Posts by flipper

43

What are the things that wake people up from the Watchtower Corporation?

by punkofnice in

when i became an elder i saw the dark side.

a side i previously believed couldn't possibly exist in the one true religion of the happiest people on earth.. then they rolled out 'overlapping generations(tm)' and that was the last straw.. all my life i had doubts but surpressed them thinking i was at fault and not the cult leaders.. it seems more likely that now the governing body are parading around like popes, wearing their expensive jewellery, that this will nauseate even dyed in the wool jws.. i wonder if the wake up can be condensed into main categories?.

1. experiencing the cruel handling of matters by the wbt$ reps.. 2. crazy doctrine (eg.

flipper

PUNK- Yeah, I definitely agree with you, it seems to be either suffering unjust treatment from others or authority figures within the JW cult or disagreeing with doctrines and teachings that get people to exit. I know I initially exited due to suffering unjust treatment from elders AND watching OTHER people suffer unjust treatment caused me to wake up also. Narrows it down quite nicely although at 7:15 A.M. in the morning out here in California on the west coast in the U.S. I'm not thinking too clearly right now. I can't think of any other reasons at the moment. Too early in the morning

212

Why Do You No Longer Believe in God?

by Tenacious in

i know this question has popped up from time to time but i really would like to know how you guys, those that no longer believe, came to that conclusion?

was it the wts and all its crap?

was it something you read?

flipper

Observing human behavior - the lies and manipulations done to control those lower on the food chain. And to put others lower on the food chain.

I was raised with the myths of Santa Claus, the tooth fairy, the easter bunny and God.

The message was simple: be good (obedient) and you will be rewarded. Be bad you will experience loss (no gifts, no attention). And with God the threat of torturous punishment.

Age 6 to 7 kids figure out no Santa, fairy or bunny and adults admit it's just fun stuff for little kids.

My kid mind thinks that they wait till high school or so to tell you about God. Then realizing they believe it themselves, and how useful their belief is to keep them in line to authority.

As someone stated earlier, the whole gruesome set up of living things eating each other certainly didn't point to some loving sky entity.

To a lot of my family members "atheist" was a horrible, unthinkable thing so I learned to keep to myself about it until adulthood.

Read the bible a bit as a kid and thought it was ridiculous stuff made up to control people. I've always been blown away by the blind faith people have - to believe something with no evidence. To "just know it"

I understand the human need for magic and escape from the reality of death. My early conditioning kicks in in times of loss and grieving. I find myself wishing for some spirit message from the departed, looking around for signs.

Mrs. F

15

Jehovah's Witnesses are not Christians. It's impossible.

by DATA-DOG in

good morning.

i was just checking out the forum and something occured to me.

jws simply cannot be christians.

flipper

The word "Christian" is nothing more than a marketing tool for the Watchtower.

Not religious myself, but it seems Christianity tries to promote kindness, generosity, forgiveness. Ain't much of that in the jw religion.

As a kid sent to Catholic grade school, I thought that religion was mean and petty. The jws are way worse. And the closer to the top the worse it gets.

They behave like they were raised by wolves. What is more mean and selfish than sucking up to god by throwing your family under the bus (shunning) so that you can cheat death.

Mrs. F

13

All C. O. D.O Who Became Governing Body Members Hands Are Dirty In Many Child Molestation Cases Cover Up Lawsuits

by Brokeback Watchtower in

what say you and i bet when records get subpoenaed many get grilled in court.

flipper

BROKEBACK- You make a good and very valid point in this thread. I mean think about it : Why else would the GB not allow Losch to testify in the Gilbert Lopez San Diego child abuse lawsuit trial and why else would WT leaders refuse to allow the courts to see the database pedophile list of 20,000 or more when requested by the judge in that trial ? And that the WT Society was more willing to pay out 13.5 million $$$$ to Lopez in order not to reveal the details of their database pedophile list ? You bet your sweet ass there is some damaging information on that database list. No worries. It will all tumble out of the closet I believe in true WT skeleton form in the next several years

9

is there trully a GOD

by piledriver in

the answer every person and religion wants to know is .

is there trully a god no false prophets yes .theres two many to even think about who just want your money and time to spread there evil word .no god is more important in this lifetime that you have on this world than the love you recive and give to your real family .

anyone who is a jehovah's witnesses trully knows they are in a cult not a religion minipulated and threatend with emotional blackmail and pain it makes them feed off your sadness and manipulate there flock into beiving this what jehovah ( false prophet) wants pure sanctamonius bullshit read the book shepard the flock of god charles teze russle was the founder but and since jesus is the founder of chrisianity the organisation regard him as the true founder of there fake faith plus he c.t russle was a child molester .

flipper

" Is there truly a God " ?

