disfellowship or disassociate

by Odrade 42 Replies latest members private

• 

  bikerchic

  ((((((((((((((Odrade & Patter)))))))))))))

  I know you've been struggling with this for a long time. There is a saying, it's rather crude but I think it settles things quite well; $#!+ or get off the pot!

  You know if you don't go to the Memorial you will get a visit from the Elders asking why. IMHO I would let them in, listen to what they have to say give no answer to the question if you believe this is Jehovah's Organization. Calmly tell them to do what they feel they must do to protect the congregation, make it brief and ask them to leave. Then get on with your lives. Don't go to any Committee meetings. You will probably be DF'ed, but it will be done and you can move on.

  I think as time goes by your families will have some interaction with you and Patter as long as it's not discussing spiritual things. I know that is the biggest concern for you and especially Patter, but really family never goes away entirely and you have the ball in your court to define how you will interact with them regardless of their crumby religious rules.

  I think this would bring closure to you and Patter and you'll feel free to live your lives however you choose. It would be a big weight lifted off your shoulders.

  Just my .02. I wish you both well in whatever you decide to do. It's great to have a new community of people who totally understand what you are going through and fill in when you've lost all your JW friends and family. Craig and I really value our friendship with you both and we are here anytime for you guys.

  Hugs to you both!

  Kate
• 

  rocketman

  .

  Normally, I recommend just keeping the status quo for as long as possible. But, if playing the fade game does become intolerable, than in my mind the better option is DAing. I'm the type that likes to think that I made the call. With DAing I think you get that bit of additional satisfaction.
• 

  Winston Smith :>D

  I DA'd myself once I knew Pandora's Box was opened and the Hounds of Hell would get me.

  Like Else said, "You can't fire me, I quit!"

  For those that say it's stooping to their rules, I say,

  "I don't mind beating you over the head with your own stick!"

  I try to stick to the philosophy of "Failing Fast"

  If it ain't working out, then cut bait and move on.

  When I DA'd myself, I especially enjoyed postponing the meeting when I handed in my letter to the Thought Police so that I would have time to mail out my DA letter to 20+ people in different congregations. The elders were getting calls about my DA'ing before it was even announced at the School & Service meeting. I loved it!

  Today, I never regret DA'ing myself, especially when I see another JW.

  I just saw a JW this last Sunday. I had a grin on my face and was enjoying the day when I then saw a JW from my old KH. I continued smiling and was happy to see her and waved at her. She waved back with a smile on her face and was happy to see me, then caught herself and put her hand down after she realized what she had done. I kept walking with a genuine smile on my face because I was on my way to something else and had no time to talk. Otherwise I would have walked over to her to see how she is doing.

  I feel that by DA'ing myself, I have no shame in seeing a JW anymore than I would if I saw a old co-worker from a company that I quit to go work somewhere better. By way of comparison, if I saw a old co-worker from a company that I was fired from, that would make me feel uneasy because I would wonder what has been said at work against me for a reason to fire me. By quitting the company, everyone would know that I left on my terms and would think that I had a better place to go.

  Quitting takes their rules and empowers you to do what you want. Getting fired is a last kick to the balls IMO even if you say you don't care what they think.

  He who laughs last, laughs best.

  My $0.02
• 

  franklin J

  Odrade,

  why do you owe any explanations? Even if your family is still loyal to the WT and you know a lot of people; Your abscence will say it all. Why play by the WT rules? To do so would be acknowledge their dominance and continuing influence over you.

  just walk away and do not look back.

  This is what I did; and it worked for me.
• 

  Swan

  Dear Odrade,

  I am sorry it has come to this, but the fade is very hard when you are so well connected by family ties to the congregation. There is a lot to be weighed on either side of the issue, but I have another point for you to consider.

  When I was a dub in good standing, whenever they made the announcement that someone was DF, I wondered what trouble they got caught doing. In my mind was the thought that they committed some act and were at fault. Whenever they made an announcement that someone DA themselves, especially those who had been strong in the "Truth", I saw it as a choice they had made to leave Jah's Organization. I was wondering about what was wrong with the organization that these people would walk away. Those doubts gave me the courage to walk away too, eventually.

  Tammy
• 

  willyloman

  I would not write a letter, I would not attend a JC.

