It is ironic how African American male slaves of all ages have been called "boys" and viewed as boys, but now in this incident people insist in calling the "slayed" teen, a man.
Michael Brown verdict discussion policy
by Simon 254 Replies latest forum announcements
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TheSilence
Does it matter? 2 points on this silliness of boy vs man:
1. It does not matter how old he was, if his age is an issue to you then it matters how old he appeared. It's not like the police in such a situation have time to say 'hold on, before we continue can I check your ID for age before I determine if I'm allowed to use deadly force. Once I see it and know all the parameters we can continue where we left off'. What the officer saw was a male of a large enough size to not only be considered a man on sight but also a threat if threatening behavior or language are used.
2. I don't care if a 'boy' is 18 or 10. If he's big enough to pose a threat and uses his size to try to seize an officer's gun I expect him to get shot. If the officer's version of events is supported by evidence you can call him a boy or a man or a toddler, whatever you think makes it sound more tragic. I'm still okay with someone of that size attempting to take an officer's gun getting shot no matter if he is a man or a boy.
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Fisherman
Until it is indisputably established as fact in Court it is not incorrect to refer to the call as alleged. Taken for granted that the call was made, but the Court will decide facts. Of course, you can conclude what you like but again, it is not incorrect to wait for all of facts.
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designs
I would have been 'ok' with the officer doing many things differently than he did like calling for another patrol car, using a loud speaker to get the young man's attention, just talk to the young guy for awhile. So many developed countries around the globe handle these incidents so much better than us.
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TheSilence
Do you know that he didnt call for another car? I thought what Sammie posted indicated he did. I'm sorry, I guess he allegedly did. but if I don't know that he did then you don't know that he didn't.
Do you know that he had a loudspeaker available? Or that if he did he didn't use it? He allegedly told Michael to get out of the street but do you know how?
Just talk to the young guy for a while? Were you there? Do you know that he didn't try?
It's easy to second guess after the fact. Were there other options? Probably. Does that make it the officers fault? No. Even if we assume that the officer should have done all those things it does not justify someone attempting to seize his gun. If that's what the facts support then, guess what, Michael had other options as well. So, yes, I am still okay with it even if I think it was a tragic outcome.
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designs
What I read is that other developed countries around the globe have far less Officer shootings of suspects. Something is different, something in the training, something in the culture, somethings we as a country we need very much to assess in order to have far better outcomes.
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TheSilence
Is the something wrong in the way the officers are trained and handling it or is the something wrong in how brazen people in this country are with the police? Understand I'm not a proponent of police brutality, this really is an honest question on my part. I see wrong on both sides in different situations. I tend to take things case by case because I truly believe there are good cops and there are hotheads. And I truly believe most people have sense enough not to grab for a cops gun but that there are still those who will if they think they can. I look at it case by case. If you look at the overall picture I think the police could do better *and* the populace could do better in taking personal responsibility and being respectful. Case by case, though, if the evidence supports officer Wilson's version of events then I don't care how old michael was, he bears personal responsibility for getting himself shot and I don't find the officer at fault.
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TheSilence
And it's not fair to try the officer on the basis of how you view the culture. If you have a problem with the culture then be a proponent if change. Try the officer on the merits of the evidence Of this case and this case alone.
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designs
The more the local police departments militarize the more the public will naturally be repulsed by those images. Police Departments need to be a friendlier Protect and Serve presence in communities, a resource you go to as needed rather than be viewed with suspicion and fear.
We have seen the cycle of corruption in Police abuse-Court trial-to Prison in several States and cities across the Nation. Several Judges and Prison Wardens and staff have been taken down in recent years. That image filters out into the community. If you get arrested and have the suspicion that you are going to 'hang yourself' in the city jail you may well bolt from custody.
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Fisherman
"Quite clear he has knowledge" is a conclusion, a belief, not a fact. I would be interested to know if the defense admitted he had knowledge of the incident. If I was in the defense, I would remain silent. But if the officer had knowledge, a lot of questions come up, Did he suspect or identify MB as the suspect, if so at what point did he identify him, if so why did he not call for backup upon identifying, why did he try to detain a dangerous man of that size on his own, why did he let him get so close to his gun, are there any ties between the store owner and the police. We cannot assume that the defence's version of what happened is what happened. How do you allow someone that you are going to detain get so close to your gun? If you are going to confront 300lb 6 foot 6 man and may have to detain him, you know before hand that: 1 he submits 2 he resists and therefore you may have to kill him because of his size he cannot be subdued. 3 Call for backup.