Question for current and former elders: did you feel qualified to give counsel for depression?

by kneehighmiah 30 Replies latest jw friends

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  LisaRose

  The elders have a one size fits all solution to everything, more prayer, service, meetings, study. It's a tragedy in this day and age that they are so ignorant about mental health, it's equivalent to them trying to perform brain surgery because they had a week of training in it. Anybody with any mental health issues should be encouraged to consult a mental health professional. There are always government programs for lower income people so there is no excuse to allow people to suffer like that. Even a mainstream religion that has paid and educated clergy would not attempt to treat anyone with schizophrenia or other major mental health issue. There are much better drugs and treatments these days, these people could be helped and lead fairly normal lives, instead they are no better off than if they lived 100 years ago.

  I knew of a case where a woman with severe mental health issues, schizophrenia I think, who went of the rails and had an affair among other things. Of course they disfellowshipped her. She then started cutting herself, attempted suicide, took drugs, complete and utter melt down. Everyone in the hall thought she was demonized. She was finally hospitalized and given real treatment, she stabilized and got reinstated, then stopped taking her medication and started the whole thing all over again. She had young children, who knows what happened to them. I am sure there are many cases like this.
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  blondie

  I knew a BOE where one of its members had a psychology degree (4 years) 20 years before and the BOE cited him as a qualified person. He had no license, no schooling or training for 20 years, had never practiced or qualified for a license at any time. I showed them the state's requirements to practice in that state and said that he could be charged under their laws and that I had notified the board that they and he were representing this elder as qualified. Of course the elders backed off and never said he was licensed...but in the vocabulary of the board saying he was "qualified" was the same thing, implied he was licensed. But the fear was there in their eyes, money was involved. (How could Blondie do this, I know 3 members on that board...they know me and that I tell the truth.)

  I do think they tread lightly now but if they think no human will find out.....only God...they will persist.

  Can you imagine presenting an elder as qualified as a surgeon under the same set of info?
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  OnTheWayOut

  The elders have a one size fits all solution to everything, more prayer, service, meetings, study.

  Exactly. I noticed with the depressed that the elders' counsel often produced a worsening of the depression instead of the desired results. The depressed were hearing that "if I do more for the organization, I will feel Jehovah's blessings." When they don't feel Jehovah making the needed change in their life, they feel they must be letting "Him" down.

  As a cult member, I didn't go so far as to say to the elders that they needed to stop saying "DO MORE!" But I did tell the depressed things completely different from the standard advice. "It's good to seek professional help. You need to take a break sometimes. Auxilliary pioneering will add pressure to you."
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  cantleave

  I wouldn't presume to have any skills in counselling. I am OK at listening.

  My time as an elder taught me absolutely nothing.
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  AFRIKANMAN

  Elder for 15 years and then fell into deep dark depression myself + 2 suicide attempts - Not one of my fellow body called on me - FACT. Only a really top class Psychiatrist managed to assist me through this but it required a lot of support from my wife and kids> I had to use meds as well and still do [Venlafaxine] I originally was up at the 300mg/day - now at 75 mg/day.

  It requires a Multi-pronged approach

  To repeat what has already been said here:

  JW elders should not even try to counsel - just advise that victim gets professional help / assist them to get help /

  The "saving grace" is that depression is now exploding in congregations [and this was confirmed to me by a co's wife] and so there is a sensitivity by some congo elders to the matter - once you have been to Hell and Back you truly are qualified to be empathetic but only then.

  My fading and no longer being on the body, not attending meetings and FS has assisted me greatly to be able to deal with my D.

  Knowing the TTATT has also proven helpful.

