October 1914? Really?

by sylvlef 65 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • rjharris
    rjharris

    The 1914 date is the foundation upon which all of the prophetic utterances that issue out of the mouth of the WTBTS are built upon. It is a false foundation. Why?

    First, the 1914 date did not originate with the WTBTS. It was "borrowed" by C.T. Russell when he was a Second Adventist (Today, known as Seventh Day Adventist). When he broke away from that movement, he adopted that date. So it was the Second Adventist who "originated" this "false" date.

    The WTBTS claims that God has always had a Faithful Slave on the earth since 33 C.E. Well, since the 1914 date came from the Second Adventist, were they that Faithful Slave. The WTBTS would answer "no" as it claims that the Faithful Slave can only come through the WTBTS which hails itself as God's Earthly Organization and "The Truth." Thus, a problem devlops. If the 1914 date did not come out of the WTBTS, but by some other means, how can it be the truth?

    Second (and most important as far as I am concerned) is what the Master Jesus [the] Christ said. He said that no one knows when he will return except the Father in heaven. Even he himself nor the angels in heaven had knowledge of such things.

    So how can any human or human agency claim to have knowledge of something Christ said that even he had no knowledge of? Can an organization no what Christ does not know?

    Jesus was clear at Matthew 24:36, Matthew 24:42 and Acts 1:7.

    At Matthew 24:36 concerning that day (time period):

    "Concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father."

    At Matthew 24:42, Jesus did not tell his disciples to engage in calculations and derivations in establishing dates that are unknowable. Instead, he told them to:

    "Keep on the watch, therefore, because YOU do not know on what day YOUR Lord is coming."

    That the WTBTS has laid the 1914 foundation, there is no need to "keep on the watch." What is there to "watch for" if that organization teaches that Christ took kingdom power in 1914?

    There is no more watching. No more being vigilant. There exist now since 1914 a period of unwatchfulness and slumber. And it has been during this period of slumber, that a thief has broken into the Masters house and re-arranged the furniture: Changed and deviated from his teachings. A thief NOW has control over the Master slaves and have actually taken ownership over them and is teaching and directing those slaves in a manner that the true Master had not. This deception is so deep, that these slaves defend their new "task masters" and has forgotten the true Masters instructions to them at Matthew 24:36 and Matthew 24:42. The new "task masters" tell them that Christ returned and took kingdom power in 1914 and the true Master says "there is no way anyone can know that."

    The very question as to "when" Christ would take kingdom power came up by Jesus' disciples. At Acts 1:6 they asked him:

    "When, now, they had assembled, they went asking him: “Lord, are you restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time?"

    In response to them, the Master said to his disciples after he was resurrected at Acts 1:7 and gave them the following order:

    "It does not belong to YOU to get knowledge of the times or seasons which the Father has placed in his own jurisdiction."

    It does not belong to his disciples (or any human) to have "knowledge" of the times or seasons. Times and seasons for what? Restoration of his kingdom.

    The question one should be asking themselves is "Why has someone been aggressive in presenting as "knowledge" what Christ said cannot be known by them?

    Yet, in spite of what has been stated here there is more loyalty and admiration for this "new task master" than for the true Master. This new task master "demands" to be listened to, obyed, unquestioned, and unchallenged. Any not doing as it demands of them are "beaten." Beaten how? Punished by threat of expulsion (disfellowshipment), loss of privileges, labeled as rebellious, unfaithful, or apostate.

    Its membership is actually afraid of what "the organization - the new task master" can do to them, so they obey.

    Any date such as, 587 BCE, 607 BCE or 1914 are moot. Why? Because no human, no angel and not even Christ himself can know when he will take kingdom power. It is when the Father in heaven decides he will give his Son his kingdom of 1000 years. And, I do not envision Christ standing next to his Father bugging andhassling Him about when he will get his crown. He is being patient.

    A false foundation has been laid down with 1914. This foundation will not be able to support all that has been built upon it. Like a house of cards, it will fall; and, as far as I am concerned, it has already fallen if one clings to what Christ said about "times and seasons" and no one not knowing when he is coming.

    I am going to be frank with many of you: If you find yourself defending the 1914 date (or any teaching not of Christ), you have already been mislead and are in captivity to a master who did not die for you. A thief has possession of you.

    If you continue reading in the context of Matthew 24:42-51 you will read of two slaves within Christs household: An evil slave and a faithful (fellow) slave. Which one of these slaves were concerned about "times and seasons?"

    It was the evil slave because he felt that his master was "delaying." If he felt the Master was Is this not what the Watch Tower organization has done? It forecasted that 1914 would be the date that Christ would return! That organization "expected" 1914 would usher in Christs kindgom!

    Yet, the true faithful slave would reject any date. They know what their Master told them at Matthew 24:42 and they would be "watchful" knowing they cannot "know on what day" THEIR Lord is coming.

