Where To Start.....

by Lin 38 Replies latest jw experiences

• 

  Lin

  Wow!!! I'm stunned that so many have written back to me! Thank you everyone for your comments, I appreciate them more than I can say. I really don't see myself as a *religious* person anymore, the word makes me ill. I do, though, have a spiritual side to me, which I feel good about. Part of me wishes I could read and write in the original languages of the Bible, so I could know absolutely.....what is true and what isn't. But, that isn't the case, so I just deal with it best I can. I want very much to find a Bible that is as close to the original translated version as possible, but I haven't had the nerve to go back to the book store because as I said before, all those books make me feel dizzy! The only church I ever really felt comfortable in was a non-denominational church. I quit going because I suddenly began to feel pressure to *do more* within the church. That brought back horrible memories of pressure of more field service hours, more book placements, more more more...Plus I had been asked to conduct a Sunday School class for children AND be a lead singer in the choir. Complimentary, yes...but I couldn't get out of the church fast enough. I literally ran from the front door to my car clear across the parking lot! I was like, NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! I plan on going there this Sunday for a visit with my fiance, who has never been there. It isn't close by at all, but it's the only one I felt happy to walk in at one time, before all the pressure started. I really can't say that pressure was intended, that would be unfair to say. But, that is how I took it and I couldn't deal with it at the time. I would like to maybe begin going back to that church more often, just to feel a kinship of some sort with everyone there. This church teaches the trinity, but I managed to ignore that then. What really gets me is the whole concept of *being saved*. JW's teach it's more about works, doing and doing and doing. So, this is totally new for me. I wish I could simply erase........everything I was taught and start over fresh. It keeps popping into my head every now and then, and I get so mad about it sometimes, I want it all to just go away.

  Thank you everyone for your kind words and encouragement and the wonderful welcome. I am definitely a seeker, and I will continue to be a part of this site. Annie and Angie, thank you....I will see you both at WA.

  Lin
• 

  DakotaRed

  Hello and welcome, Lin. I wasn't raised a JW but became one in my 40s. I DA'd 2 years ago. Some of their beliefs I have no problem with. Some, are just ridiculous. But before becoming a JW, I visited many different religions. I am now at the point that I believe there is no true religion. In fact, I have lost all use for religion.

  Although I am left with many questions that need answers, I still believe in God. Sometimes I wonder if it is true, but ultimately, I still believe in God. But, to me, Jesus said a mouthful at John 13:34, 35 and Luke 10:27. All the rest, trinity, cross/stake, hellfire and such just cloud the issue and confuse and divide, as far as I am concerned.

  RSV John 13:34-35
  34 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.
  35 By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another."

  RSV Luke 10:27 And he answered, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your strength, and with all your mind; and your neighbor as yourself."

  These are what constitutes a true disciple of Christ, not winning a theological debate.

  Just my 2 cents

  Lew W
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  Prisca

  Hello Lin,

  Everyone who has replied here has given you some great advice, so all I can add is to say, RELAX and don't think you have to rush into knowing all the answers. Remember how as JWs we had to have an answer for everything? Well, now you have the situation where you can take your time, and work out what you believe, and what you don't.

  Welcome to the board, and I wish you all the best on your spiritual journey!
• 

  MegaDude

  Lin,

  You'll find a lot of people with a lot of opinions, pro and con.

  I agree with Six of Nine that anyone who begins speaking with bombastic authority on the topic of God should set off your bullshit detector.

  I also think connecting with God should be simple. Really, it should. Did the people in the Bible study manuals and work books and endless publications? They didn't go to myriads of meetings. (Hey, that could be a song! But I digress!) They didn't even have a Bible, for a crying out loud.

  I am still finding my way and I wish I had concrete answers to give you, but I don't have any. There is much about the Bible I like. I am moved very much by the wisdom of Jesus and the things he said. I also want to believe in a God that cares about me and has my future secured. Who wouldn't? How sure am I about that? I'm still working on it.

  I would follow a simple method. I would simply pray for that relationship and connection with God, and see where that takes you. If there is an Almighty God who loves you, I'm sure he'll answer the prayers of such a sincere-hearted individual. Your answer may come in interacting with people here, a book you read, or maybe you will end up on a path of belief or non-belief you never even considered before. Either way, it's YOUR journey. It's your path. Best wishes on your travels.

  Edited by - megadude on 12 August 2002 23:35:48
• 

  blueroom

  Welcome. I have recently found this place as well.

  I've been gone for five years. I'm an atheist now. When people ask me about how I live my life without God I say I live by 'human' rules.

  Don't kill, because no one has the right to kill you and vise versa. Don't steal. Because no one has the right to steal from you and you from them. Amazing how this follows suit with so many other sins.

