Prisca, I remember the chart you mentioned. We did not have a chalk board, we had a regualar board with professioal lettering. At any rate, everything was up there: number of magazine placements, number of back calls (now called return visits, I think) number of bible studies, number of hours. IBM would have been proud of our sales chart.
JW changes over time
by larc 70 Replies latest jw friends
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Englishman
Larc,
I remember the chart very well indeed. It was a source of great amusement in the UK to see a chart seeking to increase the number of "PUBS."
PUBS = publishers.
Englishman.
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DanTheMan
Hey larc, good to see you back in cyberspace.
From what I understand, during the era that you were a JW, there was no prohibition towards being involved in extra-curriculars like student government and sports, and that disfellowshipping was much more rare.
JWism became totalitarian in the days of Rutherford, but I think that up until the 1970's/1980's, they didn't have to work so hard to bully JW's into submission. The bullying gets worse every year, with the neverending admonitions in the magazines and KM's to "never resist the counsel being given by Jehovah through his Organization" and similar statements.
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jayhawk1
As a young pup, I don't have anything to add to this, but I sure enjoyed reading it.
Since things clearly are not the same today for Jehovah's Witnesses, I wonder what would happen if it were possible to do the following:
1. Bring back to life those who died as faithful Jehovah's Witnesses during the 1940-1960 era. Especially those who died due to a Jehovah's Witness policy, whether it has since changed or not.
2. Show them how the Society works today. Not the front put on for Jehovah's Witnesses and potential Jehovah's Witnesses, but how it really is. (eg. drinking at the society, legalistic rules, changes in "light" etc.)
3. Give them the opportunity to decide if they still want to be a part of it, without the fear of being damned by Jehovah.
It makes me wonder if they would still want to die a faithful Jehovah's Witness. Just something I have been thinking about.
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Room 215
As I said on another thread, JWs, led by their mealy-mouthed leaders in Brooklyn/Patterson have lost a lot of their moral fiber. Time was when Jehohvah's feisty band of Theocratic Warriors would hew to an unequivocal stand on any issue.
It's hard to imagine, for example, that the old-timers would countenance the type of duplicity evident in the Borg's current stance on voting, ie. one in which a Nov. '99 WT Question from Readers declares it ``a matter of conscience" in print for public consumption, then sub-rosa gets the word out via the verbal grapevine and their hatchetmen (COs and DOs) that '' disregard it; nothing's really changed." In the old days, they would simply stand firm and declare ``damn the consequences; we ain't gonna vote, it's a violation of Christian neutrality; like it or lump it!"
Moreover, the average JW was much more capable of articulating and defending his/her beliefs when challenged at the door or in any public venue. Terms "brother" and ``sister" were much more taken to heart and the friends, feeling marginalized by their radical worldview, stood together much more closely; disfellowshipping was rare and only considered as a last resort; fancy, owned Kingdom Halls were rare to nil, and rented storefronts and walk-ups were the rule.
Public talks were just that, addresses to the non-JW public, with speakers expounding on broad doctrinal subjects; public talk outlines were just that, bare skeletal contructions which required the quite carefully-vetted speakers to do considerable research to ``flesh them out'' and provided ample opportunity for personal expression.
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minimus
I was born into the religion in the 50's. As much as so many things have changed, those changes really make no difference. The actual teachings of the religion, which is the core, are terribly flawed. Everything from "The faithful and discreet slave class" to the "great crowd" is wrong. So if the basic teachings are corrupted, what difference does it make that people were put on probation but now they're disfellowshipped? The religion and the teachers and teachings are the problem.
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Room 215
The only difference observations of this sort makes, Minimum, is to demonstrate that, in common with all other religious organizations of human origin, the history of JWs is hewing to a well-established progression from initial vitality and radicalism toward institutionalization, legalism and the inevitable fork in the road that leads either to mainstreaming or oblivion.
All religions begin life in the conviction that they alone hold the keys to understanding God and life's greatest mysteries; in time they meld into a vast field of contenders, all of whom are right about some things, wrong about others.
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garybuss
I saw it all. I am 59 and took my first door alone at age 7 in 1951. The Hall was a rented store front on a back street. There was a service chart on hinges that the company servant unhooked and swung out once a month to point to the numbers with a wooden dowel.
There was little time for play and schoolwork was not important since the end was so near. Tuesday night we got to the bookstudy at 6:45 and did an hour of magazine work before the study every week. Wednesday was backcall night and we were there every week from 7 till 9. Thursday night was ministry school and service meeting from 7:30 till 10. There was a 10 minute break so the smokers could go outside and have a smoke.
Saturday morning was magazine work again and started from the bookstudy place except when the circuit servant was in town. Then it started at the hall and went all day. Sunday summer was isolated territory all day with a cold packed lunch and then back home for hotdogs before the talk and Watchtower study in the evening. There was a 15 minute smoke break between the talk and the Watchtower study. We finished up the day after 10 pm.
Most days at school I went without homework done just because there was no time to do it. I only had Monday, Friday, and Saturday evenings without service or meetings. My dad was a climber and he never missed anything. My mother went along until 1958 when she went to bed with a permanent headache. I was forced to go to it all.
Nothing they promised me ever came true. GaryB -
garybuss
Oh, one thing did come true. They told me if I ever left, they would shun me. They have kept that promise.
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ozziepost
The congregation overseer was the final arbitor (sp?) and the results were generally better than the committee decisions of a body of elders. I believe the same applies to the before and after at Bethel with the Governing Body. Committee decisions, usually do not work well.
That's an interesting observation, larc. (BTW welcome back, mate!)
For the decades after the change to an elder system, the R&F generally, and this admittedly is anecdotal, believed things were much better for the change. I think that although "rule" by one person may be more direct and responsive, it was open to autocracy.
Was it better back then? I suspect it was. It's certainly more 'bland' today than it used to be. It's also more harsh in its treatment of individuals.
Just my opinion, of course, but I think it's valid.
Cheers, Ozzie
