Sometimes people who don't believe the teachings will defend the "org". I've heard many repeat the "where else would we go?" misquote. Defending your religion for many has nothing to do with their teachings. Catholics will defend their Church without understanding half the teachings. Some people can't bear the thought of life without their precious religion. right or wrong makes no difference to them.
• 
  18

  Confirmation Bias

  by allelsefails in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've read a lot of crap in my life (not just wts) and i have finally found the phrase to describe almost every religious wrting i've read.

  "confirmation bias" affects how jws look at historical facts, how dems and repubs look at economic facts, or how all people look at information presented to them.

  i still go to meetings every once in a while to make my wife and my boss feel better about me, but sometimes i can't believe how idiotic some things are.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  allelsefails

  SBC - Thanks for Shermer that was great. It is certainly difficult to seperate TRUTH from what you are led to believe.

  "Critical Thinking" is awesome, but you are the only one who can tell you what that standard is. Just watched a show where there are "rogue" scientists that deny Quantum theory for believing an electron is a wave and a particle all the time instead of sometimes a wave and sometimes a particle. I don't understand half of it, but the point is there is no absolute truth..... to find one is to close your mind to all facts, experiments, and research.