ladies/gentlemen..Give me your take on this

by Monster 25 Replies latest jw friends

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  Monster

  Ladies I know I shouldn't really hit on this because I have no real understanding of what you go through when you are raped. I just want to try and understand some of what is going on.

  Let me ask this Q. Do you believe that the elders do not want to report the rapes or they are told they cannot report the rapes from the GB?

  I know of two of my Army buddies who were accused of raping some females in Saudi, I believe the ladies because no woman in her right mind would tell she was raped in the military unless she wanted to suffer entrenal shame.These guys got off , the ladies were made to look like whores.

  Religion rape has to be a whole new twist, after all you are being taught Jehovah wants to you remain clean until marriage, but some ass hole comes along and takes that from you, I can't imagine what suffering you are going through in the mind.

  I believe the elders not reporting it has everything to do with the GB. Get this: I still have that little green book about family life, I notice they want us to believe that women are weak (which is one of the reasons they take so many freedoms from women) the book also says that women act more on emotion and us strong men use our heads. I don't believe that for a minute but it could explain why the Elders are so quick to doubt a womans story. You know what's going through their minds right? oh boy another lady over reacting to a man making a pass at her. She did something to lead him on. I know that's how they think because I heard it so many times. I have seven other brothers if my sister was ever raped by anyone , god help him.

  Ladies what's your take on all of this? What do you think is going on behind closed doors? Do you ever think you could run to a man for help if this ever happened again.? If you never trusted us again I would never fault you. How could I ?

  Gentlemen

  Have you ever dated a woman who was raped?

  did you help her to get past the pain or was it to much to deal with?

  Did you feel you would always have to prove to her she was safe with you?

  Have an of you former elders ever had a sister come in and say she was raped? if yes what did you do to help her?

  Personally I don't know how to deal with rape. I see women who suffer it and just don't know what to say to them. I wish I could hold them but I know they don't want any man touching them. I know they are blown over the thought after being raped they have to go before a male doctor to be checked out. I dated a girl once who was raped but I didn't know because she was such a great pretender. I did feel she was nervous everytime I spoke of her being alone with me, and whenever I grabbed her by the wrist she began shaking. One day I asked her why she was so nervous when I touched her, my boy comes out with "man she's been hit everyone knows that" I looked at her she had a look of sheer shame on her face she jumped out and ran out. I could have killed him for busting her out like that. My boy thought it was funny busting her out like that, I let him know I don't get off on shit like that. He almost ended our friendship. She wouldn't see me anymore that hurt but I understood her. I guess I am not one to be there for women when they are hurt like this.

  So guys give me your take , maybe I can learn what I do wrong. I would like to do something to all rapist but I will get in trouble for just saying it in a public place like this.

  Peace James.
• 

  LB

  Have you ever dated a woman who was raped?

  Yes I did, many years ago, we dated for a couple of months before she mentioned it. It was obvious that she had some very serious concerns/issues

  did you help her to get past the pain or was it to much to deal with?

  Well I was someone to talk to about it. The first male she had ever talked to about it. It wasn't too much to deal with, it was difficult to understand her feelings on the issue. I didn't really understand at that time that rape was more about control and little or nothing about sex.

  Did you feel you would always have to prove to her she was safe with you?

  She was pretty darn safe with me. I didn't lay a hand on her for a long time as it was obvious that being close to anyone was difficult for her. In fact on our second date she informed me that if I was expecting sex, then I was barking up the wrong tree. If I wanted a friend then she was available for that. This was a first for me to be honest. The relationship took a long time before it became sexual. Then it only lasted a brief time. She was one of the very few girlfriends that didn't hate my guts afterwards???? We stayed friends until she moved away a couple of years after the relationship.

  Honestely I can't imagine any sister going to an elder for help. Most have way more sense than that. These men aren't trained in anything that would be helpful for them.
• 

  Mimilly

  Monster - interesting nick, and welcome to the board.

  I have been raped, more than I care to say, but before the borg, during the borg and after the borg. The next one that tries it - dies, plain and simple by my own bare hands. So much for weak.

  During the borg - yeh I was dumb enough to go to the elders. Elder one said that I bewitched men and shouldn't be near them. Yep. He said that. Elder two said I must have wanted it because I didn't scream. (how does one scream while enduring a flashback of one's childhood? - He couldn't answer that one) The 'offending' brother got off on the flashback.

  To answer your question on the elders responses - it's simple. It has nothing to do with what is written in the literature and everything to do with picking on an already vunerable person. It's power. They want the goodies - the details, and as many details as possible. They're perverts. They re-rape. They re-punch. They re-choke. THEY are abusers by their very words and actions and/or inactions.

  I've worked a great deal of this shit out, and do not smear every man with the same brush. There are triggers everywhere and I know how to react now. (was self-distructive back then) People don't need to cringe around me. I understand why a rape victim would respond that way though.

  While I am haunted by my past, I will wade thru emotional wet concrete until the day I die before I let those bastards be the ruin of me. I love men - honestly. And I doubt I will ever be in that situation again, where I will have to tear flesh from his bones, because I have changed so much and am a hell of a lot stronger and confident than ever before. I simply won't attract the predators. I'll scare them.

  Lotsa love and appreciation to all the men who give a damn, and also love to those who've been there.

  Mimilly/Salem

  ps: Monster - for info on how to help or know how to act around an abuse victim, check out The Courage to Heal book at your local library.

