Posts by Cygnus

30

Rumors that they spread about you. When you left.

by jerome in

jw
friends

for some time now i have been reading numerous indivisual life stories relating to their experience with the jws and one obscure ( or at least not directly elabourated upon) detail keeps popping up.. it would appear that whenever a person leaves the organisation by da/df/ia that people take it upon themselves to start spreading "nasty rumours" about the person in question.. it always seems that so much of these said rumours that were frabicated and then propagated throught the local jw community that the poaster almost never seems to have time to goint any detail about what exactaly was said about them in detail.. i would like to invite the posters here on the board to shed some light on their experience regarding their reputation after leaving the kh.. it would appear that once disfelloshipped that the jw community must make it abundantly clear that the person is of absolutely deplorable character inorder to justify their inhumane treatment of the df'ed indivisual.

saying that there is no honourable way to leave the oragnisation this seems to be rather common place.. i am also informed that even if the df'ed person were permitted to return that their reputation within the jw community would never be the same due to the tarnishing of their name and the stigma attached to being df'ed.. i may not be entirely too shure about this one but it would seem that if while still in good standing should the indvisual to become "publicly reproved" or "marked" that this would also be an invitation for the local jw community to begin the same process of defaming the character of the person in question.. would anyone care to discuss your personall experience relating to any private information which became public knowledge after you left the jw community or any half truths that were deileberately propagated to tarnish your name in the vacinity of the kh.

and even worse yet blant lies that were imagined and promoted about you inorder to permanatently damage your character.. i would also be interested in who exactly you think were responsible for the iniation of these rumours.. was it the elders?

Cygnus

I am not sure. When I quit going to meetings, my wife went ahead and told everyone that I didn't believe it was the truth. So no rumors needed to be spread -- everyone already knew what was going on.

Then, I started attending another church and my wife took the pamphlets I brought home to the elders. The pastor of the church happened to be an ex Bethelite -- not any old Bethelite but someone who spent 40 years at Brooklyn and Toronto, roomed next to Ray Franz, etc. etc. (very cool guy by the way, I'm sure many of you know his name). So when they saw his name, they told me, "he is a known apostate." Maybe that stirred some rumors, I dunno.

Then 2 1/2 years later I finally got charged with my DFing offense -- "refusal to cease association with a disfellowshipped person." By then I had grown my hair down my back, got an earring, and obtained a flashy sports car. However, my wife moved back in with me after a 5 month separation, so I don't know if anyone thought I was being mischievious or not. During one of the judicial meetings an elder asked me if I had been unfaithful and I told him NO, but in any case it was none of his fucking business. LOL.

A very, VERY good JW friend of mine (who hasn't spoken to me in about 3.5 years) got married this past Sunday. He married the ex-wife of the DF'd guy I ended up getting DF'd for. My wife was invited to the wedding/reception, but not me. I can only imagine what might have been said. His brother, an inactive JW, who is also a very good friend of mine, who still keeps in contact with me, and has somehow avoided getting DF'd himself (he actually shared an apartment with my DF'd friend for 4 months), well, he called me yesterday to say the wedding went okay and he was sorry I couldn't be there and how people missed me not being there and how FUCKED UP (his words) the religion is. :) That tells me that a lot of people did not agree with my DFing, and that there might be hope that perhaps there might be hope still that this whole shunning business might be eventually coming to an end if the elders start listening to the publishers and their laments.

Especially since I got DF'd for a completely bullshit reason, and I think everyone knows it.

9

On earth or heaven?

by happy man in

jw
friends

i have read here that radher many think that bibel say that heaven is the place to come to, a lot of former jw are in this position.. but i can not agree, for mee this is very inmportant , and i think a reson that jw are atraktiv to so manyis this beleive.

why have you forget all this scriptures wha talk abaout living on earth,and why have you forget that crist talk abaout that some gone to ruel over others?.

son it is memmorial and it cold bee intresting to have this disscusition, i am waiting .

