New Light on the 144,000?

by Ding 45 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • nicolaou

    Bourneidentity, if you think the idea of a disembodied soul rising from the corpse of its former host and then ascending to an unseen dimension to live with a man born to a virgin is simple then you don't understand the meaning of the word 'simple'.

  • Gorbatchov

    The fact is that the change will have no impact at current JW's because they have no clue about doctrine at all. Happy life is their slogan these days. Even if the GB would say the Earth is flat they would accept it.



    It doesn’t really matter. All current Dubs worry about is their own Egos. Whatever makes lying to themselves easier....


  • sir82

    This idea has been discussed on this site for about as long as this site has existed.

    It makes sense that at some point they would make such a change.....on the other hand, it could be that someone picked up one of the many dozens of posts on this site from years past and just ran with it.

    I'll believe it when I hear the words drip from Morris' snarling, sneering, frowning lips.

  • slimboyfat

    I can totally see this being a thing. Partakers are what, over 20,000 now? They have to do something to explain it. Calling new partakers crazy isn’t a long term solution, is it?

    It’s a bit embarrassing to admit a major and distinctive JW teaching has been wrong all this time. At the same time they abandoned the traditional JW teaching on the faithful slave, apparently without much sense of embarrassment. And despite the fact it makes nonsense of much of their own history and how the organisation developed.

    The GB apparently don’t embarrass easily. And they are not unduly concerned about what ordinary JWs think. So why not make this change?

  • The Fall Guy
    The Fall Guy

    Thank goodness for the spirit-inspired or non-inspired 'slave.' (it changes with each side of their mouths)

    How would we ever know how to understand this verse without them?

    (Revelation 14:1) Then I saw, and look! the Lamb (figurative!) standing on Mount Zion, (figurative!) and with him 144,000 (literal!) who have his name and the name of his Father written on their foreheads. (figurative!)

    3 out of 4 are figurative. Thank you so much G.B. for revealing the "truth" about this verse.

  • snugglebunny
    And I saw, and, look! the Lamb standing upon the Mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand having his name and the name of his Father written on their foreheads. ...These are the ones that did not defile themselves with women; in fact, they are virgins. These are the ones that keep following the Lamb no matter where he goes. These were bought from among mankind as first fruits to God and to the Lamb, and no falsehood was found in their mouths; they are without blemish."

    So why don't they just say that the comment regarding 'virgins' is to be taken literally after all. There's been so few of those around, they could delay things for hundreds of years if they felt inclined.

  • blondie

    Years ago, if you had told me that:

    Only the GB were the faithful and discreet slave

    That there are overlapping generations

    I would have thought that impossible. But then I found out from studying WTS history, that this is not the first time that they pulled something out of their rear to promote some personal doctrine or adjust one.

    And I have seen it done many times in my lifetime

    Great tribulation started in 1914 and took a hiatus in 1918 to begin again in the near future, the period between being a judgment period where people are judged and descend into Gehenna when they die even if it is before Armageddon starts.

    1970- that was adjusted. Here commented in 2013, but the date 1970 left out.

    3. In the past, what was our understanding of the timing of the great tribulation?

    3 For a number of years, we thought that the great tribulation began in 1914 with World War I and that “those days were cut short” by Jehovah in 1918 when the war ended so that the remnant would have the opportunity to preach the good news to all nations. (Matt. 24:21, 22) After the completion of that preaching work, Satan’s empire would be destroyed. Thus, the great tribulation was thought to have three phases: There would be a beginning (1914-1918), the tribulation would be interrupted (from 1918 onward), and it would conclude at Armageddon.

    4. What insight led to a clearer understanding of Jesus’ prophecy about the last days?

    4 Upon further examination of Jesus’ prophecy, however, we perceived that a part of Jesus’ prophecy about the last days has two fulfillments. (Matt. 24:4-22) There was an initial fulfillment in Judea in the first century C.E., and there would be a worldwide fulfillment in our day. That insight led to several clarifications.*

    5. (a) What difficult period began in 1914? (b) That period of distress corresponds to what time period in the first century C.E.?

    5 We also discerned that the first part of the great tribulation did not begin in 1914. Why not? Because Bible prophecy reveals that the great tribulation will start, not with a war among nations, but with an attack on false religion. Thus, the events that began in 1914were, not the beginning of the great tribulation, but the “beginning of pangs of distress.” (Matt. 24:8) These “pangs of distress” correspond to what took place in Jerusalem and Judea from 33 C.E. to 66 C.E.

    See paragraphs 9 and 10 also

  • stan livedeath
    stan livedeath

    remind me how long a creative day is now ? when i was in it was 7000 years. ( one of the reasons i stopped believing )

  • keinlezard


    It sound strang to me .. because the 144 000 myth is like 607 myth or 1914 , it's a foundation of Jehovism ...

    If GB change the "litteral" meaning to a "imaged" meaning ... they are cutting the branch where they are sitted.

    How will they can say "we are the anointed GB" ??" since they are part of 144 000 ?

    In such a same way if the meaning of 144 000 change, in some way it's the 1914 significance could change ...

    because 1914 is the moment When Christ invisibly come back and begun to gather the anointed ... if they are not ... what could jesus gather ?

    and finally ... if nothing more than the return of jesus lie on 1914 ... it's an open door to à 607 change since there is less and less reason for 1914 ....

    But maybe I'm wrong :)

    Best regards

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