  Also, I found this about two years ago and I like and live by most of it. It helps me alot. When I read, I feel like life is not as complicated as I make it seem.

  I N S T R U C T I O N S F O R L I F E - LIFE by the DALAI LAMA

  1. Take into account that great love and great achievements involve great risk.
  2. When you lose, don't lose the lesson.
  3. Follow the three Rs:

  Respect for self

  Respect for others and

  Responsibility for all your actions.

  1. Remember that not getting what you want is sometimes a wonderful stroke of luck.
  2. Learn the rules so you know how to break them properly.
  3. Don't let a little dispute injure a great friendship.
  4. When you realize you've made a mistake, take immediate steps to correct it.
  5. Spend some time alone every day.
  6. Open your arms to change, but don't let go of your values.
  7. Remember that silence is sometimes the best answer.
  8. Live a good, honorable life. Then when you get older and think back, you'll be able to enjoy it a second time.
  9. A loving atmosphere in your home is the foundation for your life.
  10. In disagreements with loved ones, deal only with the current situation. Don't bring up the past.
  11. Share your knowledge. It's a way to achieve immortality.
  12. Be gentle with the earth.
  13. Once a year, go someplace you've never been before.
  14. Remember that the best relationship is one in which your love for each other exceeds your need for each other.
  15. Judge your success by what you had to give up in order to get it.
  16. Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon.
• 

  Big Tex

  Howdy Lin! This is Chris. I'm glad you found this board. These are good people here and I've found it very healing. I understand how you feel, I've been through it myself. If you don't mind, I've copied something below a friend told me and that helped me find a place to start. It's a bit long, so if you can't read it all I understand. But it touched me and got me thinking. I hope it helps you:

  Human beings, by nature, are empirical. They tend to try and put everything into a perspective that they can relate to on human terms by observation. Mix in a little dogma, and you have religion.
  
  It is no easy feat to humanize God. More so, I would say it is impossible. God is unfathomable yet, God is everywhere around us. To be honest, I use the name God for lack of a better name.
  
  I have long been a firm believer that the Bible is used more as a yoke, or ball and chain to ensnare others to a persons will. Don't get me wrong. It has useful words to live by, it promotes peace, wellbeing with oneself and God, charity, compassion, love...everything that should be a part of life. But it should never be used to browbeat someone to submission.
  
  When I was in college, I felt that I needed a spiritual space in my life, as my parents were secular humanists and never really imparted that aspect of life to me (that and a brush with death didn't hurt either). I studied philosophy, theology (100's of belief systems), history, the Bible, the Koran, the Torah Scrolls, the writings of the Essenes, the Tao Te Ching, Shaolin philosophy, Hinduism, Buddhism, you name it. I read it.
  
  There was one mainstay in all of these writings. One thing that smacked of similarity. That was this...to find God, one needs only to turn inward. Listen, Feel, Hear. God is there. Always speaking to you, sometimes screaming to be heard.
  
  There should never be fear, pain, feelings of loss and confusion when one is speaking of God. No other human being, or humanized philosophy can ever tell you the true nature of God, except God. Everyone is in the same boat, and not one person has the map to navigate to Him. Everyone is rowing furiously, but without the answers it seems they are travelling in circles.
  
  Organized religion brings comfort to many because it offers them a path and structure, but in my opinion...and it is only my opinion...that it isn't the path you take, it's getting to the destination that counts. Honestly, do you think God cares if you're Baptist or Pagan? Christian or Jew? Does that sound at all like a problem an entity who has an entire universe to sustain is really concerned about?
  
  If the Bible helps bring you closer to God for you, by all means. Use it. But use it in conjunction of turning inward. Quiet your mind, and listen.
  
  Perhaps this sounds incredibly arrogant. But it's only God who can give you the answers that you're looking for, and perhaps in all this rowing, and splashing in our boat we are not hearing God through all the noise. Perhaps there will never be one true answer...only God knows, as the saying goes.
  
  I truly do believe that we are all the sons and daughters of God. We are His creation. I believe that His love is unquestioning, irreversible, and without doubt...eternal.
  
  I do hope that you can learn to listen to what your heart believes is true. The pain goes away when the smoke clears, and a glimmer of clarity is revealed.
  
  Moreover, I hope that you soon realize that God is not unapproachable. He is not so distant that He can't be reached.
  
