Seeing JWs in a positive light.

by ScoobySnax 50 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  steve2

  Hey there again, Scooby. Thanks for your nice words earlier about my post - much appreciated. At times in my posts I do express strong feelings and views about aspects of the Watchtower's teachings, but, as far as I'm aware, I have not expressed any hatred towards the JWs. Similarly, the overwhelming majority of the people I have heard from on this Discussion forum, share their own feelings and views - strong and otherwise - and they are not expressing hatred for the JWs either. You have made some comments about apostates having a "party line" and that is palpably not true. We are free to agree or disagree. And as an earlier post stated, the consequence is not shunning and its disastrous impact on family life.

  I realise that you have received much feedback from others over the past day and would understand it if you felt perhaps beleagered by it all. However, do hang on in here. The point is not that we end up all agreeing on everything, but that we each in our own way feel heard - an experience that so many of us never had when we were witnesses. Best to you.
• 

  unclebruce

  Apostates are loving, sweet, thoughtful and kind...

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  

  until they find out you don't agree with them, dare to disagree, or don't follow the party line.

  See...it makes as much sense as what you typed.

  WARNING: LOGIC FALLACY

  Scooby is being silly - apostates to JW orthodoxy are not bound by any faith or particular philosophy. Ex Witnesses are, for the mostpart, free thinking women and men and have no party line.

  It is sometimes said, particularly by ex bethelites, that JWs are "victims of victims" and there is truth in that. And most ordinary JWS are good and decent people. However the organization is designed in a way that it attracts a leadership dominated by callous, power hungry men with small dick syndrome.

  Hate the machine but not the crushed. unclebruce
• 

  Gill

  Hi Scoobysnax. You're right in that there are really wonderful people who are Jehovah's Witnesses but... there are the really horrible ones as well. Same mix as you get any where. The only fault that the really wonderful ones have hoisted on them are the rules made by the WTBTS. Stray slightly from the path of the WTBTS and you are marked. Stray furthur from the path of the WTBTS and you're dead meat. This rule applies to the nice ones and the horrible ones.

  The choice these very nice people have chosen to make is to allow a man made, money making, litigious, organization make their rules for civilised behaviour.

  I think the point someone was making earlier about someone telling a JW that you are an apostate, homosexual, posting on an apostate board was not meant as a criticism of you or anyone else. I believe, and I could be wrong, but I believe, the point is, is even a wonderful JW knew such a thing about someone who used to be a JW, they would be shunned as dead meat. There is no tolerance and no unconditional love. You follow the rules or you're dead meat.

  Not nice, me thinks!
• 

  MonkeyPrincess

  There is no tolerance and no unconditional love. You follow the rules or you're dead meat.

  I agree with Gill.
  

  I also beleive that its not the people themselves that are mean and unloving. Its how they are taught to treat unbeleivers,
  thats the essence of mind control. I dont blame them for trying to do what they think is right, they are lost and i feel sad
  for them. Not saying its right, but its what happens. Everywhere you go there are nice people and there are mean people
  its just the way things are. There are some very genuine people in that Org that really beleive they are doing what they
  are suppose to, i have known some that would give you the shirt on their back. Others like the elder that df'd me could
  jump in a hole for all i care.

  MonkeyPrincess
• 

  gdt

  Just had to make comment on this thread that it was great to see some decent remarks (to me anyway) about some of the most beautiful people in the world who are trying hard to be good as persons, walk in Christ's footsteps, be good in their relationship with Jehovah, apply the advice from the Scriptures and the Society, and I am so sorry that some of you have only ever had terrible things from the overseers or the brothers in general, or at least your words say that. I do not lie to you in saying that my 50 odd years of life as a witness has, in the overall, been one of great depth, beauty and encouragement.

  The divide between those on this board and the brothers in the truth may well be fixed by more true love and understanding. Bigotry, anger and bitterness may be caused by other individuals, in our opinions, but if we can conquer bad with the good, and remember we have no right to retaliate with hatred to any others, surely our lives would be blessed.

  I can only say this: If you do not believe in God as Creator, who is responsible for and who do you show thanks to for the good things? (ie babies, your life no matter how bad it is now, food, drink, flowers, etc etc)

  And, if you hate the Society and its representatives, who or what is responsible for the 6.5m publishers trying hard to privately and publicly help others. in all nations, not learning war either personal or national, anymore?

  (perhaps I should leave this board too, bit hard not to learn 'war' from it sometimes....)

  Cheers,

  gdt. Geoff.
• 

  unclebruce

  G'day Geoff,

  Good to see a fellow Australian posting (a lot of these people barely understand a thing I say).

  Interesting post. Sometimes the negativity builds here like the sewer sludge in the ghostbusters movie. My finger has been particularly guilty of negative posting tonight ..maybe it's demonised .. nup ..more like, I'm just becomming a grumpy old man.

  I too had a thoroughly enjoyable time as a JW (for only 20 years less than yourself). Often, the sadness and headaches only come when the penny drops. Sometimes posts that dim wittedly attack ordinary JWs send me right off (I have to keep taking the be nice pills)

  best wishes, unclebruce

  ps: A long shot from a croweater to a bannana bender: Do you know the Wenzlers of Sunshine?
• 

  ScoobySnax

  Bruce, irf you'd read the line about apostates in the context I'd written it, you would see that I find that statement silly too.....it doesn't make sense to me no more than making a broad statement about JWs does......

