I just started a community blog. http://jehovahswitnessesblog.blogspot.com/ Please PM me if you want to become a contributer. This is a little easier than starting your own blog. People who already have a site or blog are also invited. They can use this to promote their existing site.
Posts by DT
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48Major anti-cult campaign in autumn? Post here if interested
by rebel8 inso we already have this thread which has separate actions for next month: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/179142/2/make-august-2009-the-dawn-of-the-mass-exodus-the-beginning-of-the-end-of-the-watchtower-org.
i don't intend to discourage anyone from participating in that.
those actions are meant to educate current jws (help people leave).
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55
Make August 2009 the dawn of the "mass exodus"...the beginning of the end of the Watchtower org!
by koolaid-man inthe watchtower organization is without doubt doing everything they can to keep their business afloat.
they are at a critical point in their ever so blemished present condition.
there is simply too much genuine criticism from not only those on the outside but, also from those on the inside.
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DT
There are some good ideas on this thread.
I would like to suggest starting some blogs. If you write letters and get responses, then you can post it on the blog for everyone to see. Starting a blog is not very difficult at all, especially if you use a platform like Blogger.com. If the blogs link to other critical sites, then it can really improve their traffic and search engine ratings. This works well with any campaign to write letters to the media because they will find better information when they do their research.
I'm willing to provide help if anyone needs assistance getting set up. Just PM me. I'm also willing to consider the idea of a community blog with several authors, if others are interested.
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Is punishing someone for changing their religion against international law
by ldrnomo ini saw this on wikipedia:.
the united nations commission on human rights, considers the recanting of a person's religion a human right legally protected by the international covenant on civil and political rights: "the committee observes that the freedom to 'have or to adopt' a religion or belief necessarily entails the freedom to choose a religion or belief, including the right to replace one's current religion or belief with another or to adopt atheistic views [...] article 18.2 bars coercion that would impair the right to have or adopt a religion or belief, including the use of threat of physical force or penal sanctions to compel believers or non-believers to adhere to their religious beliefs and congregations, to recant their religion or belief or to convert."[5].
seems to me that being shunned by family and friends for quitting jehovah's witnesses would be penal sanctions.. .
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DT
I wish Russia would rethink their proposal to ban Jehovah's Witnesses. They would probably have more success if they applied these human rights standards to allow former members to sue the Watchtower Society for human rights violations. Instead of appearing as a bully picking on a religious minority, they could be praised for sticking up for basic human liberties. Other countries would likely follow and the Watchtower Society would regret the day they ever messed with Russia.
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Something that can be said to JW's at the door
by DT inimagine this conversation.. witness: so would you enjoy reading this book which explains the bible based hope for everlasting life on a paradise earth?.
householder: yes, i would love to read that.
it sounds fascinating.
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DT
Reniaa,
Thanks. This is very welcome information. (I can't say why yet.) Actually, I was just at Watchtower.org, but failed to notice that they have one of their books available digitally. This is a positive step. It will open up their publications to greater scrutiny and make it easier to demonstrate what Jehovah's Witnesses actually believe. I doubt that they will do the same with their private edition Watchtowers, but I'd be happy if I'm wrong. I know they have audio recordings, but you can't copy and paste and provide commentary.
By the way, how do you pronounce your name? I'm just curious.
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26
Is punishing someone for changing their religion against international law
by ldrnomo ini saw this on wikipedia:.
the united nations commission on human rights, considers the recanting of a person's religion a human right legally protected by the international covenant on civil and political rights: "the committee observes that the freedom to 'have or to adopt' a religion or belief necessarily entails the freedom to choose a religion or belief, including the right to replace one's current religion or belief with another or to adopt atheistic views [...] article 18.2 bars coercion that would impair the right to have or adopt a religion or belief, including the use of threat of physical force or penal sanctions to compel believers or non-believers to adhere to their religious beliefs and congregations, to recant their religion or belief or to convert."[5].
seems to me that being shunned by family and friends for quitting jehovah's witnesses would be penal sanctions.. .
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DT
Just a perspective from someone who isn't qualified to give legal advice. I seem to recall reading that the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights has been accepted by the United States, but isn't directly enforceable in the United States. Instead the United States has a theoretical responsibility to enact laws that support the principles of that covenant. However, I believe that covenant can still be used in certain court cases to illustrate how U.S. laws can or should be applied.
The problem I see is that it is difficult to get a case about organisationally enforced shunning (Its silly to sue individuals for exercising their right to shun.) to be heard in court without being thrown out on the basis that it would involve interference with church procedures. If a case gets past that hurdle, then the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights may be of some use. It's also possible that another country would take this seriously as a basic human rights issue and set the example for other countries.
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58
Atheists choose 'de-baptism' to renounce childhood faith
by whereami indo you think the wts would except this?.
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http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2009-07-21-atheists-debaptism_n.htm?csp=usat.me.
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DT
"I hope that God surprises you one day and lets you know that He is quite well."
Wouldn't that be a pleasant surprise. I'm starting to get concerned about him. Nobody has heard from him in an awfully long time. Maybe he is sick and in bed or stuck on his "throne" with an upset belly.
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Something that can be said to JW's at the door
by DT inimagine this conversation.. witness: so would you enjoy reading this book which explains the bible based hope for everlasting life on a paradise earth?.
householder: yes, i would love to read that.
it sounds fascinating.
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DT
Imagine this conversation.
