How well do you REALLY know the Organisation?
You are very correct . Today's average JW is very illiterate when it comes to JW teaching. When I look around at the kingdom hall, most seem brain dead. When they comment they just parrot what is written. Even when it comes to basic watchtower doctrine, they just don't get it.
Here is an example of policies the dubs don't understand. This is a quote from a newspaper article from an earlier thread dealing with a dub in the media for spousal abuse:
The soft-spoken woman said she also was prevented from leaving the marriage by her faith as a Jehovah's Witness, a religion she said frowns on divorce unless one of the parties cheats on the other.
This made it sound as if this dub thought she couldn't leave her mate when the society says she can. It teaches there are 3 grounds for seperation and her husband commited one of them. She may well have not known this policy. Many die because they do not know that certain blood medical proceedures are NOW allowable by the Organisation.
BTW...my point was,,,many HERE in making comments make it appear that they are cluless on many Organisational teachings.
Theology is not something the avarage JW is interested in. They just parrot the paragraph, hence: "the paragraph says", "the society says" etc. Ask a JW to prove any doctrine, and they are at a loss. They are just intellectual zombies letting it all wash over them. They put their mind in 'sleep mode', a nice and cozy coma from which they never wake up.
many seem unfamiliar with dub teachings.
I think this is very true. I'd take just one example: how many of the R&F are ignorant of the fact that the official WTS teaching is that Jesus is not their mediator, but this position is reserved for the "remnant" who "by extension" (in the WTS words) pass on to the GC the benefits of that mediatorship. Hence, the Dubs' second baptism question takes on a more significant aspect. Their loyalty is to the "organisation", not to Christ.
But how many of the R&F realise this? Not many, in my experience. Most will even deny that it is a WTS teaching, such is their ignorance.
One Watchtower will say something. A publication in the same year will say the opposite. the WT. will say you can vote. The CO says you can vote, but not here. There's more earthquakes. This proves we're in the last days. Another source says eartquakes prove nothing. How the hell is anybody supposed to know anything when the direction is so aimless?
Quite so. Yet ironically the Borg claims that they have been "discreet" in "feeding the domestics". Also that "the light is getting brighter"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Theology is not something the avarage JW is interested in. They just parrot the paragraph, hence: "the paragraph says", "the society says" etc. Ask a JW to prove any doctrine, and they are at a loss.
Very true, Greven. Their faith is based not so much on a relationship with God as a relationship with a printing corporation that espouses pseudo-christian teachings.
I read once that the MOST that are now associated with the organisation .....have been in for 10 years or less. If this is the case, it would account for the lack of understanding many have on the Organisation they left.
This can soon be deduced from the WTS' own figs. Look at the number leaving. Over a period of of a decade, it's reasonable to think that those now "in" have little personal memory of the debacles, such as 1975 or even the "generation" thing.
The Borg would appear to be losing some of its most gifted, as Francois has already noted. The oft-quoted expression "Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins" seems to be applying more to the Borg now, eh?
This is an excellent topic. I have been out for nearly 9 years now, so the "Generation" change happened after I left.
It seems like the JWism of the 21st century is "JW Lite", doctrinally speaking, compared to the 60s and 70s. Many of the teachings back then, such as the 7000 year long creative day idea, have never been officially withdrawn, they just don't talk about it any more. (Where did they come up with that one, anyway?) As a result, older JWs still believe it, and newer JWs have never heard of it.
It seems that conformity is far more important than comprehension. A JW that converted in the last ten years is likely to be vehement that the JWs are the only true religion, and the GB is always right, whilst having only a sketchy grasp of the real teachings and history, eg. who Russell and Rutherford were.
Much of the aimlessness, confusion, and lack of doctrinal clarity among JWs in the last 15 years or so could probably be explained by the death of Fred Franz. Fred Franz was the man responsible for almost everything JWs have believed since the 1930's. F. Franz was Rutherford's right hand man and continued as the Watch Tower Society's main "scholar/prophet" after Rutherford's death and into the early 1990's when old age and finally death cut off the flow of his powerful influence. Since his death no one left in power has been able to match his creative biblical "mental gymnastics" nor speak with his same authority, an authority/confidence born of F. Franz's conviction that the mantel of Christ's authority over the Organization was passed directly from Russel to Rutherford to F. Franz and Knorr. The witch hunts of the early 1980's wiped out any creative/intelligent Watch Tower staffers who could have filled the void left by F. Franz's death. Ray Franz and other "liberals" on the writing staff such as Ed Dunlap and Lyman Swingle could have made a much smoother transition and kept the Society vibrant after F. Fran's death. I belief that Fred Franz himself was so convinced that Armageddon would arrive before his death that he allowed/encouraged the shake up leaving him as the sole "intellectual" force & unquestioned authority at the center of the Society's power. The Watch Tower Society is now feeling the effects of this purge in its meandering repeats of F. Fran's "old light".
Excellent input Ozzie
Felinegirl said,....It seems like the JWism of the 21st century is "JW Lite", and.....It seems that conformity is far more important than comprehension
Good points.....now were back on track
When I first thought about this topic it bugged me how little newer ones seem to know of the borg.......then I realized it didn't seem to mater as far as ones leaving. You would think us older ones who saw all the shifting and doctrinal changes through the years.......would be more prone to leave than the modern day dub...........not so it seems.
It seems many are exiting now without all the knowledge we have. The borg is destroying itself.
Since his death(franz) no one left in power has been able to match his creative biblical "mental gymnastics" nor speak with his same authority, an authority/confidence born of F. Franz's conviction that the mantel of Christ's authority over the Organization was passed directly from Russel to Rutherford to F. Franz and Knorr.
This is a major point of importance........however the society simply rehashes what they have already written and the same info. simply comes out with different wording. The winds of change are happening and freedie isn't here to deal with it. When large gathering were beggining to be a problem......freddie handled it. He said invite only those you know to be good association............now when these "types" of things come up..........freddies not there because.....freddies dead .
As you said Liberty......no one wears the mantle now except Teddy and he's busy scrubbing out his poop stains from his panties
I don't think the average modern day dub is as sharp as to all the teachings accociated with the Organisation as the earlier generations.
Herein lies the whole crux of the matter and why the Borg is still dangerous. Why? Because the GB will continue to shift its teachings with "new light" and the newer rank and file will go along with it. Don't EVER believe the WTS is dead - that's a dangerous assumption - it is merely gearing up to mind-control its latest victims. NEVER be complacent. As has been mentioned many times, the average JW today knows absolutely nothing of the WTS' history. This innocence on the part of the newbie JW is taken advantage of with the likes of "Beware of the apostates", "Continue in the way in which you are going and you'll soon be an elder", "The last days of this wicked system are fast approaching (this one never changes)".
Believe me, if we continue to sit back on our proverbial bottoms and do absolutely nothing then, in 20 years from now, many of us still won't be united with our familes, this forum may or may not be in existence (don't hold your breath) and the WTS will continue to amass millions of $.
Believe me, if we continue to sit back on our proverbial bottoms and do absolutely nothing then, in 20 years from now, many of us still won't be united with our familes, this forum may or may not be in existence
I really doubt that will happen. Too many eager ones eager to see them go down and it's had some major effects.