3 hour tour - my sd interrogation.

by wordlywife 48 Replies latest jw friends

jaffacake

(1 John 4:7-21) 7 Beloved ones, let us continue loving one another, because love is from God, and everyone who loves has been born from God and gains the knowledge of God. 8 He that does not love has not come to know God, because God is love. 9 By this the love of God was made manifest in our case, because God sent forth his only-begotten Son into the world that we might gain life through him. 10 The love is in this respect, not that we have loved God, but that he loved us and sent forth his Son as a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins. 11 Beloved ones, if this is how God loved us, then we are ourselves under obligation to love one another. 12 At no time has anyone beheld God. If we continue loving one another, God remains in us and his love is made perfect in us. 13 By this we gain the knowledge that we are remaining in union with him and he in union with us, because he has imparted his spirit to us. 14 In addition, we ourselves have beheld and are bearing witness that the Father has sent forth his Son as Savior of the world. 15 Whoever makes the confession that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, God remains in union with such one and he in union with God. 16 And we ourselves have come to know and have believed the love that God has in our case. God is love, and he that remains in love remains in union with God and God remains in union with him. 17 This is how love has been made perfect with us, that we may have freeness of speech in the day of judgment, because, just as that one is, so are we ourselves in this world. 18 There is no fear in love, but perfect love throws fear outside, because fear exercises a restraint. Indeed, he that is under fear has not been made perfect in love. 19 As for us, we love, because he first loved us. 20 If anyone makes the statement: "I love God," and yet is hating his brother, he is a liar. For he who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot be loving God, whom he has not seen. 21 And this commandment we have from him, that the one who loves God should be loving his brother also.
(Matthew 5:43-48) 43
"YOU heard that it was said, ‘You must love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 However, I say to YOU: Continue to love YOUR enemies and to pray for those persecuting YOU; 45 that YOU may prove yourselves sons of YOUR Father who is in the heavens, since he makes his sun rise upon wicked people and good and makes it rain upon righteous people and unrighteous. 46 For if YOU love those loving YOU, what reward do YOU have? Are not also the tax collectors doing the same thing? 47 And if YOU greet YOUR brothers only, what extraordinary thing are YOU doing? Are not also the people of the nations doing the same thing? 48 YOU must accordingly be perfect, as YOUR heavenly Father is perfect.
Matthew 7:12
“Whatever you wish that men would do to you, do so to them…for this is the law and the prophets”
On the two commandments of loving God and loving one’s neighbour, “depend the law and the prophets” (Matt
Matthew 25:25 New English Bible
“You know that in the world, rulers lord it over their subjects, and their great men make them feel the weight of authority; but it shall not be so with you. Among you, whoever wants to be great, must be your servant.”
jaffacake

To shun her will mean you both breaking 'the royal law of love' which supersedes all other Biblical laws. You asked for scriptures:
(Matthew 7:12) 12 "All things, therefore, that YOU want men to do to YOU, YOU also must likewise do to them; this, in fact, is what the Law and the Prophets mean.
(Luke 16:16) 16
"The Law and the Prophets were until John. From then on the kingdom of God is being declared as good news. . .
(Romans 3:21-24) . . .it is borne witness to by the Law and the Prophets; 22
yes, God’s righteousness through the faith in Jesus Christ, for all those having faith. For there is no distinction. 23 For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and it is as a free gift that they are being declared righteous by his undeserved kindness through the release by the ransom [paid] by Christ Jesus. . .
Honesty

If he refused to provide loving care to his own daughter, I'd be strongly tempted to stack all his worldly goods on the back porch, set up a cot with a sleeping bag and tell him he's shunned until he comes to his senses.

If her father can't/won't/is afraid to because of the cult treat her like his daughter I say pack his crap and throw it out the back door and give him a doghouse to live in until he can learn a little human kindness. As for shunning her in front of other JW's I'd make sure he knew that it's all just for appearances.
I got shunned today at WallyWorld but I brought it on. Met an old friend I was in another hall in and got to talking with him. When he asked which KH I was in now I told him the truth about the cult and all he has to do is go to the older publications and he can see for himself how many changes the WT has made over the years. He couldn't wait to run down the aisle away from me after he heard that. If there really is a place of eternal separation from God and and afterlife it serves 'em right if they don't want to face facts and figures.
Check_Your_Premises

