Question for current and former elders: did you feel qualified to give counsel for depression?

by kneehighmiah 30 Replies latest jw friends

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  kneehighmiah

  Do you feel the counseling demands placed on elders are fair and scriptural?

  I live in an economically depressed industial city. My dad is an elder in a lower income black congregation. There is a high rate of mental illness in the area. He is retired now, but he spends a tremendous amount of time counseling depressed and unstable individuals. Many people do not have the money to seek professional help. Why does the organization expect untrained elders to do a job that is difficult even for professionals? It's unfair and is upsetting me. My father should be enjoying retirement, not running around dealing with everyone's problems. These people need Professional therapy. I believe a quarter of the women at my hall are mentally and emotionally unstable. many have low self esteem from growing up in broken homes, and the guilt and demands placed upon them exacerbate the situation. My dad holds a masters degree and is the only elder with a college education. I think it's ridiculous that these men are called upon to deal with those who have mental illness.

  Your thoughts? Did you feel overwhelmed and unqualified?
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  sparrowdown

  I hope you don't mind me commenting as I am not of that gender to qualify as an elder.

  The problem as I have observed is that the "counsel" the elders give, can make mental illness worse.

  The last thing a sick person needs is a side order of guilt and shame, which is the only flavour WT counsel comes in.

  And no, the elders are not in any way, shape,or form qualified to advise anything other than

  " I would advise you to seek medical advice, as I am not qualified in these matters"

  If an elder doesn't feel overwhwelmed and unqualified when counseling the mentally ill,

  then they are overestimating their own ability and qualifications.

  Last time I checked the borg were'nt in the business of handing out diplomas in psychology.

  These guy's are clueless and shouldn't be put in the position of psychologist/therapist/marriage counselor/spiritual policeman/lecturer etc
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  DesirousOfChange

  Only counsel I would give is to "go see a professional.............I did".

  Doc
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  Wasanelder Once

  All you have to do is get them to bake you cookies and you are home free! (see stupid society elder training video)
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  ctrwtf

  Although its been many years ago...my answer would be that I was totally unqualified. There are no easy answers to grinding poverty and depression. I would have to agree with sparrowdown. The canned answers that an elder would give by way of the society would probably make matters worse.

  It sounds like your Dad is educated. Does he have a degree in psychology? Maybe he enjoys feeling needed? Either way it's up to him to decide when enough is enough and hang up his elder hat.
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  life is to short

  I can only speak as an elders wife but it was horrible. My husband did truly care about the mentally ill and most of the other elders would not even talk to them. The CoBE one time actually ran in the hall from one horribally ill guy. This guy did not bath and just mumbled when he talked but loved to go out in service so we always would up with him in our car group. I would have to spray the car with Lysol after service as our car smelled so bad. What the householders thought I have often wondered. What it was a day out for the mentally ill. To be with him or any of them at the door was so painful, I just wanted crawl away so many times. But they had their rights to go door to door.

  I have been out in service with people who are hearing voices, who shake so badly they cannot even hold thier Bibles. I have been yelled at, screamed at, told I had no right as I was just the wife, you name it I have been there, done that.

  We had one guy threaten to kill us and when we called Bethel telling them we were going to go to the police Bethel told us NO! They did not want Jehovah's name brought into it. Like sending extream mentally ill people door to door was not bring reporch on Jehovah's name? I went through two years of hell by this guy coming into the restaurant where I worked threating me. Only when one of the halls in the area got a restraining order would my husband agree that we could but even with the restraining order it did nothing as the guy was so crazy. I really thought he would kill us as he had many guns in his home.

  The CO at the time all of this was happening told me that I was being unfair when I told him I could not handle it, I was totally losing it. We did not have a marriage, and we were just newely married as my husband was gone all the time. The CO told me that Jehovah was using my husband now and I could have him in the new system which was going to happen very soon. That was 25 years ago now.

  It all came to a head with the pedophiles and I just lost it finally when a CO told me that I had no say in taking the child molesters in MY CAR because my husband was an elder. That was the final straw and I was done. We went to marriage counseling and even the counselor told my husband she could only handle an hour with a truly mentally ill person without a break. Here my husband had been spending hour, and hours and hour either on the phone or at their homes.

  The marriage counselor agreeded with me that it was crazy for the religion to expect someone untrained like my husband to be an elder. Then the body deleated my husband because after all the years of hell I went through, by my standing up about the pedophiles I was not in subjection enough now and my husband did not qualify because he could not keep me in line.

  LITS
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  berrygerry

  The CO told me that Jehovah was using my husband now and I could have him in the new system which was going to happen very soon. That was 25 years ago now.

  Priceless!
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  Quarterback

  Wow, the above posters have really identified some real Mental Issues that I would find it very disturbing to handle. I know the difference between Depression, and Discouragement. I'm not qualified to treat Depression, but I think that anyone who shows some caring attitude towards such ones could provide some value or benefit. You don't have to be an Elder to help. Notice I said help, not cure
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  Band on the Run

  A world famous doctor once remarked to me that psychiatry cannot cure crappy circumstances. The poor do suffer from mental illness more than middle class people. It isn't genetic. The stressors on the poor are unrelenting.

  I am a bit surprised that your dad continues to serve with his education. Sometimes it is hard to see your own lapses of judgment. You can't rescue everyone.

  A friend was a member of a special committee for the Episcopal Diocese of Philadelphia. One year the damages they paid in malpractice soared. A study showed that there were no blips in the data until the seventh visit. Six visits hardly any damage awards. They decided to limit pastoral counseling to six visits. More competent help was needed. I also know that in NYC there is a rule that chaplins in cancer wards and adolescent psychiatry had to rotate to kinder settings.
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  TMS

  JW elders are not trained counselors period. There is simply no training within the organization.

  As a Congregation Servant, then elder from the 60's to 90's, I know I was inadequate despite using every JW resource. One of my concerns was how to make real shepherding calls, not just share material from the Watchtower or Kingdom Ministry. In the 80's I listened to talk radio during my night job featuring Dr. Henry Ruben. I actually mimicked his questioning technique and style, at least becoming a good listener, but without the skills to do talk therapy. I got the image of a counselor without the substance or training.

  I did get assigned as a JW rep to visit patients at a state mental hospital who identified themselves as JW's. I remember one clinically depressed sister walking out to me, shoulders sagging, her body language indicating to me she was totally down. I've never felt less adequate. The so-called New Order or Kingdom hope, knowing Jehovah, etc. is useless in that situation. That person needs, not only talk therapy, perhaps pharmaceuticals to balance body chemistry, all skills not taught at the Kingdom Hall.

  Alcoholism, alcohol dependency, etc. is another problem not in within the wheelhouse of JW elders. I took assignments to "counsel" such men in the congregation. Actually, no one else would. Do you realize how stupid it is to assign an alcoholic JW a Watchtower article to read for his problem? Two men I "worked" with stayed in the congregation as long as I was there because I was an advocate for the fact that they were "good" men deep inside. Both men were disfellowshipped shortly after I left the organization for being "practicers of sin."

  JW counseling is bull shit.