I never realized that Hitler's persecution of the Witnesses was worse than that of the Jews

by ThomasCovenant 72 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Band on the Run

  I believe that regardless of Rutherford's actions, German Witnesses would be persecuted by the Nazis. JWs rarely mention all the groups that were victims. I believe communists were executed in higher numbers. I was doing research in the law library when my eye saw a listing for a separation of church and state journal. The article's title announced an article with persecution of Japanese Witnesses. I could not recall any discussion of Japanese Witnesses growing up. My guess is that Hitler was friendly to the Witnesses compared to the Japanese government. Germans are typically Christians while Japanese practice Shinto.I stopped my work to read the article.

  The author, a female Bethelite lawyer, never mentioned one Japanese martyr. The entire article was a worshipful piece about brave Judge Rutherford, ruling from Brooklyn with its Manhattan skyline view. It shocked me because I was not on this forum yet. I wrote the author a short note on Crane's stationary, asking why she was allowed to be a lawyer with her female parts. Other women clean rooms or do laundry. What made her so elite? I then highlighted my legal background and remarked how cult like the article was. Two or three short stories of Japanese humans confronted by cultural difference during difficult times. This is the essence of the cult. No human, save the GB members, are worthy of mention. She blew her chance at fame. I also wrote a note to the journal expressing my views. Her article was not journal worthy.
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  LogCon

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  Maranatha

  The Vatican never opposed Hitler. Hitler and the majority of the Nazi's were indeed Catholics. After the Holocaust, the Vatican helped many Nzai war criminals evade justice through the Vatican Ratlines. They did the same for the Ustashi who slaughtered the Serbs. The Pope did not care about anyone but furthering his political and religious propaganda of power and greed. The Roman Catholic church and the Vatican have dethroned countless emperors and kings throughout history but did NOTHING to stop Hitler and in fact, supported him!

  Recommended reading: "A Woman Rides the Beast" by Dave Hunt.

  And it's nothing new that the Watchtower likes to rewrite history in order to have merit for their doctrines. They have changed the numbers on earthquakes that have occurred before and after 1914 in order to promote their end days prophecies and the invisible return of Jesus.
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  Terry

  Witnesses really went out of their way to break deliberately the laws against peddling propaganda on the streets.

  The actions taken by Nazis were a RE-ACTION to the scoff-law attitude engendered by Rutherford.

  So, I have to disagree the JW's would have gotten in as much trouble anyway.

  The books they were touting were the screeds of Rutherford who had made his NON-NEUTRAL position very public.
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  Terry

  THE REASON Bible Students (the German's werent JW's) thought they should go against the Superior Authorities of Government

  was because Judge Rutherford had turned the interpretation of Romans 13:1,2 inside out.

  Let us not forget that!

  He twisted scripture and people were imprisoned and died.

  Then, in 1962, the scripture was twisted back to the traditional understanding (Christendom was right all along.)

  This was "New Light."
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  Band on the Run

  The issue of religion and Nazis is complex. Again, most Roman Catholics opposed Hitler. He was not popular. Most historians believe Pope Pius did nothing to protect the Roman Jewish ghetto, a historic tradition of the pope's responsibility. The Vatican Bank needed Jewish financing. If anyone is interested,a major book titled Constantine's Sword reviews the standing of Jews and Christians for centuries. A minority of historians believe Pope Pius did a good job, overall. Depending on which acts you highlight, the verdict changes. Many Catholics atone for the lack of protection during the Nazi era.

  There are moving and popular stories of RC priests dying so others could survive in the concentration camps. I don't know of a single JW story.
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  Terry

  HERE is the most direct statement:

  http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/anti-semitism/pius.html
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  kaik

  Prologos, still Jews sufferred the most because they were singled out as a collective victim of the genocide. They were not only these who were killed, because there were Romans, Slavs, anti-fascsist Germans, and many others. But overall the Jewish population in Czechoslovakia alone sufferred 88% death rate. In comparision to JW who were charged under non-racial laws and had less than 5% death rate, this is not even comperable. Many JWs were also in regular prison camps instead extermination camps like Birkenau. Europe during WWII had witnessed many large-scale massacress, I had mentioned Lidice (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4a49DBQ7cA8), but there were hundreds of these all over the continent from Oradour in France to Kragujevec in Serbia to Kaliste in Slovakia and countless others in Russia, Poland, Ukraine...

  I do not believe bombing of death camps would alter the killing machine. Many of them happened outside the camps like in Babi Yar. Additionally, much of the deaths happened at the end of the war due outbreak of typhoid fever and bombing would not change the death toll. JWs were attempted to stay neutral of the military machine; which was also reason, why they were spared in mass killing. Generally people who accidentally appeared in opposition to nazi regime were tortured and killed. Who was military and had training to survive guerilla war had higher chance for survival. For civilians who suddenly appeared as a helper like delivery of messages or transmit signal to UK, they sufferred the most. The torture was often public and had to terrify population into compliance. I heard from my teacher and relatives a teen girl helped partisans. It was nothing more than bringing a medical supplies. As a result she was impailed on fence with snipper pointing to anyone who would save her. She was dying for two days. My mother told me when partisans were captured, they were brought into town square and were put into roasting tar cauldron alive where everyone was forced to watch in gun point. I do not ever recall JWs sufferred any similar fate like these people. But some were shot.
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  kaik

  I disagree that Catholic church was fully comliant with the Nazis. Many ordinary priests sufferred the same result as other opposition to Nazi regime. Thousands were executed from various ranks and some orders were outlawed like Teutonic Knights who were hunted down and exterminated. However, there were various currents within the church that were not only sympathetic to the National Socialism, but activelly supported Nazis and fascists until 1945 like Tiso's Slovakia and Ustache in Croatia. It is not easy to single out all catholic priesthood as collaborators, but they should certainly be more vocal in opposition to Hitler. When the war started in 1939, it was too late.
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  prologos

  Thank you kalk, you underline my point well. Nobody in the western world can understand the horrors that the populations in the eastern warzones went through. Baby yar, Katyn.

  beeing a jw was no picknic but at least the lines were drawn, at the razors of the SS throats.

  There was at least one puplisized of the many opposition priests: 'The Deputy' the story.