How to sue the WT over shunning policy. It CAN happen!

by Bad_Wolf 224 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  JC323

  Let me also ask you this.

  Under your theory, no one can tell someone who to speak with and who not too.

  Let's say that you are a parent and Timmy down the street you feel is a bad influence and you tell your son not to speak with Timmy because you think he will corrupt your son. Would that be a violation of your son's rights?

  Or let's say that your wife slept with someone else and you are so hurt that you tell your grown kids if you speak to your mom again, don't bother speaking to me, because you chose her over me. Would the father be infringing on this children's rights?

  There is no compelling governmental interest to ensure that people speak with each other. Even in child neglect laws, the only requirement of communication between a parent and child is to ensure the child's basic necessity. If the parent never says I love you or never says how was school, there is no compelling interest for the government to enforce that.
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  StephaneLaliberte

  So please propose how you would want a neutral law to be written that doesn't violate the free exercise of religion and free association of the constitution.

  Perhaps the solution would be to lobby politicians to amend the laws that pertain to abuse and harassment. Make sure that forcing or coercing anyone to shun anyone else would be part of the definition.
  
  
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  JC323

  so Stephane where is the line drawn. If someone murders a family member should the family of the victim be allowed to encourage each other to shun the murderer? Should a parent not be allowed to tell their child who they can or cannot talk to. Can a company tell an employee that in their official duties they cannot speak with a competitor about the industry that might be proprietary? Where is the line?
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  MeanMrMustard

  @vienne: +1000
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  StephaneLaliberte

  Let's say that you are a parent and Timmy down the street you feel is a bad influence and you tell your son not to speak with Timmy because you think he will corrupt your son. Would that be a violation of your son's rights?

  Interesting.. quite honestly, I like this thread. So, thank you in taking the time in exploring these ideas. Honestly now, there has to be some way to put it that would prevent a scenario in which someone loses everyone he knows.

  Now, the Timmy scenario: Parents have authority over their kids. Hence, they can do things to them that would be out right forbidden to do to adults. For instance, in Canada, parents have the right to spank their kids. ground them (keep them in their room, etc). Now try to do that to your wife! That's abuse.

  Now for the "father" scenario: Interesting.. let me think about it a bit more..
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  JC323

  So you accept that people with authority have the right to control aspects of their lives. Under the law, whether you think it is right or not, the internal discipline or the internal rules of that faith lies with one entity the religion. That is the only entity that can make rules that don't violate a neutral law.
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  StephaneLaliberte

  If someone murders a family member should the family of the victim be allowed to encourage each other to shun the murderer?

  Yes. My problem is with reprisals if you don't.
  

  Can a company tell an employee that in their official duties they cannot speak with a competitor about the industry that might be proprietary?

  No. Companies cannot tell employees who they speak to. Divulging company secrets is a crime of its own. This is far from shunning.

  I still need to get back to that father analogy though...

  
  
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  StephaneLaliberte

  Under the law, whether you think it is right or not, the internal discipline or the internal rules of that faith lies with one entity the religion.

  Can a priest apply corporal punishment?
  
  
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  StephaneLaliberte

  Or let's say that your wife slept with someone else and you are so hurt that you tell your grown kids if you speak to your mom again, don't bother speaking to me, because you chose her over me. Would the father be infringing on this children's rights?

  This is a family matter. The problem I would have is with a priest forcing the siblings and father to shun the mother. If you speak to your mom, we will force your dad and siblings to shun you as well. The objective here is to ensure that the decision is a personal one to the ones actually doing the shunning.

  Lets say that the son keeps talking to his mom and he looses contact with the rest of his family, it is likely that he will still have his friends.
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  JC323

  No a priest cannot apply corporal punishment because again it is a neutral law. The goverment has a compeling interest in their citizens not being physically assaulted.

  Please describe the compelling governmental interest that you want to apply with JW shunning.