The later doctrine of incarnation was especially built up by Greek Fathers upon Johannine concepts. They share a common notion of time and eternity which is very different from ours. I think that's why I find your diagram somewhat reductionist, as well as the concepts of "before" or "after" incarnation.
Regardless of when the incarnation actually occured, there is a point at which the spirit person of "the Son" inhabits flesh "in time". The diagram merely presents that.
I would also qualify that I have a dual sense of "time" and "eternity" going on in my head, to which the diagram only represents that which occured "in time". In the eternal sense did he ever leave heaven? Further, does the Holy Spirit? Where is heaven?
I believe that there's a sense in which the believer, ajoined to Christ "in the 'spirit'", is in heaven while on earth.
Ok we have the flesh and spirit, now what of the soul? Jesus soul that somehow doesnt sound right.
That he had a body of flesh can be seen from Luk.24:39.
That he had a soul, which his divine nature didn't not supply the place of, Isa.53:10; Matt.26:38.
That he could render up his spirit to the Father, Luk.23:46.
Interesting compilation of the details.
Would it be true that you would tend to put yourself in the camp that followed this doctrine?
Let me start by saying Jesus never stopped being God. I do believe The Father forsook the Son completely (body, soul and spirit). I don't think that Jesus was separated from any part of His person (or his self), until his body died .
...whereas I would hold that the separation of soul and spirit occured while alive, perhaps beginning as early as in the garden of Gethsemane. How do you understand Heb.4:12?
LT wrote: It's not so much a matter of having relationships with the parts, any more than a hand has a distinct relationship with a fingernail.
DD wrote: It is, if you are comparing us to The triune God.
Ah, this may be where the misunderstanding is coming in. I'm not talking about a triune man, but a tri-part one. God isn't tri-part, he's three persons, one God. Specifically "the Son" became
man, one person in two distinct natures. An individual is one man, one person, one nature. Of course I perhaps really might throw the cat amongst the pigeons with 2Pet.1:4, but maybe another time...
"How can God die?" I can only say, that any part of the Trinity being separated, might fit the biblical definition of death.
How can God deny Himself? Surely it was the human person of God that was forsaken, not the deity of the Son? (or put another way, the human nature, not the divine one
I don't agree with that. I think that we're all made of the same stuff. Can you see auras?
Now I would call that "lifeforce", the living energy that inhabits living beings, perhaps more akin to the Ruach of the Hebrew language. As for the universe being joined together, I would see that as the connectedness of an omnipresent God, with perhaps the Holy Spirit (herself?) being the very fabric of this (if you want to take the conversation down to a quantum energy level
) - but I digress. I see this as distinct from the "soul/spirit" that we are, though intimately connected.
To say that humans are the only ones with "spirits" is elevating the human above the rest of creation, in fact, the rest of the universe.
Yes, that would be my premise.
Connected, yet distinct.
Originally created as Lords of the material universe. Interestingly above angels, too, if Heb.1:14 is to be understood in that manner.