Possibly not, who knows ? None of us really know. Personally I kind of doubt " God's " existence - but the key is to not lose sleep over it- go live your life. It's not that big of a deal. We can be good people and do good things for others without needing to be " rewarded " for our efforts from a " sky daddy " or " sky mommy ". The " reward " is in seeing people be happy from our efforts at making peaceful relations with others and allowing people the freedom to make their own life's decisions. And honoring the dignity of our fellow humans. Peace out, Mr. Flipper

6

How "aboat" those Royals!

by KC_ROYALS in

jw
friends

woohoo!

how "aboat" em?

congrats, kansas city!

flipper

I'm really hoping the Royals will beat New York even though I'm usually a National league fan more so since I'm a huge San Francisco Giants fan. But we beat K.C. last year so I'm rooting for K.C. to seal the deal and take their turn to win it all for the first time since 1985.

Also I have good friends on the board who are big Chicago Cubs fans and were bummed out along with myself that the Cubs didn't make it to the World Series. So I'd like to see K.C. spank New York. But I do tip my hat to the New York Mets- they certainly have the pitching AND the hitting to go all the way - I wouldn't be surprised to see them beat K.C. - they have the talent- but sentimentally I want K.C. I really have no horse in this race I just enjoy good , exciting baseball

70

Any funny stories of when a"brother" giving a talk, said something "funny" or "questionable", and didn't even realize it?

by Dunedain in

there were always all types of speakers in the org.

myself, growing up a "witness", must have heard all types of talks, and given by all manner of speakers, especially on sundays, when almost every week we would get a "visiting" brother giving the public talk.. sometimes, you would have a "great" speaker, all fluent and animated.

other times we would get a comical speaker, one who would maybe purposelly get a few laughs outta the audience.

flipper

DUNDAIN- Interesting thread thanks for posting it.

Occasionally when I was in the cult we would get some speakers who really were funny in an extremely comical way giving public talks. I had a close friend who was probably about 20 years older than me an elder, an ex-Bethelite who was funny as hell when he'd give public talks. It's almost like this guy didn't believe a word of what he was saying from the talk outline but just wanted to entertain the audience for 45 minutes to make dull material interesting. I swear to god this guy would make you fall out of your seat laughing with his quick witted humor.

An example for instance was when he was reading the scripture in Daniel about the "fearsome looking wild beasts " that represented world powers and the weird descriptions of those beasts ; after he got done reading the scriptures he said, " Well ! That was entertaining wasn't it ? Sounds like something you get after you eat anchovies on a pizza ! " The audience about fell out of their seats. This guy was FULL of one liners all through his talks. He was always this way.

I often wondered if he was trying to wake people up even as far back as the early 1980's to TTATT. Sadly my dear friend died in a car accident at age 46 in 1983 - he was hit in a head on collision when young people fell asleep at the wheel and drifted into his lane hitting his car head on killing him instantly. He was kind of like an uncle to me and I'll never forget him. 1,000 people were at his memorial and they had to hold it at a high school auditorium he was so well loved. He made other people feel important- no ego in this guy whatsoever. His off beat humor and happy go lucky life style has seeped into my life's way of living to a great extent these last 30 + years. I learned a lot from this friend. May he rest in peace

4

"You don't go to the platform to say nonsense."

by Tempest in a Teacup in

jw
friends

second in a series of reminiscing disappointments that cut me off this religion one string at a time.... actually, i had a one week break which i spent quite poorly: not sleeping at night, so i could catch up on my favorite shows, eating crappy foods the whole day, booze and hangovers.

i'm an introvert and really, this for me is an ideal holiday :).

but...all the above, coupled with having too much free time has brought back some demons who had been sleeping...and snoring.. back to the topic.. in my former congregation, there's one wannabe-elder-no-education-hates-his-job-envies-others-mysogynist-ministerial servant.

flipper

TEMPEST- Thanks for sharing your experience. Man oh man. I thought I was the only person who had those kinds of experiences when I was a JW until 2003. I feel for you my friend. I used to be THAT " brother dependable " who the elders would pick to do last minute talks in the Ministry School because they knew they could " count " on me to be dependable. And then like yourself if I picked out a partner to do a service meeting demonstration with me- after the meeting I'd be approached by somebody who turned me down and they'd make a big show in front of other people of how " well " I did. I felt like saying " yeah, no thanks to you I had to scramble around to get a last minute householder. "

It's just that the two faced conduct and fake kindnesses in this JW cult wore me down by age 44 in 2003 where I just couldn't take it anymore. I had experienced conditional and fake friendships for 44 years - these last 12 years I only accept REAL friendships. I feel a lot healthier now- more whole and complete. Take care my friend, hang in there you know many of us here care - we've been there , lived it, experienced it

40

Elders are Complicit with WT Society in Child Abuse Scandals- Gonzalo Campos Case

by flipper in

of course, most of us realize this.

however sometimes even on this board sometimes threads have stated that the jw elders have been occasionally painted as the " fall guys " who take the rap for the wt society leaders - which of course is true - to a degree.

however- that being said , many times elders have failed to protect - or even have failed to advocate for child abuse victims when it has been within their power to do so.

flipper

Have to go cut some firewood today so I wanted to bump this up before I go. Thanks for your replies.