Cygnus

Well, I have never seen anything in the NT that contradicts the OT notion of the promises made to Abraham and his progeny, which is life eternal on the land/earth. Where did Jesus change the idea of living in a restored Israel (extended to all parts of the earth), to going to heaven to rule from way up there? Why didn't Jesus correct the disciples when, after walking and talking with him for 3 1/2 years, then 40 days of kingdom instruction after his resurrection, they asked the very Jewish question all worshippers of Jehovah expected about the whereabouts of the kingdom -- a restored Israel and a kingdom on the earth?

Paul did NOT write: "To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord," but evangelicals will misquote him all the time to prove their philosophy. Why anyone would want to be disembodied and taken far from this planet is beyond me.

24

What did you refuse to do in school?

by Moxy in

jw
friends

in high school, one friend of mine was offended by flowers for algernon because of the sex bits and refused to take it as part of the english curriculum.

he even gave an experience about it at a ca.

so those of us in the other english classes that year kinda had to refuse to do it too.

Cygnus

LOL Moxy. I grew up up a Jehovah-Kid too, and I identify with that 7th grade overnight field trip (Thursday and Friday). I forget where it was. But it was about 2 hours away. I had a JW friend in that grade. Here's what our parents decided. We would go with the group on Thursday morning, and then Thursday night my friend's dad would come pick us up, and then my dad would bring us back Friday morning.

Everyone thought that us Jehovah-Kids were really weird. Even though we weren't -- and our parents really weren't either. But JW parents can get a lot of pressure to be a good example and that's why I think we had to look good.

Aside from the usual non-participatory events such as holidays, I felt that I was supposed to object to this, but didn't. I happened to be relatively popular (for a Jehovah-Kid), and smart, so in 8th grade I was chosen in my Social Studies class to be the Republican presidential candidate in our class mock election. I felt terrible about doing it and did not do a quality job in campaigning (I lost to an ultra-liberal 65/35, and this was in the mid-eighties!).

Ah yes. When I was in 1st or 2nd grade, we had a school talent assembly, and our class was chosen to play the kazoo for a few songs. Well, one of them was patriotic in nature, so my parents objected and made me sit that one out. Some other kid played my kazoo instead (I still distinctly remember the teacher cleaning it with alcohol).

I would actually get a kick out of flirting with girls, leading them on, and then saying "no thanks" when push came to shove. What a dick I was.

24

Devils Advocate-A Question for X-JW's

by apostate man in

jw
friends

ok, i am going to play devils advocate and ask the question: are the jw's correct about anything?

surely there has to be something that is commonly agreed upon to be correct.

i am not talking about what current jw's say, i am not talking about simple things like: read the bible, or be a witness.

Cygnus

A couple of people have already touched on the points the WT has right.

I will name the very four that the WTS has correct (in my view):

1) you should not murder anybody

2) you should not steal from other people

3) there is no three-headed god

4) when you die, you're really dead

And that's all.

27

WT May 1st - Watch out for traitors in our midst!

by dmouse in

jw
friends

another thread on the wt may 1st 2002 issue.. jehovah hates the course of treachery.

in a thinly veiled attack on the likes of youknow the society issues this proclamation to jws who dare to say anything out of line with the watchtower bullshit and tossers society:.

10. are we personally alert, so that no unrighteousness is found on our lips?

Cygnus

hahahahahahahahahaha

Normally I find that apostates find too much to criticize in WT quotations, but this one is a classic.

"technically accurate but misleading"

Sort of like 'those who simply cease activity are not shunned.'

10

Face - Down Roller Coaster

by Englishman in

jw
friends

it opened yesterday at alton towers.

anyone tried it yet?.

englishman.

Cygnus

Last Coaster I rode was The Comet at Crystal Beach, Canada, in 1989, just before it was torn down and moved elsewhere (one of the few remaining original wooden coasters anywhere).

My legs and shoulders ached for days afterwards. These days I don't ride anything over 60 mph (100 kph) even on flat ground.

