Why did Lloyd Evans say in one of his latest video

by mickbobcat 29 Replies latest social current

• 

  Brock Talon

  there is a tendency for it to become a motivation to perpetuate the thing itself and to invent things to use to continue the money-making activism, even if there is nothing really that warrants any 'activisming'

  So, so true. I have watched for years as people like Al Sharpton will perpetuate race issues without any REAL intent on fixing any real issues, lest the problems be actually addressed and potentially solved and their living dried up.

  Example: It was actually frightening to see Al, and the rest of the Black community, label Donald Trump a racist the minute he came down the elevator to announce his running for president. Frightening because I had known for years that Donald Trump was the DARLING of Democrats, Liberals, Progressives and the like, and all were fast close friends with Trump. When I heard Trump was running for office I thought to myself "here is a non-politician type who could actually help change things and possibly bridge the gap between blacks and whites, liberals and conservatives." (Although I admit that I thought he had a snowball's chance of actually getting elected.) But instead of leveraging Trump's desire to help the Black community once he was in office (he reached out early and often to them) he was bitterly rejected and labeled a racist by the likes of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, et al. These were people who previously were good friends with "The Orange man." Sure, Donald was a brash, loud, bullying, wife-cheating ego maniac who said dumb things, but he was THEIR brash, loud, bullying, wife-cheating ego maniac who said dumb things. But now, the "activists" believed it was better to make Trump out to be a racist so the hand wringing and black activism could continue in earnest - anything to keep the activist engine running and those coffers full. Heaven forbid we as a country actually SOLVE any real black vs. white issues that may exist. It was there and then that I realized what fakes, liars and charlatans these people really were. They did not care one blasted bit about the actual issues, everything was motivated by politics, money, power, and the like. That much became crystal clear.
  

  Meanwhile, these same "activists" just LOVED Joe Biden, a career politician with a proven track-record of racism. The current Vice President aptly called Joe out on this during the presidential debates, but then awkwardly tried to walk it back after being asked to run for VP with her racist running mate. What a crock.

  But hey, what does that matter to the activists? Now they can continue with hand wringing and activism some more! These are the same people who gave Obama a pass at doing A BIG FAT ZERO for the Black community in 8 years of office, but excuse away Trump's criminal justice reform, pardoning of a black prisoner, support of Black Colleges, etc. that actually DID help the Black community.

  Hypocrites.
  

  That is why the problems that the black community complains about NEVER GET FIXED, at least, in their minds, because their activist leaders makes sure they don't.
  

  In the end, most "career activists" end up being con men and con women for exactly this.
• 

  slimboyfat

  Remember the time somebody posted a parody announcement from Watchtower on this forum and Cedars made a video about it as if it was real? Sorry don’t have the links.
• 

  Simon

  Oh, I think I remembered the quote, it was something like:

  "Never expect any person or group to solve a problem when their revenue relies on the existence of that problem"

  I may have paraphrased it slightly wrong, but there is so much truth to this.

  The aim of most 'activists' should be to make themselves redundant. Call me when you find some activist who even appears to be trying to do this.

  Jeez, the word "activist" just conjures up a picture in my mind of some self-proclaimed, self-important wannabe saviour type who's either using their "activism" as an excuse to be an asshole or to make a quick-buck ... possibly both.
• 

  Jofi_Wofo

  I don't know anything at all about Lloyd's history with this site. I'll have to grab some popcorn and look over the links Simon posted. I do have a couple of observations that might be somewhat relevant here.

  First, this is a website that is open to everyone, and it shows in just how high its highs are and how low its lows are. Read the wrong thread on the wrong day, and you'll see half a dozen lunatics screaming complete conspiratorial nonsense at one another over esoteric minutia. If you want to cherry pick several of those threads, you could support the notion that this website is overrun with sociopaths. That's just the nature of free speech- the more voices you hear, the greater volume of both good and bad wind up in the mix and you can easily cherry pick whatever impression you're inclined to make.

  Second, Lloyd is squarely mainstream Left his politics. This board isn't squarely mainstream left in its politics. That's all I'll say about that.

  I like this forum and I like Lloyd's content. It's ok if they are at odds with one another- they can separate themselves from one another and fight the common enemy on different fronts.
• 

  FatFreek 2005

  Jofi_Wofo

  Excellent comments. Yes, this site is mainstream right with staunch supporters of Trump and his ilk. While I voted for the man the first time around, I wouldn't give him the time of day -- as if he needs it.

  While McCain was incarcerated for more than 5 years, Trump spent his time ogling women and golfing. To make it worse he called McCain a coward for being captured.

  "Presidential candidate Donald Trump sparked yet another backlash among his fellow Republican candidates Saturday when he said that Sen. John McCain was only considered a war hero because he was captured - and seemed to mock him for that fact."

  As to Evans, he is doing a great service with his videos. He's not perfect, nor is this site -- which I used to love 16 years ago when I joined and when the issues were mainly Watchtower and its dropouts and experiences. When those topics thinned out it shifted to the political spectrum.
• 

  Bill Covert

  In 2013 after the release of the RNWT, Lloyd did a blog entitled "The Silver Sword", where posters tied to find the faults of the new translation. I posted about the revision of Lev.5:1 and the 1987 Sept 1 Wt. article "A Time to Speak When?" . It flew about three pay grades over his head. I called him on it and that snotty nosed kid had the audacity to say that I was flippant.