  God bless you, love...and I hope this brings you some measure of peace.
• 

  Lin

  Hi all...thanks for the additional comments. Thanks Chris for that information. It's true, I need to calm myself and take things one day at a time and let the smoke clear, or what I refer to as Mucky-muck. I haven't prayed in so many years. It seemed so incredibly strange to me years ago when I did pray, that the *answers* I got where not what I expected. Like, I was married for 15 yrs to a witness who was physically abusive to me. All during those horrible years, I prayed and cried, cried and prayed, over and over and over to God to help me know what to do. I prayed that He show me what was right in his eyes to do, stay or leave, etc. I remember sitting in a closet crying hysterically, praying through my sobs, God...I can't take this anymore, what do I do? My next thought was Get a divorce. Well, that thought only made me feel more and more confused since JW's teach it isn't alright to get a divorce unless there is adultery. So, I suffered emotionally for so many years, praying throughout all those years, and thinking that my *answers* were probably coming from Satan instead of God. What a way to live, huh? It got to the point in my marriage where I realized that either I would hurt myself and die, or my husband would kill me. I decided then that I would get a divorce, and if God hated me for it based on JW teachings, then I'll answer to Him when the time comes. I got my divorce and moved to Texas with my kids. Wow, the freedom I felt when I walked out of that courtroom was incredible. I didn't feel hated by God, but was confused for a long time about how He would feel about me ever remarrying or so much as dating. But, I've moved on from that, and am now engaged to a wonderful, kind and loving man. Maybe I'll never have all the answers, but I can be satisfied that I am a spiritual type person who does believe in God and Jesus, and if/and/when God wants me to know the answers it will happen. Until then, I will get myself a great big study type Bible with lots of various cross references and just read it. Thank you all!!!!!

  Lin
• 

  Joyzabel

  Welcome Lin to this discussion board!

  I like discussions like this. I love to hear what other people have searched and learned since leaving the wtbts and its high-control group thought.

  Thank you Big Tx for sharing your thoughts. I can tell it was a long road for you to get to the conclusions you now have. Thanks for giving us a short synopsis of it.

  I don't think that blueroom is that different in expressing the "human rules of life". I love your humor.

  The only thing I would ask of anyone who has such wonderful comments is to please include any source(s) that you have read in developing your thoughts. It seems I can't get enough suggestions on reading material. (Please be specific. I know I need to enjoy my own journey now, but I don't think there is anything wrong with sharing interesting books to read )

  Hugs,

  j2bf
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  Sentinel

  Oh, my, I've certainly been there. I didn't get involved with any other religions, going to other churches,etc., as I was still feeling that JW's were possibly right, and I was just this mishappen person who couldn't live by the rules. I lived with so much guilt! It was killing me. For me, even visiting another church with someone was very frightening experience. I felt so out of place, so guilty. Gradually, I began to figure things out. It certainly didn't happen overnight.

  My suggestion to you would be to simply "STOP". Start keeping a daily journal about how you feel. See if you have some sound base principles that you want to live your life by. Don't be concerned with religion. Read your bible, if you like, but read it like a history book. It took me years to be able to do this, as the JW beliefs permiated my every thought as I read. They wouldn't let me rest. Finally, I was able to overcome that burden, and move on.

  I don't have a religious belief. I don't go to church. I do feel spiritually enlightened and in tune with the universe. That is not a contradiction. It took me a very long time to get to this place. It has to do with "letting go", and starting all over. It's an individual journey and you have to do it yourself.

  I am an avid reader. I began to get myself straight by reading many self empowering books. I had to retrain my emotional "reactors". I made a decision to "change me" from the inside out, and now it feels great. No great emotional baggage on my shoulder. I'm free and happier than I've ever been, and it's deep inside me, even on the worst of days.

  Take care of yourself. Read the many posts here and you will get the help and encouragement you are looking for. This Forum is a very good place to share thoughts.

  Love and Light,

  Sentinel
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  Lin

  Thank you Sentinel, I really appreciate all the comments. When I had ordered Ray Franz 3rd Edition from Randy Watters site, he included in the shipment two pamphlets that I had not until now even opened. They are dealing with the question of whether the translators & publishers of the New World Translation Bible changed the Greek Scriptures to make it look like Jehovah was the one meant by the word LORD. I haven't finished them yet, but I will soon. I feel so strongly that I just MUST know if God is a Trinity or not. I mean, in my opinion, virtually all religious beliefs are based on that fundamental and basic teaching. I have no desire to consider myself a certain denomination ever again. But I feel like that old saying, Can't see the forest for the trees. I just have to have something to believe in, because right now I don't believe in anything but there is a God out there somewhere. That's all I've got, and it's not enough. Maybe it should be so simple, so why am I so torn apart? All those years of being a JW, I felt pretty good about myself, thinking I knew soooo much about the Bible, etc. But now I question the authenticity of the Bible I had all those years. This really sucks.