  Edited by - Mimilly on 5 August 2002 23:41:38
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  AjaxMan

  ((((((((((Mimilly)))))))))))

  I am sorry to hear your story about the ordeals you went through and thanks for sharing your experiences and having the courage to say it. Honestly, I do admire you and respect you a lot more for being forthright about this issue.

  Regards and love,

  Ajax
• 

  Monster

  it was difficult to understand her feelings on the issue. I didn't really understand at that time that rape was more about control and little or nothing about sex. LB

  That's what I hear from the experts. I don't get why they need to control someone who's begging them to stop. It's sick.

  She was pretty darn safe with me. I didn't lay a hand on her for a long time as it was obvious that being close to anyone was difficult for her. In fact on our second date she informed me that if I was expecting sex, then I was barking up the wrong tree. If I wanted a friend then she was available for that. This was a first for me to be honest. The relationship took a long time before it became sexual. Then it only lasted a brief time. She was one of the very few girlfriends that didn't hate my guts afterwards????

  You are a strong man LB, women need these kinds of men. I would never hurt a woman but it's important to me that they know that. I just don't know how to talk with them on the subject.

  Mimilly

  Monster - interesting nick, and welcome to the board.

  Thanks, and Yeah the name fits because I did some things to my family that I now regrett.

  Elder one said that I bewitched men and shouldn't be near them. Yep. He said that. Elder two said I must have wanted it because I didn't scream. (how does one scream while enduring a flashback of one's childhood? - He couldn't answer that one) The 'offending' brother got off on the flashback.

  Because you didn't scream? How does he know was he there? and besides what does not screaming have to do with it? Women don't scream because they are afriad for their lives. Now that's something even I know.

  They want the goodies - the details, and as many details as possible. They're perverts. They re-rape. They re-punch. They re-choke. THEY are abusers by their very words and actions and/or inactions.

  Now with these men doing this to you it doesn't make a woman want to trust a man again or talk or trust them with private information. This is why I wouldn't fault a woman for not trusting us.

  There are triggers everywhere and I know how to react now

  Now that's tight, let me ask this: When the triggers go off what happens to you inside? Do you have to leave for a while , start crying what? let me say this, the girl I dated had those triggers go off everytime I grabbed her by the wrist. But I didn't know that what was going on inside her. I found out later she was held by her wrist by other men while others took turns on her. And like you everyone tried to make her feel it was her doing. She suduced the helpless men. Those sick bastards!

  Mimilly don't answer those questions if they hurt or to personal.

  I simply won't attract the predators.

  Don't ever feel like you attrack predators. They are men who are no damn good looking for someone to hurt. I hung around men in the Army that was looking for females like it was some kind of sport as if ladies were animals to hunt down and capture. A few of my boys followed women to their homes to find out if they had a man. I know it sounds wild but it's so true. They would drive by their homes watching them. These ladies never knew they were being watched like that.

  Mimilly thanks for taking time to let me in on your feelings.

  peace James (((((((mimilly))))))))
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  Mimilly

  James - Please let me make it very clear that it is not only men who abuse. I was not only abused by men. My childhood is something straight from a nightmare due to my father being the sick jerk he was. (that is quite another story)

  As for triggers - you pretty much got it. There are some who cannot be approached from behind - they'll swing. Others, like you said, cannot be touched a certain way, or looked at a certain way. Others yet, during sex, will just freeze. It isn't easy being around someone with these particular issues, but it is worthwhile learning how to respond more productively because every man will come across a rape victim in his lifetime. The Courage to Heal book is a gift to both the abused and those who care about them. I truly suggest you read it.

  The JWs believe that if a woman does not scream while being raped - she is guilty of adultry/immorality. They also favor the men, which leaves the women locked in a judicial committee room with three perverts interrogating them.

  When I said I won't attract the predators - I meant it. I was raised to never, ever say 'no'. I didn't know how to. I had to learn to say no, and it took awhile, and pervs can spot a vunerable gal. It's like primal nature where the predator seeks out the weak or infirm prey - they're an easy meal. No, I did not deserve it, nor did I want any of it. I simply was raised to never say no, and that at the most basic level, it was what I was for - in the gospel of my father. (you can look some of my story up by doing a search on this site for My story; pieces of me.) I read yours after reading this thread and you gave me a great giggle

  I am very familiar with military life. My first husband was in the Canadian Military for nine years - RCDs (tanks) and we were stationed overseas as well as various parts here back home. Unfortunately the military seems to condone and insite that kind of behaviour.

  Email me if you want more details. I am now an open book, so ask what you like. However, this forum is not for certain details of my life.

  hugs,

  Salem
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  ugg

  MIMMILY,,,,,HUGS FOR YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
• 

  Monster

  Thanks Mimilly and I will respect that and only email if I have more of these questions. I thought this subject would be kind of touchy but I chanced it because I need to know what to do. I will explain why I need to know in private. Thanks. hugs
• 

  morrisamb

  Mimilly, so sorry you had to exerience so much abuse!!

  Even though I am very detached from my experiences there are things that are beyond my control: ie. flashbacks and the fact I HATE BEING TOUCHED FROM BEHIND. By anyone, including my partner. Unless you've been there, it's impossible to truly understand. I have learned not to expect people to understand, but I do appreciate it when they try.
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  Mimilly

  ((((((((((((((((((((((Morrisamb)))))))))))))))))))))))))))

  been there, understand hon.

  Mimilly/Salem