Hello everyone! I could use some advice

by SnailsPace2 28 Replies latest social family

  • rebel8

    I don't have kids, but I was one, around your son's age, when I was forced in. Or I should say, manipulated in. I was told The End would come before Christmas that year (1975), so I wouldn't miss out on that, and I'd be petting lions in paradise soon--if I'd agree to go to church with mommy instead of daddy. (I believe if I chose daddy, I would have been forced in anyway. I think she just wanted my 'consent'.) Also daddy and his church would be destroyed anyway, and so would I if I chose that. Not much of a choice!

    As I grew older, I said the politically correct things to my worldly relatives about wanting to go to Bethel and all that, but it was just lies I was told to say to witness to them.

    So think about that. Kids are too young to make such choices, and even if you think he did choose to go to the hall, he probably didn't.

    Just explain to him you and daddy learned something new and found out what you used to believe isn't true. I'm sure there is something in his world you can relate this to, like him learning something new as he got older.

    You said he had a spiritual side. What does that mean?

    He has a sense of morals? Good--help him express that. Take him to soup kitchens or toy drives or whatever things you can do to develop his desire to be a good person. Maybe he's a future Social Worker or whatever. You don't need religion to be an awesome person!

    Does it mean he talks about God a lot? Great--he's inquisitive and/or he is interested in magical things and big ideas. Give him more opportunities to develop that. Give him Harry Potter books or stuff to develop his imagination. Or help him develop his critical thinking skills.

    Sounds like you have a smart kid. If there is a Creator, He will want us to use the great gift that He gave us--our minds.

  • anonymouz

    Tell him the truth, though all men be found liars, like Bethel's current leadership, let God be found true. There is the Almighty God forever, human corruption is endemic since Eden's sin, God provided PROMISE of the seed of recovery (Gen3:15), and that is still TRUTH, the truth. God tracked all that development of sovereign rival power, and his own Kingdom forming power through Daniel and to the apostle John and all the prophets for a good 2800 years of prophecy so accurate, it is now called world history.

    Jesus Christ, the seed, the true solution, the first life created by God, from God, is also still true and the only true hope to retrieve men past, present and future from inevitable death in Adam. That is all still true, neither Christendom, Bethel or any other human organized diversion from truth can change reality that is actually true.

    Thus tell your son the truth. Bethel's primary leaders are now corrupted, they joined the opposing kingdom power as UN NGO, that will bring a judgment on JWs for that transgression (Dan8:13 as 1Pet4:17), and they will reap what they have sown, it is also foretold in prophecy they cover up (Dan8:12b) and truthfully, they no longer represent the truth (2Thess2:10-11), instead they drive millions and millions AWAY from God, but God, as before on several documented occasions of prophecy again becoming history will recover the final truth, again (Rev10:11; 2Thess2:8).

    You may get to the core of the dilemma, ask your son does he want to be taught about God and Christ by lawless corrupted men in the so-called Governing Body?

    And I feel you can ask that question quite honestly while still maintaining core Christian truth, that truly at one time, 1914-1950 IBSA and JWs did at once truthfully represent as best they could, and they did expose the first 2 UN related fulfillments of prophecy in 1919 and 1945, rather than joining the UN, and covering up the 3rd (1990) and 4th (future) UN manifestations of Daniel 11:30-45, as Bethel also covers up King North as 8th King developments there, as their continual UN NGO internal Bethel endorsers are also prophetic subverters.

    You may explain, truthfully, Jesus Christ warns Christians to flee the city (organization) once one personally ascertains the rival kingdom "disgusting thing" in it's midst, and in principle that applies to Bethel as UN NGO and the JW organization overall:

    (Matthew 24:15-16) “Therefore, when you catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation (UN NGO), as spoken of through Daniel the prophet (1990 Dan11:31b parallel to Dan8:13-14), standing in a holy place (Bethel's claim), (let the reader use discernment,) 16 then let those in (JW worldwide) Judea begin fleeing to the mountains. (leave JWs, judgment is nigh).

    In my opinion explaining these core truths of Bethel's corruption are important, and outweigh all their other sins (2Thess2:3-4) in direct guaranteed import of a judgment to come first upon JWs; (1Pet4:17).

  • skeeter1

    Hi, I have had 2 children who went through your son's age. I am out of the JWs, and my parents/relatives know it. So, I am in a different situation then you becuase I had more freedom. I told/showed my relatives alot of what I disagreed with in the JWs. Perhaps some of what I did will work for you.

    At first, my parents/relatives asked to take my kids to the KH, to read them Bible stores, and to place children's books with us. I simply refused each one. I told them that I had differences with the WTS. So, they what any JW would do, they did not respect my wishes and quickly went to my spouse. My spouse told them, "I don't think Skeeter would like that." So, then the JWs called the elders, who told them to back off because we were the parents. In your case, you can throw the issue off to your Head of Household Hubby!

    You see, under US law, you have the right to parent your children and to bring them up in the religion of your choosing. Grandparents do not have this right.

    What I also did was to "innoculate" my children against the JWs. I told them, "If anyone comes to you to talk to you about religion, church, God, or Jehovah . . . you stop them and tell them that you have to get mommy & daddy to be with you during this conversation." I repeat that to them every week, and then alot when the JWs are a coming near. Then, I told my JW relatives my rule in a matter-of-fact way.

    Then, I also "explained" other religions to my children. I point out strengths and weaknesses of each. Library books, attend other churches, etc.