Hey worldy. I haven't talked to you before. I read your story briefly.
It sounds like you have an opportunity with your jw man. He made a huge sacrifice to his status as a dub to marry you. You must be quite a woman! He got reinstated because he still has JW-itis. He know is under pressure again because his little girl is df.
I think you have a person who might be open to consideration that this might not be God's organization.
Have you talked to him to ask him if he has any doubts in that regard? He will likely say he has NO doubts. Ask him if he ever has had doubts and why.
If you smell any hesitation, you have an opportunity that you shouldn't let pass.
As Jgnat said, he is one life shaking experience to becoming fully immersed again.
Do you have Steven Hassans' book, Releasing the Bonds? It is a how to get 'em out of a cult book. Another one might be to ask him if he has ever considered reading Crisis of Conscience.
Just some ideas. I think it is in your best interest to help him leave. Despite your obvious womanly wiles, he will always be married to someone else until he does leave. I don't think that is what you want out of life is it?
jgnat

Thanks for spurring me to action. I was preparing these for defd. He accurately provided some references to God’s judgement. The verses, frequently quoted by JW’s, suggest that being accepted by God is exclusive. That is, only a few will be found worthy. I was planning to prepare the flip side, God’s mercy, and His love for all.
It might be easier for you to remember the stories and the parables.
The parable of the Lost Son Luke 15:11-31. Again, an xJW would ask, “how long did it take the father to embrace his son and accept him back in the family? Six months?”
The parable of the Lost Sheep Luke 15:1-7 As xJW’s love to say, is the lost sheep required to struggle out of the hole and BLEAT LOUDLY before the master listens?

Here’s some more:
Hosea 6:6 (NIV) For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings
Matthew 9:10-13 (NIV)
10While Jesus was having dinner at Matthew's house, many tax collectors and "sinners" came and ate with him and his disciples. 11When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and 'sinners'?" 12On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. 13But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
Matthew 12 (NIV)
1At that time Jesus went through the grainfields on the Sabbath. His disciples were hungry and began to pick some heads of grain and eat them. 2When the Pharisees saw this, they said to him, "Look! Your disciples are doing what is unlawful on the Sabbath." 3He answered, "Haven't you read what David did when he and his companions were hungry? 4He entered the house of God, and he and his companions ate the consecrated bread—which was not lawful for them to do, but only for the priests. 5Or haven't you read in the Law that on the Sabbath the priests in the temple desecrate the day and yet are innocent? 6I tell you that one[a] greater than the temple is here. 7If you had known what these words mean, 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice,'[b] you would not have condemned the innocent.

Wow, Jesus quoted this scripture TWICE. You think it might be an IMPORTANT CONCEPT?
Matthew 25 (NIV)
41"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.'
44"They also will answer, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?' 45"He will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.' 46"Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."

Romans 3:22 (NIV) This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, 23for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.
1 Corinthians 13 (NIV) 1If I speak in the tongues[a] of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames,[b] but have not love, I gain nothing. 4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
DannyHaszard

Danny's Blog MY Kangaroo court.
If the flunky elders from the Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses Rockland Massachusetts had any notion what/where/who i would be today they would never had booted me.
Only one thing matters to them:POLITICS and saving face
If you 'appeal' this is a scam only 1% of JC decisions are overturned and only for reason:potential LAW$UIT
The Watchtower and their agents,operatives,thugs are all rotten to the core.
I quit!

They have given her a week to decide before they df her.
So what is she deciding on?
I guess she could tell them I've decided not to be df'd and let it go at that but I'm sure that's not what they want to hear.
The whole thing is so unscriptural. Doesn't the Bible say if someone is sinning go and speak to them. If they don't listen take someone else with you. If that doesn't work take them before the congregation. Obviously that never happens. Where in the Bible does it speak of secret meetings with three men, no transcript, no recording, no one to speak on your behalf. I think I would tell my husband and the elders that the whole thing was one big farce. All I know is if you try to make it fair by requesting that it be recorded or by telling them you want witnesses to be present they slink back into their hole. The reason they don't want a record of the proceeding is that often they would find the Watchtower and themselves as the ones on trial. I would just tell them I don't accept their decision because their methods are flawed.
garybuss

Hillbilly, you wrote: LOL...are we cousins or something Gary? I asked for a show-down with the Circuit Overseer and Local BOE when the ex left. Six grown men couldnt produce a whole set of B*lls ...never heard back since.The elders are spineless. They are afraid of a proactive approach. I've been able to confirm that a number of times. I don't need to test it anymore, I know a weasel runs when the light comes on.
Es

Oh the poor darling, and god 3 hours for a JD makes you wonder what was discussed.Its a hard one, does she live with you? Is your hubby planning on shunning her too? Thats so harsh! es
wordlywife

Yes my husband is planning on shunning her I guess, but he did say if she moved in with us he could "study" with her. My husband was present and his ex at her JC, at least. My husband did make a comment that he told the elders they were treating the situation as black and white and that they should know better......so to me I can see he isn't agreeing with them/their decision.
Thank you ALL for the scripture references. I feel a bit more prepared as I think this conversation will come p soon about her being df'd, unless she appeals and then what, I don't know.
WW

3 hour tour - my sd interrogation.

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