One Thing I Don't Get About Brexit

by JW_Rogue 41 Replies latest jw experiences

  • kaik

    Without the English civil war in the 1640's modern day democracy would never have happened and then spread to the rest of Europe let alone in some outpost of the British Empire now called the USA.

    Democracy is Europe is not British concept, but based on French model. It was the Grande Armée of the I. French Republic that spread democratic ideas on the Continent with emphasis on social justice. This is also reason why all countries except UK follows Napoleon codex, desired republican system, and put higher emphasis on secularization, and social rights. France decriminalize same sex relationships in 1791, liberated slaves, put equality of Jews, people of colors, put constitution to public vote, something USA had not done, or was forced to do so 80-150-200 years later.

    And when it comes to concept of religious tolerance or division of power between ruling elite, Europeans had estate generals, which existed for example in Kingdom of Bohemia till Austrian conquest in 1620 and religious tolerance was established in 1485 there and declared eternal in 1515.... BTW the proponent of religious tolerance in Bohemia was Peter Payne, Englishman, who received asylum in 1414 at Prague because he would be otherwise executed in England.

  • Gargamel

    Although huge swathes of the British electorate don't take the trouble to inform themselves, it's also true that polarised media coverage hampers such attempts anyway. But what is the alternative? We once had a society where only male land-owners above 35? could vote. Before that it was even worse. Gradually, more and more people were allowed a vote; there would have been revolution if, having made massive sacrifices in wars, the ordinary person had no say in who ran the country.

    To make a basic IQ test to determine who can vote would be a slippery slope back to the dark ages.

    Leaving the EU could cause me even bigger financial problems than those I have already, but that is what the people want and I must find a way around that. I also believe it is a massive blunder ideologically speaking, but my visions are different from the majority.


    On our morning Talk Radio this morning a caller told of his family in Devon who were cock-sure it would be a Stay vote but decided to vote Go as a protest against the govt. ! .................................... of this morning ...What is Great Britain ? Geo-Politically that is ?

    Other stats on the UK TV's showed that a large number of >35 yr olds who wanted to Stay did not pitch at the polls and that the vast number of Go's [who did pitch in numbers] was <65 yrs ? Is that kinda correct ?

  • done4good

    The fact that the Brits are Googling what the EU is, after the fact, is all you need to know.

    Emotional decisions almost always end badly.


  • Xanthippe

    I would like to remind everyone that 48% of us did not want to leave the EU.

  • freddo

    No Xanthippe - 48% of those who voted did not want to leave the EU.

  • Xanthippe

    Well Freddo nobody knows what the ones who couldn't be bothered to get down to a polling station thought about it. They threw away their right to be heard.

  • John Free
    John Free

    Bohm that is exactly what the commission does, it creates binding regulations and it determines all legislative proposals. But you are wrong it is not 'democratically' elected by the 'people'. Effectively the people's elected representatives do not get any determination on policy.

  • dozy

    The referendum was just a huge miscalculation by Cameron. It was announced to try to take votes from UKIP and on the assumption that the Conservatives wouldn't win an overall majority anyway so wouldn't be fulfilled.

    It was always a gamble especially with immigration becoming such an issue and the weak half hearted campaign by Labour didn't help.

    Just total folly and madness. The UK is an incredibly divided nation now and the vote threw this into sharp focus.

  • Qcmbr

    Unbelievable. This is what democracy is. It isn't about neat boxes or always overwhelming majorities. It isn't about 'clever' v 'thick' or rich v poor. It is one person one vote and then we have the emotional maturity to accept the result. There was a referendum because that was part of the manifesto the Conservatives where elected on. They put that in their manifesto because a large number of people expressed their dissatisfaction with Europe (lots of votes for UKIP for example.) Just because you happen to disagree vehemently with an important decision doesn't mean that you can question the very basis of democracy and stand like immature idiots cheering every misfortune and difficulty that follows. Mature people use this rare, beautiful, empowering solution to social organisation and campaign for change through hard work, reasoned debate and voting - everyone else turns into keyboard warriors and butt hurt whiners who demand to be told how basic rights work and questioning everyone but themselves.

    Take responsibility. If you were in the UK and didn't vote - you voted for the outcome (whichever way it had gone) in absentia - if you spent the time campaigning by telling people they were racists/bigots/fools/idiots then reap the rewards of negative condescension but if you genuinely voted with thought and research and have the maturity to accept the will of the people then 'respect '- you did all that can be asked of you whichever way you voted. There will be more votes, there will be more opportunities to contribute and take responsibility for the outcomes. This story is far from over and nobody in the UK gets to wash their hands of the job in hand.

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