just love the overlapping generations bit....on that basis we are also the generation that knew Jesus....crazy!...and the dropping/twisting of the 1914 chronology is also just dodging...the 1986 peace security book had a whole chapter stating that 1914 /generation thing..
Whats the most damning of the July 15 2013 changes?
by Crazyguy 37 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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cedars
If I were ever asked that question by a JW, the two answers that would immediately come to mind would be...
- The new teaching arrogantly assumes that Christ will appoint the Governing Body over his 'belongings' before Armageddon, effectively taking the decision out of his hands. How can Christ be head of the congregation if he isn't even permitted to make his own decisions?
- The new teaching relies on "apostolic succession" to explain how a group selected in 1919 is still effectively alive now in the form of the current Governing Body. Apostolic succesion is a catholic tradition condemned in Watchtower literature, most notably in the Reasoning Book.
Cedars
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cantleave
The new teaching relies on "apostolic succession"
Great point Cedars- as has been stated before, the JW's have 8 popes!
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leaving_quietly
Gem of a quote from "God's Kingom Has Approached" (1973):
chap 17: p. 388 par 15,16 (emphasis theirs, not mine):
"This limiting the “slave” to the twelve apostles, however, might allow for the doctrine of an apostolic succession or an episcopal succession, a succession of bishops (overseers) by the religious process of ordination.
16 However, when we view the “faithful and discreet slave” as being the whole body of disciples (including spiritual overseers), it eliminates such a thing as “episcopal succession” that history shows has worked such harm and oppression in Christendom." -
Indian Larry
Great find leaving_quietly!
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Oubliette
I wrote about my two favorite "most damning" points here:
Ultimately, nothing will matter to the R&F JWs. They'll uniformly fall in step saying, "Well that's what I always thought we already believed!" with a happifying expression on their collective faces.
In truth, us "mentally diseased apostates" are a lot more concerned about doctrinal correctness than those still under the spell of the WTBTS tyrants.
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prologos
Billy the ex bethelite, : right. the appointing over all the belongings, the slaves dream, coincides with the rapture or(decapitation).
So, the moment the slave is appointed he is out of the household of God, the Congregation. up up and away.
WHAT THEN? with the household,
everything invisibly directed like the invisible coming, sitting standing master?
just asking.
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Londo111
''The Faithful Slave is the channel through which Jesus is feeding his true followers at this time of the end. It is vital that we recognize the Faithful Slave. Our spiritual health and our relationship with God depend on this channel." Matt 4:4; John 17:3. Watchtower July 15, 2013, page 20, paragraph.
So one's spiritual health (ie salvation) and relationship with God is dependent on recognizing 8 men in New York. Believe on the GB and ye will be saved!
If that is not a cultlike statement, I don't know what is. I'm really hoping that many will awaken with the same thought.
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konceptual99
Agree with everything on here except the apostolic succession.
I understand why this is being promoted as an argument but it's not quite the same is it?
As I understand it, AS in simplistic Catholic terms means the individual Bishop becomes consecrated through ordination and therefore carries the "correct" teaching.
Surely the argument with the F&DS is that this is a "class" and the individual members of the GB have no special consecration other than being of the 144,000. It's the body that represents God's channel and the individuals are essentially irrelevent. Although the semantics of when the F&DS was appointed and which group of people are represented by the class has changed, the idea of the body being appointed by God has not.
Surely the idea of AS could equally have been applied to the 144,000 when they made up the F&DS?
Am I missing something in this argument?
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Ding
The whole idea of the entire "anointed remnant" being the "faithful and discreet slave" was a fiction anyway.
The GB never knew nor cared who the professed "anointed remnant" outside of headquarters were, and those people had no input into doctrine or policy.
In fact, the "other sheep" in positions of authority at Bethel have always had far more influence than the worldwide "anointed".