Witness: So would you enjoy reading this book which explains the Bible based hope for everlasting life on a paradise earth?
Householder: Yes, I would love to read that. It sounds fascinating. However, I would prefer to conserve resources and read it online. After all, if I'm going to live forever on this planet, I should start taking care of it. Can you tell me where I can find it online. If it's available in a format that I can use in my ebook reader that would be great!
Witness: I don't think it's available online. We do have a website called Watchtower.org.
Householder: Ok, I'll check it out, but I really want to read that book. Websites can be pretty superficial. I'm not sure if it will answer my questions. If you don't have the link handy, I can give you my email address and you can send it to me.
Witness: I don't think that would work. I don't have Internet access and I'm pretty sure its not on the official website.
Householder: Well, I'm very surprised. How does that make you feel to give up your Saturday morning and burn all that gas to knock on houses that are usually empty when the organisation that asks you to do this can't be bothered to post that book online?
Witness: I'm happy to be doing the work that Jesus and his disciples did.
Householder: Do you mean they went from house to house?
Witness: Yes.
Householder: Oh, I know they stayed in the homes of interested people, but other than that, I thought they weren't supposed to be "transferring from house to house". I know they preached in the marketplaces. I'm sure that was far more effective than knocking on doors. Isn't the Internet the biggest marketplace in history? I would think that you would want to make full use of it for preaching the "good news". Well, I'm sure someone could be bothered to make that book available electronically. I'll just do a Google search for "Jehovah's Witnesses". I'm sure I'll find something.
Witness: Oh no, that would be copyright infringement. The Watchtower Society has threatened legal action against people who post their publications online.
Householder: I understand that they own the copyright, but why would they object to distributing this information in a more efficient manner? Didn't you say it could result in everlasting life?
Witness: Yes, it can, but the Internet has a lot of apostate information from those who only want to persecute God's people. Posting this book online would just make it easier for apostates to criticise it.
Householder: But I want to consider both favorable and negative opinions about your organisation before I come to my own conclusion. However, it doesn't appear that your organisation is actually interested in distributing "life saving information". It appears that they are far more interested in shielding their members and the public from any opposing viewpoints. It sounds like your organisation might be a cult or high control group. I'm going to research your organization on the Internet to see if it's hiding anything.
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Apparently, I'm a feared apostate.
by DT ini disassociated suddenly and have have had almost no contact with the witnesses since then, so i don't have any way of knowing how notorious i've become in their eyes.
i have several blogs that are critical of jehovah's witnesses and although i don't use my name, it wouldn't be too hard to figure out who is behind them.. well, i recently heard a story that makes me think that i might be having some effect.
i have a friend i met at work who knew me when i was still a faithful dub.
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DT
Thanks for your comments.
Burn the Ships, I like your ideas. I'm not sure if I'd be willing to sacrifice my vacation time though in order to try to pull that off.
Cameo-d
"Did it hurt your feelings because of your friend being treated like that?
Or are you glad that maybe it drove home a point?
No, I thought it was funny and strangely satisfying. I'm glad my DA is having some kind of effect. I'm afraid it may have hurt his feelings, so I feel bad about that.
"Do you feel it damaged your reputation with your friend?"
Well, it took him a long time to mention this to me, but we are pretty good friends now. I think it might have helped him to see how vindictive JW's can be so maybe he can better empathise with apostates like me.
I'm amazed that they would be willing to "stumble" a new one because of their paranoid fear of apostates. If they had love, I would think they would be willing to take a chance in order to help someone who was showing interest.
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Apparently, I'm a feared apostate.
by DT ini disassociated suddenly and have have had almost no contact with the witnesses since then, so i don't have any way of knowing how notorious i've become in their eyes.
i have several blogs that are critical of jehovah's witnesses and although i don't use my name, it wouldn't be too hard to figure out who is behind them.. well, i recently heard a story that makes me think that i might be having some effect.
i have a friend i met at work who knew me when i was still a faithful dub.
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DT
I disassociated suddenly and have have had almost no contact with the witnesses since then, so I don't have any way of knowing how notorious I've become in their eyes. I have several blogs that are critical of Jehovah's Witnesses and although I don't use my name, it wouldn't be too hard to figure out who is behind them.
Well, I recently heard a story that makes me think that I might be having some effect. I have a friend I met at work who knew me when I was still a faithful dub. Meanwhile, he befriended some other Witnesses in his area and began attending the occasional meeting. So at one meeting, he innocently asks someone (maybe an elder?) if he knows me and adds that he is a friend of mine. He was asked to leave and had to walk home.
It's odd because I don't know many in that hall. Do you suppose I could have really acquired such a fearful reputation or is it more likely that someone was just trying to push his weight around and protect the flock from one of my acquaintances. Has anyone ever heard of this happening in other areas?
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15
I wonder if this would work
by JWinprotest inmy wife and i were discussing yesterday the pros and cons of fading vs disfellowshipping.
my wife mentioned that it would be extremely difficult to fade because we live so close to everyone and with two small kids it would be difficult to avoid members of the cong or ignore them when they come to our door.
so i came up with an idea and i wanted to run it by you first to see if it has been thought of before and if you think it can work.. here it is.
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DT
I think threats could work. You just might want to think of better threats. Legal threats can be very persuasive. Someone wrote a letter that is well worded for dealing with the possibility of a judicial committee. Maybe someone has the link. You can also threaten to wave a sign at every meeting advertising a critical website. Just make sure that you aren't on their property and not breaking any other laws.