9

Do wives just tag along?

by sleepy in

jw
friends

do wives just tag along?.

i'm sure this applies to husbands and children too, but i feel mostly women.. in the congregation there were often brothers viewed as strong , in postions of responsability such as min's and elders.usually in my experience the wives were no where near as "spiritual".. in fact it often seamed as though there "service" was based on their husbands.. i've seen this in men to but not as much.. now the proof of this is in whether a large number of spouces leave the truth without much persuading needed by their more forthright wives or husbands.. heres an example.. mine.. my wife has never read an apostate book and doesn't look on the internet, but as soon as i stoped going to the hall so did she.. another contrary experience is of a prominant elder in france who was well known and gave talks on the district assemblies.as soon as his wife died he left the truth as he was only going to please her.. whats your experience been.. (please don't get mad at me ladies i'm only talking about what i've seen)

Cygnus

LB,

: I'm grateful I'm not married to a needy woman. Her needs don't even include me and that's a good thing.

Amen, brutha. A thousand amens.

Cyg, whose wife is pioneering this month

9

Do wives just tag along?

by sleepy in

jw
friends

do wives just tag along?.

i'm sure this applies to husbands and children too, but i feel mostly women.. in the congregation there were often brothers viewed as strong , in postions of responsability such as min's and elders.usually in my experience the wives were no where near as "spiritual".. in fact it often seamed as though there "service" was based on their husbands.. i've seen this in men to but not as much.. now the proof of this is in whether a large number of spouces leave the truth without much persuading needed by their more forthright wives or husbands.. heres an example.. mine.. my wife has never read an apostate book and doesn't look on the internet, but as soon as i stoped going to the hall so did she.. another contrary experience is of a prominant elder in france who was well known and gave talks on the district assemblies.as soon as his wife died he left the truth as he was only going to please her.. whats your experience been.. (please don't get mad at me ladies i'm only talking about what i've seen)

Cygnus

Well, in my area (western NY state), the wives put on a good show of spirituality. The men are extremely conservative. I was once counseled for putting my arm around my fiance in the presence of her mother!

BUT, the women are also much more liberal in their thinking and behavior than the men. I know this because for very many years I would have my day off during the week so I would go out in field service on a Wednesday or a Thursday and very often the group would consist of me with 7 or 8 sisters. So I would spend 3-4 hours with these ladies and I got to hear a lot.

Yet, when it came to Jehovah, the women are very steadfast. It my area, rank apostasy is very rare (except for me of course). And, except for women with obvious mental problems, I can't think of any in the last 15 years who just up and quit, with husband or not.

14

Oh dear, problems...

by Abaddon in

jw
friends

... well, tomorrow there will be a big announcement in my company that will, if the gossip is correct, mean redundancies in all departments.

my normal gossip network has no reliable data, just scuttlebutt.

i don't know if i am safe or not... i think i might be, as my manager's asked me to be in to help him (boss code for "help me sack people?

Cygnus

Work for yourself. Control your own destiny. That's my philosophy. I've been doing my own thing for quite a while and although it has its added stresses, at least I know that I am responsible, not some stuffed shirt upstairs who has to make the payment for his yacht next month. Hell, _I_ can be that guy with some effort.

Maybe, Abbadon, you can close your web browser, put down the long-haired books and learn how to run a business, and then you won't be so reliant on other people to make a living.

5

The Watchtower Study ("meat of the word)?

by stevieb1 in

jw
friends

i have laboriously sat through so many watchtower studies in my local kingdom hall so i thought i would share my experience of what supposed to be the "main spiritual meal of the week for jw's".

as a formerly active jw i would disect all the scriptures quoted to really discern the meat of the word using a huge variety of commentaries that i have in my library.

my heart rejoiced when i came across all the spiritual gems and i used to look forward to bringing my comments out at the study (this applies to the book study as well).

Cygnus

When I got married in 1992, I switched to my wife's congo. At my previous one, I was used to people using the Insight volumes and other reference material in their answers at the WT study. When I went to her Hall, we were actually counseled against using anything in our answers but what was found in the study article.