by lurk 20 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
The WT. does not say they are the mediator. They say Christ is but you technically need to be anointed to enjoy his mediatorship. Meanwhile they say, the Christian congregation has the faithful slave which God and Christ use to get things done.
G'day Lurk,
You may find these references helpful:
*** w79 11/15 24-5 Benefiting from "One Mediator Between God and Men" ***
11 However, was God making the new covenant with the natural, fleshly ?house of
** w79 11/15 27 Benefiting from "One Mediator Between God and Men" *** 23 Today, according to authentic records, there is a ?great crowd? of dedicated, baptized Christians who actively collaborate with the small remnant of spiritual Israelites. Ever since the spring of 1938 they have been invited to attend the annual memorial celebration of Christ?s death, not to partake of the memorial emblems, the unleavened bread and the red wine, but as respectful observers. They recognize Jesus Christ as their heavenly King since the Gentile Times ended in 1914. They zealously join the remnant of spiritual Israelites in preaching ?this good news of the kingdom? in all the inhabited earth for a ?witness to all the nations? before this system of things ends in the coming ?great tribulation.? (Matt. 24:14, 21) They recognize that they are not spiritual Israelites in the new covenant mediated by Jesus Christ, nor part of the ?chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation.??1 Pet. 2:9.
24 Yet they do benefit from the operation of the new covenant. They benefit from this just as, in ancient , the ?alien resident? benefited from residing in among the Israelites who were in the Law covenant.?Ex. ; Lev. , 33, 34; Rev. 7:9-15.
25 To keep in relationship with ?our Savior, God,? the ?great crowd? needs to remain united with the remnant of spiritual Israelites. Why? Because these spiritual Israelites are the ?holy nation? of which we read in Jeremiah 31:35, 36, right after God?s promise of the new covenant: ?This is what Jehovah, the Giver of the sun for light by day, the statutes of the moon and the stars for light by night, the One stirring up the sea that its waves may become boisterous [against the Egyptians pursuing the Israelites], the One whose name is Jehovah of armies, has said: ??If these regulations could be removed from before me,? is the utterance of Jehovah, ?those who are the seed of Israel could likewise cease from proving to be a nation before me always.???
*** w79 4/1 31 Questions from Readers ***
รณ Is Jesus the ?mediator? only for anointed Christians? The term ?mediator? occurs just six times in the Christian Greek Scriptures and Scripturally is always used regarding a formal covenant. Moses was the ?mediator? of the Law covenant made between God and the nation of . (Gal. 3:19, 20) Christ, though, is the ?mediator of a new covenant? between Jehovah and spiritual , the ?Israel of God? that will serve as kings and priests in heaven with Jesus. (Heb. 8:6; ; ; Gal. 6:16) At a time when God was selecting those to be taken into that new covenant, the apostle Paul wrote that Christ was the ?one mediator between God and men.? (1 Tim. 2:5) Reasonably Paul was here using the word ?mediator? in the same way he did the other five times, which occurred before the writing of 1 Timothy 2:5, referring to those then being taken into the new covenant for which Christ is ?mediator.? So in this strict Biblical sense Jesus is the ?mediator? only for anointed Christians. The new covenant will terminate with the glorification of the remnant who are today in that covenant mediated by Christ. The ?great crowd? of ?other sheep? that is forming today is not in that new covenant. However, by their associating with the ?little flock? of those yet in that covenant they come under benefits that flow from that new covenant. During the millennium Jesus Christ will be their king, high priest and judge.
In addition, we note that the two baptism questions were changed after these Watchtowers to include being baptised into God's spirit-led organisation, rather than into Christ.
Hope this helps.
Cherer, Ozzie
The above quote should include this:
Jesus Christ in heaven is the Mediator between God and the spiritual Israelites
Jesus Christ in heaven is the Mediator between God and the spiritual Israelites
Wow, so they say the rank and file witnesses don't even have Christ as their mediator?
Guess I've been out too long.
Bryan
Have You Seen My Mother
Bryan:
This what did it for Mrs Ozzie and I think that many of the R&F don't realise it's part of "the Troof" that they're publishing! If they knew, i don't doubt they'd do as Mrs Ozzie did, say I have Jesus as my mediator so you (the WTS) can take a hike!
Ozzie
lurk if you have access to a proclaimers book , look under mediator . i dont have one or i'd scan it in for you. but it too says that jesus isnt the mediator between man and god..he's the mediator between the faithful discreet slave and god. its an issue that really made me see that the wtbs is waaaaaay off base.
thank you for all of your replies thanks for explaining it
i have have not been baptised for (reasons i dont wanna explain just now) so i was hanging on the edges as a unbaptised publisher (wordly assosciate as one sister liked to remind me) for 11 years and never saw the baptisum stuff . i really would like to see it ,does anyone you have a copy of the baptisum requirements and what you have to learn and say/agree to?
a while ago i saw posts about mediatorship and got a nagging feeling but i only now grasp the true meaning of what theyare saying.
This what did it for Mrs Ozzie and I think that many of the R&F don't realise it's part of "the Troof" that they're publishing! If they knew, i don't doubt they'd do as Mrs Ozzie did, say I have Jesus as my mediator so you (the WTS) can take a hike!
Ozzie
i told a lady i know who used to study about this and asked her if she had understood that she wasnt included with jesus ransom ..she was totaly horrified she had no idea that this si what it ment and she studid for a long time(before the 6 month limit rule ).before the 1975 incident scared her off .
lurk if you have access to a proclaimers book , look under mediator . i dont have one or i'd scan it in for you. but it too says that jesus isnt the mediator between man and god..he's the mediator between the faithful discreet slave and god. its an issue that really made me see that the wtbs is waaaaaay off base. candidlynuts
thanks for that offer candidly, i have got the proclaimers i will have a look and see what it says .i find it really hard to find anything in there as the dates and info are all over the place.
lurk
I had an epiphany about this mediator thing the other morning in the shower. Next time I see my family or a JW I'm going to ask them if they ended their prayers with "in the name of spiritual Isreal" instead of "in the name of Jesus"?
Well....think about it, the JW's are being told that Spiritual Isreal? is their mediator, then they should pray through their mediator.
Joy
Insight Vol 2 Page 362
Thosefor Whom Christ Is Mediator. The apostle Paul declares that there is "one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all"?for both Jews and Gentiles. (1Ti 2:5, 6) He mediates the new covenant between God and those taken into the new covenant, the congregation of spiritual Israel. (Heb 8:10-13; 12:24; Eph 5:25-27) Christ became Mediator in order that the ones called "might receive the promise of the everlasting inheritance" (Heb 9:15); he assists, not the angels, but "Abraham?s seed." (Heb 2:16) He assists those who are to be brought into the new covenant to be ?adopted? into Jehovah?s household of spiritual sons; these eventually will be in heaven as Christ?s brothers, becoming a part with him of the seed of Abraham. (Ro 8:15-17, 23-25; Ga 3:29) He has transmitted to them the promised holy spirit, with which spirit they are sealed and are given a token of what is to come, their heavenly inheritance. (2Co 5:5; Eph 1:13, 14) The total number of those who are finally and permanently sealed is revealed in Revelation 7:4-8 as 144,000.
There is only one reference to 'mediator' in the Proclaimers book on page 630