    When my oldest was 8, my sibling came to town but was also going to the local Memorial. My 8 year old asked her what it was about, if it was like Christmas. Well, the sibling "light up" and explained that she was remembering Jesus death because he told us to remember him. So, I chimed in that some churches remember him once a year, but others remember him at every Mass with the bread and wine. I reminded the 8 year old of the Catholic service we went to with a neighbor friend and how they ALL partook of the wine and bread. JWs do it once a year, and only very few remember him with drinkng the bread and taking the wine. Well, JW sibling then gets high and says, "Oh, that's wrong to do it every time." To which I said, "In the Bible, when Jesus said to remember him, he did not give a set schedule and nor did he exclude people. Some churches do it once a year, and others do it more often. Go read the passage." Sibling shut her trap at that point. To which I then added on, "Jehovah's Witnesses big celebration is like a funeral for Jesus. It is not a celebration as you are thinking, honey."

    Don't let your children go to the JW church without you. The JWs will quickly brainwash your children and, eventually, turn them against you becuase you turned your back against Jehovah. There are too many here on this board who have gone through this scenario. Do you want your children to write you.

    "Dear Mommy & Daddy,

    You are going to die in Armegheddon becuase you do not believe in Jehovah. You need to come back to the meetings. I will miss you when I am in Paradise...."

    Those letters really do get sent (usually between divorced, mixed religion families).

    Eight years old is just two years away from 10. And, 10, is the new age to be baptised. Do you want your child studying for JW baptism?

    JWs have a warped sense of childhood. They don't really accept childhood. They try to make children into mini-adults. In dress, talk, behavior, everything, JW children are expected to be mini-adults. An extension of this is that JW grandparents think that the mini-adult has a right to accept an invitation to the KH, with or without the parent's permission. There have been stories on this board of JW neighbors cunningly taking non-JW neighbor kids to the KH. JWs don't respect boundaries, and if you and your husband are going to be parents . . . you need to set boundaries with your parents.

    Encourage the grandparents to interact with you, your husband, and their grandchildren. At all times, put the ball in their court and keep an open door policy. Just take religion off the table. If your parents shun, your kids will get "shunning". Even children will find it against human nature if it should happen. Biggest turn-off JWs can do. Best thing you can do to innoculate your child against cults.


  • jgnat

    Suggest to the grandparents that they can visit their grandson at your house on non-meeting nights, and reassure them that their moral superiority will certainly win over "without a word".

    For your son who has a spiritual dimension, how about a "family study night"? You can encourage his independent thinking this way, while being his primary influence, as you should be, at this age.

  • jwfacts

    I have a 5 1/2 year old.

    My father in law wants us to allow my son to make the decision if he wants to attend the meetings or not.

    Of course the father in law does. He knows how important that is for the indoctrination process. Did the FIL let his son choose at 6 whether he wanted to go to meetings or not? At the age of 16 was your husband given the choice? I'm pretty sure your FIL is being a hypocrite.

    My son hates the religion, far more so than I was trying for. He wanted to know why my mother doesn't talk to me, so I tell him it is because I do not believe in her religion, so they make her shun me. He asks about my childhood and what I did for my birthday etc. I tell him that because I went to the Jehovah's Witness Church that I was not allowed to have birthday/christmas/halloween etc. I showed him the Bible Stories book and said how the stories say the God of that religoin murdered children in the flood and they say he is going to murder billions again at Armageddon, but lucky it is only a story and not true. I tell him I don't want my mother telling him those stories, and he does not let her.

    It is more difficult with your son, as he is already partly indoctrinated, but he will respect your opinion over that of the grandparents. Just educate him about the fact that everyone believes different things and no one really knows. Ask what his friends at school believe. He will find there are several different names for God, and their beliefs are based on that of the parents. Kids are not stupid, and they pick up a lot easier than adults that it is unrealistic to think only Grandfathers religion is right, and God wants to destroy all those other children. The more fun he has and the more good friends at school, the easier it will be for you.

    Whatever you do, don't let him go to meetings. I do not feel comfortable with a child being left alone with a grandparent that is a strict JW, as they are very unlikely to respect a request on them not trying to indoctrinate the grandkids.

  • zeb

    you yourself sayeth it. "Think critically and ask questions". and please do not confuse attendance at a kh with a persons spirituality.

  • KateWild

    Paul, (jwfacts)

    Such a lovely post. You're experience say's it all. Kate xx

    Snailspace2, Please go and visit jwfacts as well. Paul's experience is just the tip of the iceberg. What he teaches on his website was instrumental in helping my kids to critically think. You are on to something when you say you teach him critical thinking.

    Love Kate xx

  • GoneAwol

    Hi SnailsPace2!

    The best thing any parent can give to their children is a childhood. A good honest normal childhood. But only you as a parent can give this, not grandparents or any other family member.

    Very early on when me and my wife left, the first thing that the G parents asked was "can we take them to the meetings sometimes?" Our answer was a heavily stressed NO. No meetings, no talking about meetings, no 'such and such says hello'.

    We even went so far as to say that contact with our children depends on you doing this for us. We got past the shunning thing straight away by putting our own parental conditions on everything. You must get in there first.

    I am happy to say, the G parents are now into their own fade with my Mum in law missing all meetings since this June.

    You never know, they may start asking you questions about this controlling cult. All the best!


  • gorgia2

    Cofty's advice is fantastic. I'm certain most of us here on JWN who were born-in's and had to grow up in the JW cult would have loved to have had the opportunity your son may soon have, to be free of the lies and hypocrisy at a young age. I'm so sorry for the confusion he will feel, but later, when he is old enough, he will thank you. Considering how revoltingly early they baptise JW children nowadays, the sooner the better, IMO.


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