Posts by AudeSapere

2

untitled

by TheStumbler in

i have a question.. the conventional wisdom seems to be that to 'convert' a jehovah's witness (or get them to see ttatt) you have to ask questions that they cannot answer and engage with their true personality not their 'cult personality'.. intellectual arguments tend to fall flat because jws (who do not already have personal doubts) believe they already know the absolute truth so anything contrary to that truth is nessecarily wrong.

any criticism of their beliefs will be seen as an attack or persecution and will be dismissed as flawed 'human thinking' or 'apostate lies'.. to 'true believers' any amount of contrary evidence and illogical inconsistencies in their beliefs can be dismissed or explained away.

their starting point is that they have special knowledge of absolute truth and all evidence and arguments are then weighed against this preconceived belief.. here is my question.

AudeSapere

Ha! I see you already did start a new thread. LOL.

Must be past my bedtime. Goodnight!

2

untitled

by TheStumbler in

i have a question.. the conventional wisdom seems to be that to 'convert' a jehovah's witness (or get them to see ttatt) you have to ask questions that they cannot answer and engage with their true personality not their 'cult personality'.. intellectual arguments tend to fall flat because jws (who do not already have personal doubts) believe they already know the absolute truth so anything contrary to that truth is nessecarily wrong.

any criticism of their beliefs will be seen as an attack or persecution and will be dismissed as flawed 'human thinking' or 'apostate lies'.. to 'true believers' any amount of contrary evidence and illogical inconsistencies in their beliefs can be dismissed or explained away.

their starting point is that they have special knowledge of absolute truth and all evidence and arguments are then weighed against this preconceived belief.. here is my question.

AudeSapere

Personally, I don't bother with JW's that are fully indoctrinated. I have just 2 family members still in but apparently 2.5 apologists.

I personalize their behaviour. ie: Shunning. Jesus would not shun. [End of discussion. Lights out. Good night!]

Others on the board may have more in-depth experiences to share with you, but I think your thread will get lost because there is not title/subject/heading. Maybe you can copy your opening comments into a new thread that has a title. I know you will get responses because this is a good question.

-Aude.

66

My brother died yesterday

by satinka in

jw
friends

"albert" was 55 years old, and the fifth-born of seven children.

i am the second oldest and babysat him often while he was growing up --- and while i was still at home.. yesterday, albert was out taking his usual morning stroll around his small town, when he collapsed on the sidewalk.

the doctors said it was a heart attack.

AudeSapere

So sorry for the loss of your brother and friend.

-Aude.

12

Interview at work

by Kool Jo in

i conducted an interview for a job last week......... kool jo: welcome to company "x", thank you for taking the time out to attend the interview session as scheduled.. jw applicant: thank you for the oppurtunity.. kool jo: you have an amazing resume, so tell me some more about yourself.... so i asked some traditional questions and then we get to point of the discussion pertaining to....you guessed it...work schedule.. kool jo: so in this industry, you have to be able to work varying hours/shifts ect...since you're going to be the rookie.. jw applicant: well i really love the oppurtunity and i've been unemployed for a while, but i have some questions...would i be able to get saturdays, sundays, and thursday evenings off?.

kool jo: i won't be able to guarantee you that...our clients can be quite demanding and we have to fit into their schedule.. jw applicant: well, the truth is, i'm one of jehovah's witnesses, and i have commitments that are very important to me, hence my reason for asking.. kool jo: (a big wtf moment)...i just pretended i didn't know a thing about jw's....so what happens if a client wants to meet with you on a saturday morning?.

jw applicant: well, i guess i'd have to come for work...you have no idea how happy i am to even be called for an interview.

AudeSapere

That was generous of you to offer the job. I'm not sure I'd trust the JW to keep those secular appointments.

However, I have hired people that I was a little skeptical of. Knowing upfront what their mindset is, helps to put the cards on the table and you can head off any performance/attendance issues before they arise. Your JW was on notice from the get-go that working weekends will be part of the deal some weeks.

All the best to both of you!

-Aude.

18

Feedback on Letter

by mrhhome in

jw
friends

looking for feedback.

to bring you all back up to speed, wife is ex-jw.

shunned by her brother and parts of her family at uncles jw funeral.

AudeSapere

Your wife is so very lucky to have found you.

I like the letter. Not sure that the average JW knows about the 'Raymond Franz incident', but that's not a big deal. They can always google it if they have questions.

-Aude.

79

The life differences between a good christian and good athiest

by EndofMysteries in

let's compare a christian who goes to a non judgemental / non guilt trip church which focuses really on the gospels, jesus teachings on being non judgemental, anything out of love there is no law against, and they contribute to society.

then an athiest who if you put side by side w/ the above christian, you would not know any difference unless you asked their beliefs.

both are good people, who are able to lead lives doing what they want, enjoying their life, and trying to help their neighbors too.

AudeSapere

Marking.

31

JWs took off from work in 1975?

by skeeter1 in

jw
friends

a friend of mine is an electrician supervisor.

back in 1975, one of his employees was a jw.

the jw was so convinced that 1975 would bring the end of the world, that the jw took off from work (like, the first week in january) and sat on the top of a north carolina mountain waiting for armegheddon.

AudeSapere

My parents sold property. There was a monthly 'count-down' from the platform in our KH.

We had a pretty large pantry in our basement in anticipation of the GreatTribulation.

But I have never heard of anyone sitting on a mountain waiting. ... That sounds like someone waiting for rapture - Not a JW thing.

-Aude.

5

Bethel public relations rep J.R. Brown tells Connie Chung GB are not directed by God nor are JW's better than others

by williamhconley in

jw
friends

connie chung was interviewing j.r. brown wt public relations head regarding the pedophile manuel cano (50 yr old bethel elder) in 2006.. during the interview she asks j.r. brown if the wt considers themselves spirit directed or inspired.

she also asks him if the jw's believe if they're the only true religion or channel to god.. the answer given by the public relations head will turn your head.

what amazing liars they all are.

AudeSapere

@williamhconley - I completely agree with you that this was a very, very eye-opening and important disclosure. Not doubt about it. And I would like to see it get more coverage, so I'm glad you re-kindled it.

But we also have to be careful to get our facts straight. 'Close enough' is not really good enough when we have the attention of even one JW. We know that the WT often mis-quotes and misrepresents what people say. Most of us were not taught how to properly verify information and the importance of correct referencing.

Why say it was Connie Chung in the first place? Was that to get people to pay attention more? It had the opposite effect and derailed your thread.

But the original thread that I cited above has been re-activated and over 500 more views in the past 16 days. So that's great.

-Aude.

18

DA'd then what to expect.

by Crazyguy in

so the impending doom of the end is coming and i will not be df'd so they can tell others i sinned or something else.

i will da, but not sure what to expect next and what they will say to my family and children.

i have 5 kids one baptised and ofcourse a wife, so what should i prepare for??

AudeSapere

I have not been following your story, but with family still in, why even *consider* DA'g.

As far as the announcement and the cong treatment after the announcement, it is all the same thing. Although DA may be worse because they consider DA even more willful and apostacy is usually assumed to be the motivation.

Why do you think you should DA?

-Aude.

8

For anybody who is going to dissassociate.......

by EndofMysteries in

i haven't officially because of family.

but i see many times on this board those who do it it and write a letter to send a message.

(hoping it gets the elders reading it to think).

AudeSapere

If you are interested, here is the link to the "Going Out With a Bang" tread:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/20680/1/Going-out-with-a-bang#.UpxMk0qXrQI

-Aude.