WHY does God fail to...

by Martini 47 Replies latest jw friends

  • RedhorseWoman

    Weird? Well, I KNOW I'm weird.....but in a good way. LOL

    I used to believe that the Society had the Truth, the Whole Truth, and nothing but the Truth; but after so many changes and flip-flops, I have honestly come to believe differently.

    While the WTBTS may have a good message, I doubt very much that it is the ONLY way to approach God. I doubt that any religion has ALL the answers, although most of them claim to. I guess it's just a way to keep members.

    The one thing I DO know is that we are all children of a loving Father. He has not abandoned us, even though all the religions of the world claim that He WILL abandon us if we don't abide by that particular religion's rules.

    The more I think and act outside the box, the closer my relationship to Him becomes.

  • mgm

    I think the same way than allo of you...
    I figured out after some serious talks with elders, that the most important thing is to believe 100% to the fdS. This is the very important point.
    Nobody ask, do you believe in Jesus or the holy sprirt, no, the question is, do you believe in the slave!!
    I'm not allowed to talk to anybody in the meeting about my questions, in order to keep in contact with my family and friends.

    I don't believe, the JW's are the only true religion anymore, since I found people in other religions, which have a stronger and much deeper relationship with god than the average witness has.

  • waiting

    Dear mgm,

    I have not attended a meeting in two months, Sundays, an occasional Thursday, for the previous 2 years. I now look with my 20/20 hindsight and realize I've been shuffling my feet for a while.

    I told some close (elder) friends of mine that I wanted to take some time and think about this. I told him I did not dedicate myself to a corporation - I dedicated myself to Jehovah. He has not brought up religion since to me.

    His wife (after she invited me to her KH meetings) just put up her hand and said, "Didn't mean to pry, closed subject." She dismissed the subject then and never has encouraged me since. Not that I was looking for encouragement, but, I swear, you could see the veil come over her facial features when I said I wanted to think about this situation.

    Two other brothers I know well, have approached me. I just said I was taking time to really try to study my religion - just as we teach others to do.

    Maaaaannnnn! Was I given a strong discourse (fingers pointings and everything) on the only way to life was the meetings. I MUST get back to the meetings - even if I didn't agree - that's the only way Jehovah would ever accept me. I said I wanted to do what was conscientiously right. The poor brother, confused, told me not to follow my conscience - just get back to the meetings! I told him, you don't mean that. And he said, well, if your conscience is made wrong, what else can you do but go to the meetings?

    When one of the brothers (two different visits)couldn't answer my questions - Bible based - he said jokingly that I studied too much and was missing the point - life was at the meetings.
    I brought up the scripture "where two or more are gathered in your name, your spirit is there." Any place could be a meeting - we're looking for his spirit - not a building.

    His answer was: Don't you go thinking that two or more applies to you and your husband (I really never had thought of that until he said it)- and it doesn't mean just a group of people studying for themselves. It means the meetings in the Kingdom Hall, period.

    He also referred to the big shuffle in Bethel in 1980 as "The Apostasy of 1980." Has anybody else heard a title penned to this event? I haven't.

  • Maxee

    I have heard about the Great Apsostacy. It involved the disfellowshipping of Fred Franz's than president nephew Ray.
    Ray a member of the GB wrote a book after realising the dates the Society used regarding 506BC and the of presence of Jesus in 1914 were incorrect. Ray also prompts the reader to question a few other JW doctrines.
    One thing to note Ray never labels them or accuses them in a malicous or vindictive way. The GB were frightened of the impact of this publiction and hence went on a witch hunt throughout Bethel. They also had talks given at all the major assemblies on apostacy and its evilness. They never mentioned names as the speaker tends to do but you could tell it was warnning the brothers not to look at this book or else.
    When you think about it thats what they are trying to do with the net. They don't want us to question too much because what we would find out would expose some mistakes they have made.

    Randy Watters who was at Bethel during this time has heaps of information on the subject.
    Here is the url


  • Maxee

    I am also not very good with dates I would like to correct my statement regarding the mistakes in dating the Ray Franz found. The fall of Jeruselum according to the society 576bc to secular scholars dating 539 bc.

  • waiting

    Hello Maxee,

    Thanks for the infor. - I have read about Ray Franz and Randy Watters.

    I just didn't know that JW now have a title for what happened. Rather like The Hurricane of 1915 or The Tornado of the Century, etc.

    We just gotta title everything, huh?

  • mgm

    Maxee, the official date for the fall of Jerusalem ist the year 587 B.C.. The year 539 B.C. is accepted from the WTS and "the world". But only the WTS date the fall of Jerusalem to the year 607 B.C., which is against all the known facts of history.

    I can recommend to read the two books of Ramond Franz warmly, since you get an idea, how things are handled in Bethel. The first book is titled: "crisis of concience" , the second: "the way to cristian freedom"

    It should be a must to read this books for every witness.

  • Pathofthorns


    Your experience sounds quite similar to where I am right now. I'm trying to step back and get as much of an unbiased perspective on things, and certain ones are making it quite difficult to do so. Apparently I cannot have God's spirit if I'm not at my meetings.

    One has to almost be a lawyer to use the "grounds of conscience" argument while not showing disagreement with the organization. I just need a break or I think I'll lose my sanity.

    I can't believe even after explaining all my doubts/concerns they keep assigning me talks and other assignments in the hall. I've got to buy a house and move away I think.


  • Frenchy

    Path, your situation sounds very familiar.

  • Seven

    Good brother Martini, Luke 22:21 "But, look! the hand of my betrayer is with me at the table.

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