  Individuals, exJW or not do have incredible abilities to reach out and help others regardless......and thats a good thing

  Scoob
• 

  hillary_step

  Scooby,
  

  But listen matey, don't call me an idiot. You haven't a clue what I've been through, or how I think. You are lucky that on this forum you probably have a 1000 people who will support you for the very fact that you are an ex-JW, and will back you up. But don't try to judge me or put me in a nice little "Misguided JW box"

  First of all Scooby I do not know you so I cannot judge you as a aperson, I can only judge you on the content of your posts. I have every right to do this, as you have to judge mine as this is a public discussion board.

  I do have a clue how your on-line personna thinks Scooby and that is whom I am adressing. I have seen you time and again walking the circle of your own particular Catch 22 and reaching conclusions that are illogical as you do in the opening post on this thread. Lying to oneself is easy, but it is certainly not going to help you break out of your circular reasoning, a reasoning which you have admitted in the past may be wrong but one that you are prepared to live with. If you balk at my definitions, ask your neighbour to define what 'stupid' behavior is and be prepared to blush or pout or even miss the point.

  I called you stupid because you suggested that bringing your homosexuality into this question, as I did, was not fair or right. That is stupid reasoning as your sexuality goes right to the very heart of this whole issue. Are Jehovah's Witnesses decent, kind warm people. Yes, most of them are *if* you make the choices that they agree with. If you do not, they will shun you in your own home pretending that you do not exist, which I think you will agree is neither decent, kind or warm.

  If the people that you use as an example in your opening paragraphs knew that you were an ex Jehovah's Witness, homosexual who corresponded with the likes of the people on this board, their attitude would be totally different towards you. This is not an opinion being given by Hillary Step, this is a *fact* that will not go away. So how would you define the behavior of JW's now Scooby?

  But please don't call me stupid

  In view of my comments above, what would you much rather call you? Misguided?
  

  . But don't try to judge me or put me in a nice little "Misguided JW box"

  Ooops! No I cannot describe you as that either, I forget that you like your bread buttered on both sides. Perhaps I will settle for calling you just plain wrong. Does that help?

  I have no hatred, no bitterness, no angst toward *any* JW, even those that have treated me badly. JW's are just a reflection of their leaders who are the true culprits in this theological nightmare. But I also recognize fact as such Scooby and in this case the fact is that the Christianity of JW's is about as deep as the latest Watchtower.

  Best regards - HS
• 

  observador

  I realise that you have received much feedback from others over the past day and would understand it if you felt perhaps beleagered by it all. However, do hang on in here.

  Steve, Scoob is a long-time member of this board and people here have always tried to show him the realities of the JW mindset, but he has very often shown a confused thinking and fuzzed logic. Sometimes he jokes and we think he's serious; sometimes he's serious and we think he's joking. These are the things that make him look like an idiot.

  But, Scoob, come on! Let's be serious this time, ok?

  You are an outcast of the JW religion (religion?); as you know, a religion is made up of people. People on this board have shown you far more comprehension and understanding than you ever had in the religion we were once part of; how can you try to equate the way people here treat others with the way JWs do? Remember this, Scoob: the reason why you came out clean and told people here about your personal life was exactly because you knew you would be understood and supported, and you were! Would you do the same in the JW circles with no consequences?

  Sometimes is hard to understand whether you're plain silly or just want to tease people here... and they're getting tired of this!

  Quick, quick, Scoob, call the elders and ask for a reinstatement "bible study" immediately.

  Observador.
• 

  Incense_and_Peppermints

  good grief... here's the "context"...first i said (not to YOU):

  Jehovah's Witnesses are loving, sweet, thoughtful, and kind... ...until they find out you don't want to study with them, are DF'd or (shudder) an apostate. then you said (to ME):

  		Jan 29, 2005
  	Apostates are loving, sweet, thoughtful and kind... until they find out you don't agree with them, dare to disagree, or don't follow the party line. See...it makes as much sense as what you typed.

  then i replied and asked you what part of my original statement was false... you didn't answer. you know why? 'cause you know it's true. jehiovah's witnesses are indeed very nice to you when you are studying with them and when they want to convert you,,, but as soon as they see that you are a lost cause, or an apostate, they shun you. that is the point i was trying to make. then you say:

  Bruce, irf you'd read the line about apostates in the context I'd written it, you would see that I find that statement silly too.....it doesn't make sense to me no more than making a broad statement about JWs does......

  how is it "silly", and a "broad statement", and how does it "not make sense"? and what apostates are you talking about who are nice to you until you disagree with them? i dont know any of the people here beyond what they post, so maybe i can't judge them like you seem to be able to. if you say i'm making a blanket statement, then so are you, only yours is the one that's inaccurate, because jw's are the ones who can't think for themselves and string two words together without permission from the governing body, or without worrying what somebody will think. excuse me, i thought when you created this thread you were asking people's honest opinions, but i see that you only want people to post stuff you agree with, apparently.