IOWN MYLIFE- Thanks Marina for your comments. I totally agree with you. WT Society is under the false and mistaken impression that child molesters or pedophiles can be transformed or " cured ". Totally false assumption. They are never " cured " - they just manipulate children, parents, relationships, and situations to further their sick, twisted abuse of minor children. The problem is also that the WT leaders look at child abuse more as a " sin " than the CRIME that it really is- thus thinking that these perverts can be reformed . So WT Society leaders arrogantly trust that THEY can reform these pedophiles instead of allowing the police authorities to do their jobs in punishing these child molesters and putting them in jail for good so they don't harm other children. It's quite arrogant and pompous of WT leaders for them to think they are above the laws of the land and no more- because they don't.

VIDIOT- Exactly. Good point. Just how damning IS that evidence in the database files of names of JW pedophiles ? I think it would blow the lid off of WT leaders and expose them as being guilty or at least complicit in the appointment of thousands of elders worldwide ( or at least hundreds ) AFTER it was known these elders had formerly molested children. I think the WT Society knew it and just ignored the fact. I believe THAT is what those database files would show. Then I believe criminal charges could be levied and even MORE child abuse lawsuits would occur- this is the reason WT Society would rather pay out 13.5 million $$$$ than to have those details exposed in court. It would be the end of their ballgame in public sentiment and financially

81

WT Society SEC Records : Hedge Funds, Cayman Islands, Financial Losses - Links

by flipper in

so my wife and i were curious so i researched some financial links and found records indicating that the wt society has been operating at a loss since the year 2012. as you read the links it shows a loss of 10 million $$$ in 2012, about 16 million $$$ in 2013, and a whopping loss of 56 million $$$ in 2014 - where the expenditures exceeded the revenues for each of those years in the amount i've mentioned.

also there is a link on this same website with the sec records indicating that the wt society and it's representatives funneled 40 million $$$$ into hedge funds in the cayman islands as early as 2007. if you look online on other sites you can see evidence that indicates the wt society attended hedge fund conferences to look into more shadiness in 2011 and isn't it curious that by 2012 the wt society started showing losses.

anyway here is the link : https://www.watchtowerlies.com/the_watchtower_revenue.html .. feel free to check this link out and other links on that link indicating the cayman island connection.

flipper

Wanted to bump this up since folks commented the last couple days. Thanks for your opinions !

KEPLER- Good point you make about not " placing all your life savings into one financial plan . " So many JW's have probably done that regarding handing over their personal funds to the WT Society ( especially older long time Witnesses ) - that at this point in time they'll never be able to recover financially from the WT scamming them out of their money. Really sad.

LISTENER- Very interesting statistics you share regarding how much the WT Society pays out for special pioneers, missionaries, and traveling overseers. Thanks for sharing that info. So that further explains the reasons for these WT cutbacks. Trying to save their financial asses.

CRAZYGUY- So yes indeed- if WT Society has expenses with real estate- all the crazy building projects worldwide- then you add the cost of missionaries, traveling overseers, and special pioneers, THEN add the cost of fighting child abuse lawsuits all over the world - I would say that gets really costly over the long haul.

VIDIOT- Exactly. I think we all got out of this cult just in the nick of time. ANY time one can escape the JW cult is a good time. Better late than never.

COGNAC- The one thing that's positive about cutting back all these Bethel workers, special pioneers, missionaries, traveling overseers, etc. is this : It will get these people talking and sniping in a negative way about being demoted so that they'll express their disappointment back to their local congregations once they return to their homes and hopefully foster a distrust of the WT Society's policies among other rank & file JW's upon returning. One can only hope.

SIR 82- Thanks for that current info on missionaries, I've been out so long ( since 2003 ) I didn't know what the current status is of missionaries now.

BILLZFAN 23- Of course some of what we are discussing here is speculation- but the fact remains that the WT Society IS making drastic cutbacks for SOME reason- most probably financial. It's obvious that the last several years they are operating at a loss so they have to do something to effect keeping their " pack of lies " organization running. No matter HOW many JW's they have to throw under the bus to do so. The child abuse lawsuits are not going to stop against the WT Society. A precedent was set with Candace Conti and Gilbert Lopez in which the WT Society had to pay out 13.5 million $$$$$. That ain't chicken scratch when you multiply hundreds if not thousands more of such lawsuits across the entire globe. It should be interesting to see what develops in the next 5 years or so