Wow!!! Would you look at this.I made my post this morning,and at 10:56pm in the Great White North this thread is 5 pages long....WBTS,can you imagine the uprising that will occur if you keep up your present course with Bill Bowen of "SILENT LAMBS" The death toll you hear is not for Bill.You have already screwed up twice on international TV.Once on DATELINE then again on PANORAMA.Can you afford to shoot yourselves in the foot again?You guys don`t seem to be that bright,so I`d imagine you`ll go for it.The moment you go after Bill Bowen of "SILENT LAMBS"there will be a public outcry from coast to coast and around the world.You think you have bad press now?It`s nothing compared to whats coming,should you make the the decision to cause Bill any grief ...OUTLAW
Watchtower Moves In For Kill On silentlambs
by silentlambs 141 Replies latest jw friends
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Simon
Whatever happens Bill, I hope you don't loose too much sleep over these idiots and come out of it happy.
Once thing I would suggest is that you don't take any recording device in with you as stipulated. Instead, wear a small bugging device (you can get them shaped like pen's and all sorts) and have someone outside recordnig the procedings.
If they ask you if you are recording this or have a recorder they you can say no. Besides, I wouldn't worry about lying if you have to as long as you have a record on tape.
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dungbeetle
Make that SIX pages long!!!!
Woooo-hoooo.
Good morning Mr. Angharad!!!
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Simon
You need to find a shop probably given the timescales but there are a lot of sites with details of things available:
http://www.topsecret.co.uk/acatalog/index.html
Some are very inexpensive but even so I'm sure people woudl be willing to chip in ... worth looking at as an option.
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jwsons
I agree with Simon. Bill should have something like this tiny camera (or audio spy transmitter). But it should have the strong distance field (like the one below, it should over 2Ghz so it can transmite around 100ft range)
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2040131770
Only a suggestion. For I believe this item somewhere in US. Or use
http://www.search-planet.net/search/search/Search
and type "audio spy"
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ozziepost
Very truly yours,
Oh yeah?
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Max Divergent
People are missing the real point. The US Court of Appeal said in Paul v WTS that courts would only uphold cases against churches First Amendment rights in the face of 'extreme and unusual cases' that threaten 'the peace, safety, or morality of the community'. They cite polygamy and snake handling as being in this category, so it seems not unreasonable to consider concealment and mishandling of Child Abuse as being in this category.
Given this is a hot social issue now, the courts may be interested to see how the WTS deals with its members who fail to conceal credible evidence of the mishandling of Child Abuse claims amongst the JWs. What they do is enforce defamatory sanctions that remove all credibility from the whistleblower within the community, which has the effect of preventing further or honest consideration of the matter.
The consequence of that action is the erosion of childrens safety and the morality of the public by the extreme efforts of the WTS silence persons who are otherwise of good-standing but who wish to have their evidence of heinous behaviour within the church examined but are frustrated from doing so by the actions of the JW/WTS.
So far as this layperson can see, the WTS has a perfect First Amendment right to deal with Bill as they see fit. Bill really has the choice of facing a JC alone, or being shunned without a hearing.
I'd think hes better off to be DF for speaking to the media than for disrespecting the Chair for this reason. This may be a trap he was DF for disrespecting our processes (by wearing a bug, say), not for speaking to the media about the rot he was sprouting....
The problem isnt a grown mans hurt feelings becuase the JW say they won't talk to him anymore and he can't tape what they say, but the effect of banning members from speaking about child abuse cover-ups. Thats of direct public interest and may, just may, override a religions First Amendment rights to deal with its divergent members according to its own rules.
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I'm no lawyer and dont mean to give advice only commentary, but this seems relevant:
*883 [7] We find the practice of shunning not to constitute a sufficient threat to the peace, safety, or morality of the community as to warrant state intervention. The test for upholding a direct burden on religious practices is as stringent as any imposed under our Constitution. Only in extreme and unusual cases has the imposition of a direct burden on religion been upheld. See, e.g., Reynolds v. United States, 98 U.S. (8 Otto) 145, 25 L.Ed. 244 (1878) (polygamy); Hill v. State, 38 Ala.App. 404, 88 So.2d 880 (1956) (snake handling).
I got this from http://jehovah.to/legal/general/paul.htm and can only presume its authentic. The reference is:
875 819 F.2d 875, 93 A.L.R.Fed. 737, 56 USLW 2007, Janice PAUL, a/k/a/ Janice Perez, Plaintiff-Appellant, v. WATCHTOWER BIBLE AND TRACT SOCIETY OF NEW YORK, INC., Defendants-Appellee. No. 85-4012. United States Court of Appeals, Ninth Circuit. Argued and Submitted March 7, 1986. Decided June 10, 1987.
(Edited for divergent grammar)
Edited by - Max Divergent on 19 July 2002 8:19:14
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siegswife
I'm not well versed in Society or legal procedures, so I'm afraid I won't be much help in that area. For what it's worth, my prayers are with you and all the little ones who have been harmed by this monstrous excuse for a religion. God bless your course, Bill.
John 3:18-21 He that exercises faith in Him is not to be judged. He that does not exercise faith has been judged already, because he has not exercised faith in the name of the only begotten Son of God. Now this is the basis for judgement, that the light has come into the world but men have loved the darkness rather than the light, for their works were wicked. For he that practices vile things hates the light and does not come to the light, in order that his works might not be reproved. But he that does what is true come to the light, in order that his works may be made manifest as having been worked in harmony with God.
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Siddhashunyata
Max, your thoughts are good ones. In other words, since disfellowshipping is certain, Bill should "choose" the most advantageous reason for that action. Let speaking to the media cause the action thereby strengthening the case against the WTBTS as perpetrators of actions that threaten "the peace saftey or morality of the community."
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belbab
After reading through these six pages, I would like to add a few thoughts.
I think Bill should comply with their requests, if he does not, they get what they want.
I think the supporters of Bill and Silent Lambs create a diversionary public display, all over the country, in front Bethel, at Kingdom Halls etc. Perhaps Bill can go to the hearing. Then as it is in progress, then supporters show up and surround the place.
As for recording devices , I read somewhere that there is a device that can listen from a distance, through vibrations on a window pane. The Russians in the past, at conferences, would have a group of people reading newspapers out loud in the conference room to thwart any recording device.
Whatever takes place, we accept what is given, and then we use that to further the cause of juctice.
The Lamb was impaled centuries ago, within a few days the City of Peace was filled with supporters proclaiming His name. Down through the centuries, The Lambs have always been maligned, excommunicated, hunted persecuted and killed. They will never be silent! Oppression will never prevail!
belbab