by Schizm 48 Replies latest jw friends
I didn't just change my ways now. It was quite a long time ago. You, on the other hand ...
I wasn't able to get into the address you gave for that obit. So, i could not find out matlock's brand of christianity. However, since he wasn't that concerned, he may have been a nonfundie. Perhaps if you spent some time studying standard christian theology connected w the going to heaven theory, then you will see your misunderstanding contained in what you stated.
S
Schism,
Tell me again, where is the New Jerusalem going to be? If it is on the new earth, you still haven't explained to me how the throne of God and of the Lamb can be in the city and not also be on earth where the 144,000 are as Rev. 22:3 says. Rev. 21:22 also says that John did not see a temple in the city, for Jehovah God the Almighty is its temple, also the Lamb is. Also, why Rev. 21:3 says that "The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his peoples. And God himself will be with them"? How can God reside with mankind, if he and his throne are elsewhere? How can the 144,000 be separate from where the Father and the Son are according to these verses? It seems to me that Rev. 21 and 22 are stating that one day heaven will come down and be united with earth and it doesn't exclude the Father and the Son. If God can be everywhere, he certainly can choose to be somewhere.
Schizm: Mr. Matlock was a member of the Church Of Christ, apparently. Being such, he did believe he was destined for heaven.
In my experience, people belonging to (codified way of worship x) rarely believe everything taught by (codified way of worship x), and they often are not even certain that (codified way of worship x) is any better than (codified way of worship y).
For instance, in my experience, Jehovah's Witnesses rarely believe everything taught by Jehovah's Witnesses.
Schizm: Yes, as a matter of fact, I DO use the same sort of logic. True, it leaves me disagreeing with the WTS, but I don't see the 144,000 remaining in heaven as spirit creatures after the 1000 years is up. Revelation 21 shows the 144,000 returning to earth at the end of the 1000 years. Just as Jesus served his purpose in coming to earth and then going back to his original abode, the 144,000 will have served their purpose in going to heaven and then coming back to their original abode. Other than temporarily, men weren't created to live anywhere other than on a physical plane, even as angels weren't created to live anywhere other than on a spiritual plane. Angels who actually attempted to change their proper dwelling place (in Noah's day) were punished for having done a wrong thing.
So, those who go to heaven will be responsible for perfecting those on earth and for judging those who do not prove worthy of life during or at the end of the Thousand Year Reign?
Correct me if I am wrong, but if the 144,000 is symbolic of all true Christians and they would only be going to heaven for a short while relative to forever, wouldn't God's original purpose still be served? At the same time, 1 Thessalonians 4 and 1 Corinthians 15 would suddenly make a lot more sense.
Curiously,
OldSoul
Has my young friend Schizm thrown his toys out of the box again?
S'ok, buddy, mommy will be along to change your diapers any moment.
I hope, through the bitterness, you can condescend to investigate some of what these good folks are presenting to you. It sounds like you've far from got your theology sussed and consistent.
Why do you think so many of us threw it out and started again from the ground up?
It's a wonder of the depth of human compassion that your threads are read, far less commented on, with the manner in which you generally reply to folks.
Mr. Matlock was a member of the Church Of Christ, apparently. Being such, he did believe he was destined for heaven.
how can you presume everything that a person believes just from his church membership.
it is evident from this site alone that membership of a religion does not mean that you adhere to all of it's tenets.
not like you to make such an ill thought out comment, schiz
zaphod
Ken,
...my question is where are those mentioned in Rev. 22:15 located?
Revelation 22:15 says:
15 Outside are the dogs and those who practice spiritism and the fornicators and the murderers and the idolaters and everyone liking and carrying on a lie.’
The answer to your question is that those "outside" the city don't actually exist. Those not qualified to live in the city (God's Kingdom) will have lost their lives.
.
So "inside" is a misnomer, then, as it contains all that is?
Ken,
Also, why Rev. 21:3 says that "The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his peoples. And God himself will be with them"? How can God reside with mankind, if he and his throne are elsewhere?
In the sense that a chasm* between God and Man will no longer exist . At the present time Man doesn't enjoy a direct relationship with God, and thereby lives apart from God. At present a mediator is needed for man to communicate with God. After the 1000 years are up the barrier will come down, and Man will then have direct access to God.
chasm* -- An interruption of continuity.
.
After the 1000 years are up the barrior will come down, and Man will have direct access to God.
So then, the imaginary wt god will do nothing directly, instead of doing nothing through a mediator.
Wait a minute, isn't jesus a mediator for the 144k only? The rest of mankind has no mediator to god. Since the vast majority of mankind is left out in the cold, so to speak, never having the opportunity of having jesus mediate for them, then how could they advance to dealing w god directly? If the don't go through the first stage, how can they get to the second stage?
S sadly puxxled