  So I took it to Barbara Anderson where she was interested in looking into what I had. First she had to update web site, took about a year. When she finally got started on the project, it took me about 6 weeks of back and forth before it really dawned on her what deception the WTB&TS pulled off in the "A Time to Speak When?" article. She said in her entire career this project consumed more time than any other research project she ever did. The results was her article "Flawed Decrees Conceal Criminals". She made the article fit around her agenda on molestations.

  She never credited me with the intellectual property of being the source of the comprehension of the relationship between the new revision of Lev.5:1 and the Wt. article "A Time to Speak When?". Nor was she interested in comprehending why the church has cloaked their RNWT revision of Lev. 5:1 in silence, as it would create major problems with the blood issue. Barbara listens to Barbara, to try to get her to think in a different way is a exercise in futility.

  In February I was watching PBS documentary on the Black Church, Henry Louis Gates Jr. presentation entitled "This is Our Story, This is Our Song". So i says to myself, self that is the guy I need to send send "A Time to Speak When?" to; he is a real scholar, he is a minister, he is world rebounded scholar on Black history, he is a civil rights leader, he is a human rights leader. If there was only person in the world who had the power and comprehension of taking the WTB&TS "shunning policies" to task this would be the guy.

  So I showed him the deception in the "A Time To Speak When?" article and I used some reasoning Barbara Anderson gleaned out of her attending a SNAP convention, as to being able to tell the difference between church teaching and church policy. To where when going against a church do not get involved in teachings as that is like trying to squeeze grease, but focus only on policy. So I showed him how by the date of the Sept. 1 1987 article "A Time to Speak When?" and how the article was written it was simply a hunting license to ferret out the new emerging church enemy "the apostate".

  But more importantly I showed him how by taking the 'informant policy' of Lev. 5:1 and standing it along side the blood policy it can be proven that the death of Prince Rogers was murder!

  When the Dereck Chavin guilty verdict was given a CNN entertainment reporter did a article as to how "Prince" would react to the "Black Lives Matter" killings in his beloved city. She cited his death attributed to pain killers. So I emailed her. Let her know about the hip problems and the blood policy. I told her about the material I sent to H.L. Gates Jr. and said if Gates can figure out the deception of the "A Time to Speak When?" article and the 2013 RNWT revision of Lev.5:1 then it could be proven that the death of Prince was criminal! So hopefully she sent the email up the CNN chain and they contacted H. L. Gates Jr. to see what he comes up with if he does the research.

  It will be a hell of a story if CNN can show that the death of Prince was criminal.
• 

  Diogenesister

  saw a quote along these lines the other day, about how groups formed to object to a 'thing' end up becoming dependent on and part of the ecosystem of the 'thing', but can't remember the exact context. Wish I'd saved a reference as I thought at the time it was quite profound and likely useful.

  Well there's quite a lot of gay men and women currently saying that because Stonewall et al has essentially achieved their objective, which was equal rights for gays under the law, at least in the western world, they are now driving this whole trans bandwagon.That they basically were so effective they've done themselves out of a job.

  That the trans thing is a fantastic new revenue stream for them.bThis is the problem with paid activism, there's always the suspicion it's not in their interests for the issue they campaign for to disappear

  Similarly what would Lloyd do if watchtower packed up and finished? Unless he was able to transfer over into mainstream journalism it would be difficult.

  I think that comment by Lloyd was enormously uncharitable, particularly given the incredible part JWdotnet has played in his and others awakening over the years. It also made his guest very uncomfortable since he obviously felt this site had really helped his family

  Another thing that grates my gears is that exJW Reddit has a list of the most useful resources for JWs, and not only does it not mention this site but it claims EXJWreddit itself is THE most abundant source of information on all things watchtower which is patently and laughably untrue!! This site has an enormous amount of extremely well researched information...by far the most. It even listed JWsurvey and similar places when they had just started out and had very little that wasn't available everywhere else! It's this that makes me think there was some kind of Reddit takeover by Cedars mates when they saw how big it was getting. I was there when they only had a couple thousand subscribers and the moderators suddenly changed at about 18,000 subs. I think they are incredibly controlling now. I'd like to start a new one but I don't know how to moderate.

  People like the blue envelope channel come here for info to make their idiosyncratic and informative videos, because you can't find this kind of ,"long toothed"😂 watchtower wisdom anywhere else now.
• 

  joe134cd

  I think he’s the type of guy you either love or hate. However, this I will say that his work was extremely influential in making my mind up to leave the JWs. I was PIMO at the time of Loyds arrival as an anonymous blogger John cedars.
• 

  nonjwspouse

  I watched the video and was quite disappointed in him for making that spiteful comment.

  I was a new regular here when the whole unfortunate thing went down with Cedars/Lloyd, and saw the postings back and forth early that morning when the FB mess hit the fan. Also, when the name of the group was changed.
• 

  OnTheWayOut

  Lloyd made some huge mistakes and outed some people on FB who were not known to their families as anti-JW.
  People on this forum called him out.
  
  Oh, and this- Lloyd basically said that he didn't need to apologize for his mistakes but said that here's your apology since you need one.
  People on this forum called him out for that.
  
  Lloyd has since tried to take advantage of ex-JW's financially in a few ways so that he could make a living out of his ex-JW efforts.
  People on this forum called him out.
  
  Watch your back around Lloyd. He asked ex-JW's if they wanted to have their life story in his next book, and he asked them to pay him to put it in the book. He admitted he would edit it in any way he wants without consulting them, and they could never have their story published anywhere else.