You've already stated 3x more knowledge on the subject that they will likely have. The answer to all your questions would be "we'll look that up and get back to you."
Good luck.
TheListener
JoinedPosts by TheListener
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10
Saw some JW's 'witnessing' in my area - had some questions ready
by cyberdyne systems 101 ini saw some witnoids i know from my former congregation, recruiting across the road from me yesterday.
i was hoping they would call on me as i'd like to ask a few questions.
firstly i wanted to ask them why historians say the destruction of jerusalem was in 587/586, where as only the dubs say its 607?
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87
What if she never leaves JWs? (The interminable waiting period...)
by AuldSoul inthis has nothing to do with whether i love my wife.
i always will.. pragmatically, i have come to the devastating conclusion that i don't want to be married to a jw.
any jw.. she asked me last night, "so, do you believe in santa clause, now?
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TheListener
(((((man hug))))))
You know you're one of my best friends. I can't stand to see you going through this. It's not much consolation, but remember, you are not alone. The disappointment, the dings, the disapproving looks, the smugness they exude when they just know they're right about everything - these are things I experience (apparently many here do/have).
No relationship can survive without - boundaries. It is unfair for a parent, child, spouse, workmake, stranger, etc to cross your boundaries. It's your job to set those boundaries and kindly let others know where they are. Some boundaries are taken for granted - we don't stare over or under a public bathroom stall door for example. Other boundaries are subjective and depend largely upon the individual setting the boundary. As JWs boundaries are not respected. Raised in the truth or converted make no difference. One of the things that makes high control groups work is the loss of individual boundaries.
Do some research on boundaries. Possibly even see a therapist that can assist you. Do this before talking to your wife. Perhaps the talk with your wife should be about this very subject. Since you can't study the Bible together offer talking about relationships and boundaries. There is some really good information on this subject. Let her know what is acceptable and what isn't. After your talk make sure you let her kindly know when she crosses a boundary. It takes time.
Auld, you love her. You know she loves you. That isn't always enough but it makes for a good foundation. Your relationship is worth fighting for. Boundaries aren't a magic cure all but it may help refocus the relationship lens off emotional blackmail and sarcastic quips.
PM me whenever you want. I'll try to call later today.
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epistle to the Ephesians
by Ade ini am searching for a few people ( actually as many as can be had ) to start commenting on a verse by verse basis books of the bible - basically a full online bible study starting, for no particular reason with ephesians, if you are interested please leave a message here or contact me via pm.
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ade .
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TheListener
pm me please
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21
My Ex is suicidal, apparently
by dmouse insome of you might remember my story from years ago - how i became an 'apostate' which effectively ended my marriage of 20 years.
how my wife subjected me to intense psychological abuse when i left 'the truth'.. my son ben, whom i love deeply, left when he was dragged into the back room and told he was being used by satan to corrupt the congregation (he was only15) because he was gay.. my dearest middle daughter charlotte, who has more common sense than all of us put together, 'left' on her 14th birthday.
she was dragged out of the house in her bare feet to be taken to the meeting, and because i intervened i spent the next year on a camp bed in the front room.. in the end, i could not stand the abuse and left.
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TheListener
I remember Dmouse. Your story scared the poop out of me when I was first having doubts. I was sure I would be divorced and/or living on the sofa until I was kicked out or had to leave.
I'm proud of the stand you took for your own happiness. It also makes me feel good to know that your children have made wise choices too.
It gives me hope for my children.
Hang in there.
I don't know your situation completely, but perhaps if you feel it is the right thing to do, offer your wife a helping hand. Only you know the best thing to do though.
Good luck to you and your children. Perhaps introducing your daughter to jwd, under your supervision when possible, will give her some of the association she needs. Then again, at 15 maybe isn't the right age. just brainstorming.
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Still Groggy: Double Agent's Blog #001 - "Pressure Building"
by StillGroggy in(copied from my blog) .
anyone who's seen my posts on jwd knows that im an active jw whos married in the religion.
i recently started leaning my "family study" with my wife to a more free-thinking, personal researching mode.
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TheListener
Still Groggy,
Use the Bible to discuss the conscience matter.
First learn how and why the Bible supports the use of your conscience for yourself. Know it forward and backward before entering any discussion.
To accomplish the first step do some internet searches and start some threads here about it. There has been some fantastic discussions here on conscience and it's appropriate use as encouraged in the Bible. Apostle Paul wrote a boatload of stuff on conscience.
