Will YOU Ever Leave The Watchtower Org.?

by minimus 41 Replies latest jw friends

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  _Morpheus

  How cute that you refer to my reasoned and articulate response as indicative of “anger issues”. Your response shows your trade mark drive by topic starting, a mere throwing of a topical hand grenade and then driving away without a thought as to what you said or why.

  perhaps you could actually adress what i said instead of trying to deflect... a tall task i admit but worthy discussion does require some effort.

  Your parting shot in your previous post is laughably stupid and so stupidly binary as to be unworth addressing, however i suspect im obligated to respond after my previous defense of elders who havnt stepped down quickly enough for your liking..

  your statment

  “If you want to remain an elder or whatever, it's your decision because you have to live with yourself when you have to tell someone they cannot have a blood transfusion knowing full well that it's all a lie. Sleep well!”

  not that you actually asked but i am not an elder. I got out of that and havnt been to a cult meeting in almost two years, thank the Thunderer.

  As to your foolish attempt to shame (?) or make a point... so being an elder who has figured out the truth about the truth automatically means i would have had to have supported the orga blood policy...? Are you that simple minded? I would have and did tell people to use good judgment and accept every option offered to save their live. Thankfully i never knew anyone who needed blood but i absolutely was prepared to tell them one on one to take the goddamn blood and then either deny it or ask for forgiveness.

  Your ‘example’ is narrow minded and indicitive of typical witness like thinking, either A or B and no other options.

  Live your live as you see fit and i promise not to say a word or care in the least. Dont tear down others struggles.
• 

  minimus

  So it's pretty simple you can make your own rules and do whatever you want. If somebody is supposed to take a blood transfusion and you're their elder you can just say don't worry about it it's a personal decision I won't say anything. Sure that's how it really works LOL who's the buffoon? I was being nice when I said anger issues about you. Who has to use profanity throughout their conversation to make their point ?? maybe somebody angry? Regarding other peoples struggles, I certainly understand them as I experience of them myself as I noted. And of course everyone is different. However if you are in a position of responsibility you cannot have it both ways for ever . As Ray Franz called it it was a crisis of conscience. Eventually if you were not playing both sides to the middle you will find that it is a crisis of conscience. Of course some people do not have much of a conscience to begin with so what is the Big deal? If it truly doesn't bother you enough to leave a position of leadership then so be it. That is for that person to deal with. And if they are called out on it that's just too bad.
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  minimus

  Jwd,,, I agree with what you say about the responsibility that elders have. They have sometimes unknowingly helped people to remain in the organization because they knew know better. However with knowledge comes responsibility. When they get to the point where they know without a doubt that what they're teaching is wrong they should not continue to teach innocent sheep falsehoods that ultimately will wreck their lives.
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  _Morpheus

  Clearly you are indeed a buffoon if you cant comprehend how that works. Is there some microchip in elders heads thats causes them to explode if they speak something contrary to wt doctrine? Again, why does it have to be some binary A or B situation? I absolutely spoke against stupid org rules all the time.

  And on ray franz, funny that his crisis of conscience coincided with being thrown off the GB and eventually DF’d. For decades prior to that, when by his own admision he smelled something funny, he continued to serve in various capacities. Im not chastising him, simply pointing out that one dosent one day realize TTATT and immediately walk away. Its a process.

  When is the line, on wise one? When does it become too long, in your ever so wise and estimable view, for one to serve adter realizing TTATT? A day? An hour? Should one peruse this web site for 45 min, have questions and then call the local BOE and tender their resignation?

  How long did it take you?
• 

  minimus

  I mentioned it took me years.Regarding comprehending how it works, I think after so many years as an elder with various elder bodies, I'm no loud screeching inexperienced elder. I've been around the block . You are giving false hope to people who know they should leave their positions of authority. You are entitled to an opinion as I am. Screaming insults will not get you much with me, son.
• 

  minimus

  And just to clarify, I understand it can take time to make that decision for various reasons . But if you stay forever just to be the kind elder it's really fruitless. You're not helping the sheeple
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  _Morpheus

  “Son”? 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 oh dear lord. We have officially jumped the shark. You have said nothing and made no arguments not even bothered to counter one single thing i have said. I leave you to your self righteous pontificating. Arguing with a fool and all that....
• 

  NJ501

  I'm in the process of fading but I go along for my families sake. I've been threatened to be kicked out of the house and can't survive on my own just yet. My parents also threaten to kick me out of the inheritance will and give it all too the organisation. So, I feel I should stay around for that as well, because I would hate to see it go to the org.

  I also love my parents and don't want to see them hurt as well.
• 

  minimus

  Morpheus I cannot be any clearer. And I wasn't arguing with you or anyone else. I explained my comments and if you or anyone else has an issue you can discuss it or argue it amongst yourselves. NJ I wish you the very best and know what it's like to be caught between a rock and a hard place.
• 

  jwundubbed

  They have sometimes unknowingly helped people to remain in the organization because they knew know better.

  I just have to say this.... they knew NO better. I don't have any idea why you would knowingly mispell that word. It doesn't help you make your point.

  However with knowledge comes responsibility.

  And what is it that gives you the right to dictate how exactly others should use their knowledge responsibly? You are telling us that you are better than them because you eventually left. How exactly is that better than staying and trying to effect some change?

  That is like telling all the Americans who don't like that Trump became president to jump ship and go live in a country they like better. If you want things to change, you don't run away... you fight for that change. And how you fight can work in a bunch of different ways. You can educate people. You can support people. You can show them there are other ways. You can leak documents that prove the bad guys are at fault.

  I'm sorry, but I'm not buying the idea that the only people who make the right choices are they ones who made the same choice that you made.

  Actually, that sounds like you have a lot of guilt you are living with and you want others to validate your idea that you did the right thing. You did the right thing for you. Don't tell other people what their right thing to do is. Let them make that choice for themselves. And they you all live with your choices. And you deal with your feelings about it... on your own time. Not by insulting people who made different choices than the ones you made.

  And for the love of God and everyone else in the world, please stop propogating the idea that there is ANY SINGLE RIGHT WAY OF DOING ANYTHING. No one can live up to that completely unrealistic standard. And it isn't true. It IS a JWism. Why does there have to be only one right way? Sounds to me like you have some internal issues to work on.

  When they get to the point where they know without a doubt that what they're teaching is wrong they should not continue to teach innocent sheep falsehoods that ultimately will wreck their lives.

  But it doesn't wreck everyone's lives. If it did, the sheeple would all flee. Have you ever been around or seen sheep? When there is danger, they run away. So, if every single one of the JWs was going to have their lives wrecked, they would run away from it. They aren't fleeing because some of them are happy right where they are. Their lives aren't ruined nor wrecked. So... if you are in a position of authority over people, you are teaching them something that you think is wrong, but only some are wrecked by it... then how do you know what is the right step to take?

  It isn't simple. It isn't black and white. And it is really gross on your part to act like you are better than the others because you eventually made a choice you can live with. Take it down a notch. Because I get the feeling that you are being so vocal about it because you had choices that you feel guilty about. Man up and stop putting your inadequacies onto other people. They have enough to deal with on their own.

  There is no ONE SINGLE CHOICE, any more than there is ONLY ONE TRUE GOD. Dude! No one outside of the JWs wants to be treated that way, so stop treating people that way. It only makes you look bad.