My sister who has been inactive for over 10 years is extremely nervous with the '' new" DF rule. She worries that as an inactive JW the elders can say "she is no longer one of JW's" because she has been inactive for so long. Basically she does not want to be a JW anymore but is afraid my mom will shun her if she publicly states this. My mom and sister are best friends and this would hurt my sister terribly if my mom shuns her. She is really scared and called me up the other day crying saying she received a phone call from the presiding overseer from her old KH asking her can he and other elders visit her. Does anyone know if this new DF rule can put my sister out and cause shunning from my mom. And trust me my mom will shun my sister if a DF announcement is made. She stopped talking to me 12 years ago when I left the JW's. Does anybody have any answers I can give my sister.
Can the "new" disfellowshipping announcement be used on "inactive-faders"?
by booker-t 30 Replies latest members private
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Lehaa
they might just be on a fact finding mission.
Just tell her not to tell them anything at all.
Be polite but tell them tat her personal life is none of there buisness.
It worked for my mum.
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Joyzabel
Unfortunately, the verbal word coming through the pipeline (Service Department/CO to PO/edlers) is to use the vague "no long a JW" statement on people who have "faded".
My question, how long has it been since the PO called and talked with your sister?
It is completely out of the blue, like years since she has had a "sheperding call"? Then I would say, watch out. They are cleansing the congregation. But after 5 years someone who is "inactive" should have their publisher record card removed from the file.
Tell your sister to be busy, busy, busy, sick, etc.
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Pistoff
Joyzabel wrote: Unfortunately, the verbal word coming through the pipeline (Service Department/CO to PO/edlers) is to use the vague "no long a JW" statement on people who have "faded". ARE you SURE this is true? Where have you heard it?? I have read both ways, but so far this is only conjecture.
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ezekiel3
The new "DF rule" primarily refers to the procedure change that DF and DA announcements are now grouped into the ambiguous statement: "[Name of person] is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses."
Compare the policy from the new Organized to Do Jehovah's Will (OD) Book page 155, to the obsolete Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry (OM) Book page 150. Substative revisions are in red.
OD BOOK: DISASSOCIATION
The term "disassociation" applies to the action taken by a person who, although a baptized member of the congregation, deliberately repudiates his Christian standing, rejecting the congregation by his actions or by stating that he no longer wants to be recognized as or known as one of Jehovah's Witnesses. Because he is disassociated, his situation before Jehovah is far different from that of an inactive Christian, one who no longer shares in the field ministry. An inactive person may have failed to study God's Word regularly, or because of experiencing personal problems or persecution, he may have lost his zeal for serving Jehovah. The elders as well as other concerned members of the congregation will continue rendering appropriate spiritual assistance to an inactive brother. (Rom. 15:1; 1 Thess. 5:14; Heb. 12:12) However, the person who disassociates himself by repudiating the faith and deliberately abandoning Jehovah's worship is viewed in the same way as one who is disfellowshipped. A brief announcement is made to inform the congregation, stating: "[Name of person] is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses."
Concerning those who renounced their Christian faith in his day, the apostle John wrote: "They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us." (1 John 2:19) For example, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of a secular organization that has objectives contrary to the Bible and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Isa. 2:4; Rev. 19:17-21) If a person who is a Christian chooses to join those who are disapproved by God, a brief announcement is made to the congregation, stating: "[Name of person] is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses." Such a person is treated in the same way as a disfellowshipped person. The presiding overseer should approve this announcement.
OM BOOK: DISASSOCIATION
The term disassociation applies to the action taken by a person who, although being a baptized member of the congregation, deliberately repudiates his Christian standing, rejecting the congregation and stating that he no longer wants to be recognized or known as one of Jehovah's Witnesses. As a disassociated person, his situation before Jehovah is far different from that of an inactive Christian who, having grown weak spiritually, no longer shares in the field ministry. Such an inactive person may have failed to study God's Word regularly, or his zeal for serving Jehovah may have cooled off due to his experiencing personal problems or persecution. (1 Cor. 11:30; Rom. 14:1) The elders, as well as other concerned members of the congregation, will continue rendering appropriate spiritual assistance to the inactive brother. (1 Thess. 5:14; Rom. 15:1; Heb. 12:12) However, the person who has disassociated himself by repudiating the faith and deliberately abandoning Jehovah's worship is viewed in the same way as one who has been disfellowshipped. A brief announcement would be made to inform the congregation that the person has voluntarily disassociated himself from the congregation.
Concerning those who renounced their Christian faith in his day, the apostle John wrote: "They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us." (1 John 2: 19) Also, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of a secular organization the objective of which is contrary to the Bible and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Compare Revelation 19:17-21; Isaiah 2:4.) So if a person who is a Christian chooses to join those who are disapproved by God, it would be fitting for the congregation to acknowledge by a brief announcement that he has disassociated himself and is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses. Such a person would be viewed in the same way as a disfellowshipped person.
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garybuss
I quit associating in 1974 and the Witness people didn't start to shun me until 1992. They actually did me a favor. They motivated me to go back and look at their older publications to see what their problem was. I found out.
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Pistoff
Ezekiel, the thrust of this change is that the elders do NOT have to meet with someone to make the new statement; they can just conclude, that well, he isn't here and therefore is no longer a JW.-------------- This is a very big deal, obviously; previously the only way to leave (not a very honest or dignified one either, but better than being shunned by one's own close family) was to just slowly fade away. Now the worry is that the "behind the scenes" verbal instructions might be to just make the announcements about whomever they wish that has faded.----------------- It matters little what is written anymore; they do what they wish based on instructions from the CO. [As an example, how often do committees actually "meet with and work with someone to help them see the error of their ways?---------------- It used to be thought that they would meet 3 times; every single DF'ing I know of lately it was decided in one meeting, even though one can find in current literature the aforementioned assertion that they will "meet with and work with" erring ones. ***There is a real potential for abuse of power with this arrangement, since they can select who they wish, not meet with them, and just make the announcement.***-------------------- No one will question it. It does seem to fit in with the general direction of spin, evasion and PR that they have gotten into since the late 90's.
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Joyzabel
What I've heard "through the grapevine", so yes from a lowly elder via CO told him, is to ask anyone who was once a JW and is no longer "active" if they are coming back to meetings. If the person says no, then they will announce "So & so is no longer a JW". The congregation will take it from there.
I'm sorry I can't point you to printed information, but you know how the verbal instructions to elders is what is really used by the elders.
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blondie
Well, we know that cults are know by their propensity to have unwritten rules. Easier to control the masses that way. Keep them guessing. I would just put the elders off. If they don't talk to you, it is hard for them to say, you said anything. I suppose they could lie, but it is hard to get an elder body to all agree to tell the same lie at the same time.
The elders I have talked to in the past dislike shepherding calls and unless there is some valid proof that can't be ignored or they particularly dislike the person, they avoid the whole thing.
Blondie
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JH
I went to a few meetings lately, and I didn't hear anything about any new rule... On the contrary, at the book study tuesday, I heard a comment saying "they hope that all inactives ones will one day come back".
I don't think that anything changed.
I think that inactive ones have up to the great tribulation to come back... jw talk that is...