the 7 times of daniel = jesus returning invisibly in 1914 and being enthroned in heaven?.
daniel 4:23-33 (new world translation):.
23 and because the king beheld a watcher, even a holy one, coming down from the heavens, who was also saying: chop the tree down, and ruin it.
the correct interpretation of a prophecy must be based on Jesus' testimony , on Jesus teaching .
and Jesus teached that the Kingdom was set in Heavens at the time of His first coming (clik here and read posts 28,30 )
the purpose of His second coming remained to be ... the "bringing" on earth (or its extension over the earth ) of this Heavenly Kingdom
so, the interpretation given by society to Daniel 6 is not based on Christ teaching and not from God
do you all realize how tough it is for a second-generation witness?
what about a third-generation witness?
fourth?.
BF , please receive a few words from me (not very "english" words )
I read your first post...
what happens now , is from Jehovah"s hand !
Jehovah doesn't require to his believers to quit worshiping Him ! He requires to do it according to the truth !
and the "truth" He delivered through His Son . It is the love for truth that may "educate" an long-time worshiper of Jehovah what to do in the present circumstances.
as purplesofa said , the aim may not be to leave the wt with any price , but should be to obey Jehovah with all our power... and doing that , surely, a fight is aproaching at horizont....
the real problem teached specially by Bible prophecyes is that the wt org. is not the "Kingdom of God"
the judgement started at God's House in autumn 2005 and it is going for 10 years , and Jesus command for us is to "seek God's Kingdom"...
the present living generation have to leave this wt organisation in order to enter in God's Kingdom( because the wt is ready for distruction by Jehovah Himself)
well, the first ones entered on kingdom will have some priviledges , but Jehovah does not forget his sheep (sincere ones as you who cannot live without faithfull relatives in ) and immediately after spring 2012 He will proceed to make free them as He made free his people back in Egypt ... see Micah 7:15.( tell to your relatives this verse and ask them what do they think that means ? )
the true knowledge of God's word together with your own fath in it may act as comfort and as a preparation for the future battle....
let you be interested in God's word as Jesus teached , and believe his word
the actions going on with this org. and its members represent Jehovah's judgement over/on/with his people which include destroing the "weeds" and their wt organisation and slavation of those who "tremble at his Word"
wantingtruth
it needs to be said: the watchtower society is teaching its most involved adherents a powerful lesson in disloyalty.
it should be no surprize that the watchtower endlessly prates on about loyalty.
what has changed however, is the sudden sacrifice of bethelites and others to come in the pursuit of its greedy survival.
Not to wonder that they will pay a heavy price !
in fact , no word in Bible that God has had to "provide" his faithfull with an ....earthly organisation...never found that in Bible...
it were the ambitious one from within his people who "invented" a "earthly organisation" with the purpose that it will became His Kingdom on earth !
But the bible clearly says:
Psalm 127
1 Except Jehovah build the house, They labor in vain that build it: Except Jehovah keep the city, The watchman waketh but in vain.
The men who built this organisation were manifesting the spirit of those who started to build Babel
Genesis 11
4 And they said, Come, let us build us a city, and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven, and let us make us a name; lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.
furthermore, they wanted to bring to themselves "all peoples and all nations" as shown here
Habakkuk 1
6 For, lo, I raise up the Chaldeans, that bitter and hasty nation, that march through the breadth of the earth, to possess dwelling-places that are not theirs.
10 Yea, he scoffeth at kings, and princes are a derision unto him; he derideth every stronghold; for he heapeth up dust, and taketh it. ....................
15 He taketh up all of them with the angle, he catcheth them in his net, and gathereth them in his drag: therefore he rejoiceth and is glad.
16 Therefore he sacrificeth unto his net, and burneth incense unto his drag; because by them his portion is fat, and his food plenteous.
17 Shall he therefore empty his net, and spare not to slay the nations continually?
Habakkuk 2
5 Yea, moreover, wine is treacherous, a haughty man ( the FDS ), that keepeth not at home; who enlargeth his desire as Sheol, and he is as death, and cannot be satisfied, but gathereth unto him all nations, and heapeth unto him all peoples.
6 Shall not all these take up a parable against him, and a taunting proverb against him, and say, Woe to him that increaseth that which is not his! how long? and that ladeth himself with pledges!
7 Shall they not rise up suddenly that shall bite thee, and awake that shall vex thee, and thou shalt be for booty unto them?
8 Because thou hast plundered many nations, all the remnant of the peoples shall plunder thee, because of men's blood, and for the violence done to the land, to the city and to all that dwell therein.
12 Woe to him that buildeth a town with blood, and establisheth a city by iniquity!
In the above quotation we see that the makers of this org. together with all who idolatrise it will have an shamefull end from Jehovah's hand !
But God's worshippers are invited by Jesus to seek first the Kingdom of God, or of Heavens and its righteousness / Matt.6:33.
a correct knowledge regarding God's Kingdom in Heaven is required , also , in order to understand how this Kingdom will come on earth
see here a few words about when started the Kingdom in Heaven , as Jesus teached , read the posts 28 and 30
wantingtruth
will this perhaps only "appear" as destruction of religion?.
could it be that religion will simply go through a reformation?.
hasn't the political and religious element always been bedfellows?.
oh, oh, "sunrising" ,
it is not that your "message" come from "north" ? ... Daniel 11:44.
by the way , I have read something similar with your message here
you are welcome , "sunrising" !
wantingtruth
today's watchtower was nice.
under the heading:.
satan - a defiant adversary and apostate.