  You know someone depressed? Help them please ! And their families as they suffer greatly too. [My wife is now recovering from double Mastectomy and Chemo - maybe my D was a contributing factor]

  Feel free to PM if you want to talk - I will "listen" without judgement.
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  frankiespeakin

  Those in a delusional state of mind are hardly in a position/qualified to offer good/appropriate council for the mentally ill or clinically depressed but can refer them to those qualified(therapist). But even a broken clock is right 2x in a 24 hour day, so even a elder caught up in the Watchtower Corporation's collective delusions can give appropriate council every now and then with the same type of accuracy every once in a while, like perhaps about .1% of the time, and even higher if they deviate from the WT Cororation's suggested advice and loathing of psychology(going to a psychologist is concidered as defeat for 'true christians'/Brain dead JWs*.

  http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/quotes/psychiatry.php

  *Awake! 1960 March 8 p.27

  "As a rule, for a Christian to go to a worldly psychiatrist is an admission of defeat, it amounts to 'going down to Egypt for help.' Isaiah 31:1. Often when a Witness of Jehovah goes to a psychiatrist, the psychiatrist will try to persuade him that his troubles are caused by his religion, entirely overlooking the fact that the Christian witnesses of Jehovah are the best-oriented, happiest and most contented group of people on the face of the earth. They have the least need for psychiatrists. Also, more and more psychiatrists are resorting to hypnosis, which is a demonic form of worldly wisdom."
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  XBEHERE

  Not at all.
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  JW GoneBad

  Interesting and timely thread on depression.

  I understand that many COs through out the U.S. are showing the 2013 suicide video to ministerial servants.

  That's the same video that the elders were shown at their training camp in 2013 where a suicidal JW member sister named Mary was seriously contemplating taking here own life via gasing herself in her enclosed car in the garage a year after her husband's death.

  So now not only are elders 'experts' in handling JW members who are suffering from depression and toying around with suicide, but Jehovah's Witnesses who are thinking about suicide can now turn to 20 & 30 year old ministerial servants for 'expert' help after watching this 15 minute crash course video!

  WOW!!!!
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  Quarterback

  Sometimes I wonder about those statememnts made by Elders going to visit JW patients in hospitals. They say, " We went to encourage them, but, they encouraged us in return". Well, there were many times that I wanted to say, " I went to encourage them, but, they are really a mess. Now, where did I put that whisky bottle?".
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  BucketShopBill

  I know Elders who spend more time counseling others while their family is falling apart. How many Elders do you know that were more than happy to leave their homes during the week to help others? The Watchtower make's people think they have skills they do not, heard this many times by many Elders "I am a psychologist, therapist, human behaviour observor and money manager thank's to the Watchtower!". This Elder who told me this, well, he kinda did not apply the Divine Wisdom from New York. After stealing from the Congregation, he took off with another Elder's wife (leaving his seven kids alone and wife penny-less) and finally after his new girl found out he was evil, she dumped his fat ass and he put a gun to his mouth and blew his brains out!"

  Life can be brutal, the Watchtower refused to allow it's members help for Depression almost it's entire time as a Cult. Things like "If you have problems, you most not be doing enough!"

  "Got Depression? You don't see the Pioneers or Auxies sitting around acting Blue, their two busy, not self-absorbed and have no time for Depression or Mental Illness!

  You might be surprised how many Elders think they have skills they do not, so many of the Elders are becoming personal recluses allowing the Sheep to disappear for months to years before they send out their well-skilled Elders ready to offer psychotherapy. Young Elders are quickly burned out from the relentless nut-balls who call all hours of every day wanting to bend their ears. The older Elders are smart, they get "caller-ID" and screen to avoid getting trapped for two hours on the phone with "Mental Molly" or "Bob Bummer". The Governing Body need to sit back and enjoy the insane Sheep, than they might decide to improve the education of the Elders. The poor Elders are so uneducated and can't meet the needs of "mentals", a lot of Elders have ascended past the Watchtower Guilt and avoid Emotional Burnout by reading Non-Watchtower materials and focus on their family! Those are the Elders that figured it out, it's a waste of time and their job is to make their wife happy and further the interest of their family first, not Mad Martha or Bob Bummer!