  The thing that elders really HATE is when you treat them as though they, and their entire organization, are totally irrelevant to your life.
• 

  XQsThaiPoes

  Better go guerilla. At this memorial partake the embelms and enjoy the fallout. Heck still do it it is much better then they assume you're crazy and cower in fear cuz the watchtower says they can't DF you for partaking. Until they see you were just pulling their chain. Also the annoited get to believe what they want effectively, for you can be the faithful slave . Its like being DFed just a holy DFing and people still have to talk to you . God I'm a jerk.
• 

  Sassy

  I'm leaning towards the last option. If they want to get us, it's their rules, their action. I will do nothing to either help or hinder whatever that action might be.

  That is where I am at.. I don't want to play their game, so why should I submit myself to meeting with them, talking to them, etc.. It only raises my blood pressure for nothing.

  Sometimes I think maybe I should just DA myself and tell them to stay away from me. but then I think, why should I? that is their game plan.. that makes it easier for them.

  Nope.. I have washed my hands of them. I dont' care really what they do to me.

  But we all have different reasons for different feelings.. and sometimes my opinion even on myself wavers from time to time.
• 

  Odrade

  See? I knew you guys would have lots of new perspectives. I've gotten myself so far into that little "I don't want to play their game" box that I couldn't really view the subject without squinting.

  Ian:

  while you're not DFd or DAd others with serious doubts might be more willing to come and see you.

  This is part of my reasoning. We have good reason to hope that my sis-in-law and her family will soon be free of this disgusting cult too. To take any action ourselves would definitely complicated the little tidbits of info we have been tossing their direction.

  And Scully, my thinking thus far has been that if they take action against us in absentia, certain individuals might be able to say "Hey, how is that justice? How is that loving shepherding?"

  Kate, thanks so much, you and Craig have been with us since almost the beginning of this, and we couldn't ask for a better surrogate family. Sometimes I feel like I AM "stuck on the pot" I've been beating this subject around for so long, but you know, it's game time. My mother is starting to behave really schizo, one minute acts like family, the next won't look at me or acknowledge me when I speak. So things are coming to a head. So much for the fade...

  "You can't fire me, I quit!"

  "I don't mind beating you over the head with your own stick!"

  On the other hand... Else, rocketman, Winston, I hadn't quite thought of it in these terms... these ARE their rules, and two can play that game, taking a stand and saying "You made the rules..." might give us a lot of closure. I just want to be sure that we play it cool until we can help the sis-i-l make the transition. Then to hell with the rest of 'em. Besides, once the line is drawn, we'd finally be able to talk openly about our feelings and ideas without fear of reprisal. There won't be anything else they can do. Gonna have to think about that one.

  Franklin, Sassy, Loman, that's where I've been fixated, on not playing there game. I'm still kind of inclined that way. It seems sometimes like that's just what it is, a big f***ing game. Move the wrong pawn and they'll steal my queen. I've kind of been playing on the assumption that if I don't move anything, it's as effective as a checkmate.

  Swan,

  I was wondering about what was wrong with the organization that these people would walk away. Those doubts gave me the courage

  I love you honey, you just cut right to it don't you. Really, this is the only good reason that has kept the question alive in my mind. Maybe someone would wonder why two born-in raised-in, would publicly walk away.

  and Typos... bwahahahahaha!!!!! Thanks for the laugh!

  Odrade
• 

  crownboy

  If I were presented with the situation you put forth (since I'd optimally want to fade as I'm doing now), then I'd DA myself verbally. If the elders were to ask me to attend a judicial committee that's more of a sentencing hearing than a true trial, I'd tell them I wasn't coming and that I'd like them to DA me. I'd like to think that I could walk into the judicial committee and talk some sense into the elders, but I know such a situation has zero chance of happenning. So in place of that I'd put myself in a situation where I'd show them how insignificant they are to me (by not attending their kangaroo court, and not wasting my time giving them a formal letter), but also signify to other JW's that I was the one who rejected the religion and not the other way around (because whether it's true or not, a DF person conjures up in the JW mind a person who's groveling to the elders for a "second chance", but who utimately must be given a "time out" for being such a bad person. Perhaps the clear message given by my DA'ing might cause some to question, whereas a DF might give the impression that I might be back soon ).

  Lucky you for not having to attend the memorial. I have to keep up occasional appearances, so I have the misfortune of having to go. I'm willing to bet $1000 that the two songs that will be used will be numbers 87 and 105. Who wants to bet against me?