Quote the AH :
"Why are the GB members so anxiously nervous about themselves and their teachings, they start a members only WT. as one example and there are many others.
The simple answer to this is they are now aware of all the information about them on the NET. information that they cant control, they cant disfellowship the inter-net.
It was easy before when they came across opposers they would simply DF them or demonetize with a label to keep them away from the flock,
now the inter-net appears with a mountain of evidence against them and they cant do a dam thing about it.
Its no wonder they are getting more cultish and try put up a bigger wall up and around themselves."
==========================================
friends , I think you know what is that.... it is war , a "spiritual war"
the WT organisation is the last fortress of Satan on earth (before his being caught and bound ) in his fight against the Kingdom of Christ !
The WT leaders/GB and others are represented in prophecy by Pharaoh of Egypt , who make his heart hardened when he met God's message
in our days God facilitates the "revelation" of the hidden things and wrongdoings of the Man of Lawlessness/Pharaoh asking him to let the sheep free to worship Him as Jesus taught them, "with spirit and with truth" ,
but he , the GB is more and more hardening his hearth , untill he will meet God's judgement and annihilation
but God will proceed to release his sheep from slavery , as it is written in Micah 7:15.
you may read here
and here
on may 19th, theodore jaracz had a stroke.
he's in very serious condition in the hospital.. that's all the information i have for now.. barb.
it seems you are overstrung...waiting for news..
take a break ... and listen to
most jws dread the thought of never being talked to again by a fellow "brother" or "sister".
the thought of being shunned by your flesh and blood keeps many witnesses in the religion.. is df'ing or dissasociation all that terrible?
?.
megaflower said:
" I DA myself and would do it again. Iam glad I took a stand. I did it for me,it gave me peace of mind."
###############
I fully agree with that !
well?.
.
bf.
you gave a good answer !
in fact , there isn't a such thing in Bible named "God's earthly organisation" (even spirit directed)
God has "people" on earth today .... the fact that his people has to obey His commandments make him "distinct" people like old Israel Deut 4:1-9
from Jesus onward this people is composed by all "congregations" of Christ , so, no-organisation
in the Congregation God appointed no GB , but : 1Cor 12
28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondly prophets, thirdly teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, divers kinds of tongues.
29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
the wt "definition" for organisation somehow would fit with "God's Kingdom" , but the kingdom is only in Heaven now , not yet on earth !
the christians were taught by Jesus to pray for its coming on earth : only then , the "real" arrangement of God will be on earth !
until then, we live in expectation of its "coming"
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, touching the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and our gathering together unto him;
2 to the end that ye be not quickly shaken from your mind, nor yet be troubled, either by spirit, or by word, or by epistle as from us, as that the day of the Lord is just at hand;
3 let no man beguile you in any wise: for it will not be, except the falling away come first, and the man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition,
4 he that opposeth and exalteth himself against all that is called God or that is worshipped; so that he sitteth in the temple of God, setting himself forth as God.....
on may 19th, theodore jaracz had a stroke.
he's in very serious condition in the hospital.. that's all the information i have for now.. barb.
Thank you B. A. for the information !
it was all necessary for us
all the information confirms the fact that those who are/where "leaders" over the simple believers are in fact "weeds" (and not wheat)
the harvest is here , the judgement has begun from "God's house" , the "stars" are falling down from "heaven" - God is right !
the "Beast" together with "the false prophet" is just now being "caught"
we are living today the "spiritual" fulfillment of Ezekiel 21:25-27
25. " 'O profane and wicked prince of Israel, whose day has come, whose time of punishment has reached its climax,
26. this is what the Sovereign LORD says: Take off the turban, remove the crown. It will not be as it was: The lowly will be exalted and the exalted will be brought low.
27. A ruin! A ruin! I will make it a ruin! It will not be restored until he comes to whom it rightfully belongs; to him I will give it.'
yet a little time and the Kingdom will be given to "HIM"
who is HIM ? "that one which right now is lowly "
please, all of you, try to understand the prophecies -- they represents "God's point of view" !
the beast also was represented by the "daughter of Babylon" see what is to happen with "her" : read all Isaiah 47.
Greetings,
friendly, wantingtruth
hi all on this forum.. i am very confused and lost and annoyed.. i was a jw for 28 years and then left not really believing and not really sure if there was a good or not, there was just to much hypocrisy in the kh and within the society.. dont be materalistic yet some pioneers seem to be able to have three cars and go on three holidays a year and somehow still make there hours.. the other point that really annoyed me was that my sister was treated like a criminal when she was dissfellowshipped which she was forced into, a elder would not stop coming to see her to convince her to come even if it was just for my parents, he said the only way this would stop is if she was to dissfellowship herself, now she was single living alone and saw no other choice but to do this.. so she was ignored and when she moved back to the scotland to get help with a wee one she had she did get help from my folks untill a elder reported them to the co and they had to stop.
now she was getting married so is no longer going to live in sin and my folks refused to go to the wedding as they would lose there position in the kh - despite that they decided to park outside the hotel so they could see my sister and kids go into the hotel and see them in there outfits, it is just wrong my sister was so hurt by this and her husband my best mate was so angry.
due to all that has happend over the year i dont know if i believe in god now,i would love to but i dont know how and whom do i trust.. .