    So is "faithful slave" within the Watch Tower organization? Given what I have presented above, no!

    Personally, I would know a true faithful slave after a few minutes of speaking with them, and they would know me too. None of them are within ANY religious organization.

    It will be established religious organizations who would seek to beat what we know out of our heads. Yet, the truth will always prevail and it has the strength to confront error.

    For more information about 1914, see my article: http://www.e-prophetic.com/articles/where-did-the-1914-date-really-come-from/

  • happy@last
    happy@last

    I had this conversation with a JW recently, their eyes just glazed over. Essentially WW1 started before war in heaven started and satan was kicked out of heaven, which of course makes no sense.

    BTW, the OP said "But This war started in august", it was actually end of July

  • Phizzy
    Phizzy

    End of July was the assasination of the Archduke, looked upon as the event that set things in motion, it is recognised the war actually began in August.

    Anyhow, all long before October, when the war had begun to stagnate a bit, and looked as though it "might be over by Christmas".

    Surely the most important event to happen in modern times for the Earth, the establishment of God's Kingdom in (conveniently) Heaven, would have had some striking evidence on earth in October ?

  • jwfacts
    jwfacts

    2nd Oct 1914 has always been the end of the Gentile times. The Watchtower just hopes people don't notice that WW1 does not sync up with the start of the last days. This is because, "Historians calculate that Babylon fell in early October of the year 539 B.C.E." "Let your Kingdom Come" p.136

    *** re chap. 5 pp. 22-24 par. 3 John Beholds the Glorified Jesus ***

    The major fulfillment of that prophecy started with the desolating of the kingdom of Judah, which is indicated by Bible evidence to have been completed by October 607 B.C.E. Revelation 12:6, 14 shows that 3 1/2 times amounts to 1,260 days; hence, seven times (twice that number) must be 2,520 days. Reckoning “a day for a year,” we arrive at 2,520 years as the duration of the “seven times.” (Ezekiel 4:6) Therefore, Christ Jesus began his heavenly rule in the latter part of 1914. The erupting of the first world war in that year marked “a beginning of pangs of distress” that have continued to plague mankind.

    *** jv chap. 28 p. 635 Testing and Sifting From Within ***

    In its issue of October 15, 1913, The Watch Tower had stated: “According to the best chronological reckoning of which we are capable, it is approximately that time—whether it be October, 1914, or later. Without dogmatizing, we are looking for certain events: (1) The termination of the Gentile Times—Gentile supremacy in the world—and (2) For the inauguration of Messiah’s Kingdom in the world.”

    *** yb75 p. 73 Part 1—United States of America ***

    Quite a few delegates stayed at Bethel, and, of course, members of the headquarters staff were present at the breakfast table on Friday morning, October 2. Everyone was seated when Brother Russell entered. As usual, he said cheerily, “Good morning, all.” But this particular morning was different. Instead of proceeding promptly to his seat, he clapped his hands and joyfully announced: “The Gentile times have ended; their kings have had their day.” “How we clapped our hands!” exclaims Cora Merrill. Brother Macmillan admitted: “We were highly excited and I would not have been surprised if at that moment we had just started up, that becoming the signal to begin ascending heavenward—but of course there was nothing like that, really.” Sister Merrill adds: “After a brief pause he [Russell] said: ‘Anyone disappointed? I’m not. Everything is moving right on schedule!’ Again we clapped our hands.”

    *** w92 5/1 p. 6 The 1914 Generation—Why Significant? ***

    On October 2, 1914, Charles Taze Russell, then president of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, boldly announced: “The Gentile Times have ended; their kings have had their day.” How true his words proved to be! Unseen to human eyes, in October 1914 an event of world-shaking importance took place in heaven. Jesus Christ, the permanent Heir to “the throne of David,” commenced his rule as King over all mankind.

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    marked

  • Bonnie_Clyde
    Bonnie_Clyde

    An elder explained this to me years ago. World War I may have started in August, but it wasn't until October that 10 nations were involved, and the number 10 is a perfect number. Made sense to me at the time....

  • ballistic
    ballistic

    ... then minus the first number you thought of ...

  • Londo111
  • sir82
    sir82

    End of July was the assasination of the Archduke, looked upon as the event that set things in motion, it is recognised the war actually began in August.

    Archduke Ferdinand was assassinated on June 28.

    Austria-Hungary declared war on Serbia on July 28.

    Sir82, "pedantic class"

  • sir82
    sir82

    World War I may have started in August, but it wasn't until October that 10 nations were involved, and the number 10 is a perfect number.

    Nations involved by late August:

    Austria-Hungary, Serbia, Russia, France, England, Belgium, Germany, Luxembourg, Japan, Montenegro (10).

    Sir82, "Doubling down on pedanticism class"

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