Reasons for Stagnation in Growth. AKA YearBook Numbers!
I don't think you can really compare the mormon numbers to the JWs. From my understanding, the mormons use some neat tricks to pad their numbers. If the JWs counted people like the mormons do they'd probably be in the 15 million range as well. Mormons count anyone who's ever been on the roster unless specifically removed (in JW terms DF/DA) and this can sometimes include people who have moved away and died. You'd have to count everyone who's faded to really have a comparison.
Yea I heard that --- from JWs - counting dead loved ones. It's not true. Have never read anything like that, or heard it from a credible source.
P.S. other BS from JWs is that Jews have lots of babies because one of them is gonna be the Messiah.
Can't trust those JW's :)
Despite several consecutive years of growth, the ongoing increase in numbers partaking of the emblems has to date provoked not one word of acknowledgement in print or on the platform.
And we know the JWs are scrupulous in excluding among the number of partakers any they deem unsuitable.
So, it's highly likely significantly more than 15,000-plus partook in 2015.
BTW, any one else think this year's Memorial campaign, including the statement, "Millions will attend. Will you?" was even more limp than usual?
Steve2, actually there was an article that talked about it. It mentioned that even though that is increasing, the end is still very soon. I dont remember which one but it was not long ago.
I know of a couple of dyed in the wool JWs that have said: "The religion isn't what it was.All they want is our money."
The corporation survives despite being obviously vile. Their propaganda coupled with the R&F's confirmation bias holds the corproation together.
The trouble is, we use the watchtower corporation's own stats. I say, these can't be trusted anymore than you can trust anything else they spout.
I don't think the R&F are really aware of the scale of the child abuse....and if they are made aware, they put it down to satanic lies.
Steve2 - BTW, any one else think this year's Memorial campaign, including the statement, "Millions will attend. Will you?" was even more limp than usual?
Sounds a bit like 'millions now living will never die.'. Nothing like that old time religion. Recycling at its most vomit worthy.
A few years ago I have a mid week talk and I mentioned the decline in baptisms since the peak in the 90s, and how much more time it takes to make 1 convert from service. I was just going over the yearbook stats to show the situation and the importance of being a real teacher. OMG people were stunned. Its really like they are drones, they were not even aware of the stats in the yearbook that they all love so much.
Simon: You brought up the Shakers.
You know, if the JW's are relegated to Shaker status, I would call that a victory for the cause. Even if they are still technically "around."
tdtt said: A few years ago I have a mid week talk and I mentioned the decline in baptisms since the peak in the 90s, and how much more time it takes to make 1 convert from service. I was just going over the yearbook stats to show the situation and the importance of being a real teacher. OMG people were stunned. Its really like they are drones, they were not even aware of the stats in the yearbook that they all love so much.
I really don't think a lot of diehard JWs do math. As a teenager I saw that their claims did not add up. I suspect a lot of JWs just don't do the thought processing required.
Existing in some form well into the future, is a lot different than existing as-is.
The organization is being forced to make changes to survive. These are not progressive reforms, but rather tactical measures to keep the corporation alive, and none of them are good for morale of the R&F. A shell of a corporation may well exist for a very long time, but there is no denying that either a tipping point has been reached, or is rapidly approaching. WT is in a positive feedback loop. These are more commonly known as "vicious cycles", and they usually are not broken, until something catastrophic happens, unless some negative feedback source is introduced. Based on the way WT has proven itself to deal with external pressures, (such as the ARC), I think that is highly unlikely.
As far as the theory that there is still "growth" happening, and how that means all is still good, is concerned, (if the numbers can even be trusted), I make the appeal to statistical trends. A slowing of growth is a sign of weakness. All systems carry a certain level of inertia to allow them to not only grow, but also do so at a certain velocity, if healthy. That velocity has slowed in recent years, and if the stats are accurate for the past year, growth has slowed <1%. If we were economists, (or investors), looking at this type of trend from an economic perspective, we would have a good statistical indicator that the economy was about to head for recession. WT is either at or near a tipping point of decline.
Also remember all Growth should be measured agains general population growth. All the numbers from the last few years really suck, especially when you factor in the TIME SPENT.