Second, lay the groundwork with your wife, that conscience matters are just that, the GB don't put those types (mostly) of hard and fast rules in print. Use that to your advantage. For example, karate, r- rated movies, rap music, some video games, etc etc. are conscience matters. The society says you can't be exemplary if doing some of those - meaning - you can't be m.s. or elder or pioneer and maybe just maybe depending on the anal retentiveness of your local body you can't read WT or handle mics. or work behind the counter. You are not marked or considered bad association - if the rules are followed.
Look up some WT articles on conscience and how we exercise it. Look up some more about not binding others up with our own personal conscience decisions.
Perhaps when you're ready tell your wife that you are uncomfortable with her forcing her conscience on you. Tell her that those with weak faith must have strong consciences and those with strong faith.... well you get the point.
ok maybe you shouldn't say that, but imho you'd be right. Others here will have a much more educated way of helping you.
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51
Do you truly WANT the Watchtower to collapse? If so why?
by nicolaou inthere are the abuses of course, the diabloical 'two witness' rule applied to allegations of molestation, the reckless 'blood ban' in all it's tortuous complexities (which by watchtowers own admission has resulted in many fatalaties) and the cruel punishment of shunning which has caused so much suffering and pain to many of us here.. is it for these reasons that you want to see the watchtower fall or is it simply that you want to see them humiliated and broken for what they've done to you?
most of us aren't bitter or selfish enough to want personal revenge against the watchtower but i'd be lying if i said i didn't sometimes think like that.. the reason for my original question is that i sometimes feel a bit hypocritical.
i try to accord respect to jw's and individuals of all faiths, (yes, even when i go off on one of my atheistic diatriabes) but whereas i allow myself to be hostile to the watchtower i shrink from being so forthright against other 'christian' faiths whose corrosive nature may not be so easily apparent but is there nonetheless.. i guess my question is; why do we want the watchtower to fall but do not wish all religion to fall?.
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TheListener
I'm not bitter. My wife and other adult family members can choose for themselves. It would be an informed choice if they'd listen to opposing viewpoints, but ignorance is their choice too.
HOWEVER,
I have children. They are not witnesses because of a personal decision. They are witnesses because of someone else's personal decision.
I do not want them to be witnesses. My wife does.
Who is right?
I have a vested interest in hoping that the Society ceases to exist.
I work hard at dismantling every single teaching that I feel is incorrect or harmful to my children.
Bitter? Hardly. A warrior on the front lines battling for the very life of his children each and every day. Absolutely.
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Still Groggy: Double Agent's Blog #001 - "Pressure Building"
by StillGroggy in(copied from my blog) .
anyone who's seen my posts on jwd knows that im an active jw whos married in the religion.
i recently started leaning my "family study" with my wife to a more free-thinking, personal researching mode.
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TheListener
Hang in there Groggy. You never know what gets through and what doesn't. Admittedly it always seems that nothing gets through, but then all of a sudden something happens and you can't believe that they were listening after all.
You are not alone in trying to keep you family and save them from the witnesses at the same time.
Your wife sounds very hardcore and more than a little judgmental - I mean this to be helpful not offensive. If that's true could you slowly lean your family study towards issues that will highlight that type of personality? Perhaps it will help her see her own inflexibility.
Just a suggestion.
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34
grandparents day in latest Awake!
by becca1 inin the new awake!
there is a short experience of a young sister who said: "we don't celebrate granparents day".
what is the basis for this conclusion?
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TheListener
As far as anniversaries, bridal showers, baby showers, etc. I have always asked the same question: If you're only honoring God's institution of marriage, birth, etc - who gets the gifts?
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9
On Meeting Nights........
by Cellist indo you think we post differently on former meeting times?
such as tuesday night, thursday night and sunday.
my observation is that the board is more active on fluff subjects at those times.
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TheListener
I'm more active. Not necessarily fluff though.
I'm more active because I have some personal time while the family is away.
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15
Rock The Vote: my secret is discovered
by under_believer ina while back, i registered to vote.
i even voted in our primary (nonpartisan issues only at this point--i'm still finding my "center.
at the time, my wife asked me if all this voting stuff we were getting all of a sudden was some new thing the state was doing--maybe you just get enrolled to vote when your drivers license renews, or something.
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TheListener
Congratulations UB. It's always nice when something like this happens and we see our loved ones think for themselves.
That article on voting may have been for specific circumstances but it opened the floodgates for people like my wife to decide that voting isn't necessarily all bad. I know many witnesses since that article came out that decided to vote for various tax measures and school levy's and such but not for a particular candidate.
The WT's slipper slope. First vote for or against the tax measure. Then after some time passes, vote for the candidate that will support your viewpoint.