Is America Evil?

by Orthodox1 51 Replies latest jw friends

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  Orthodox1

  Slavery... Racisim... Corporate greed... Atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... A debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... An oubreak of child-offenders in public schools...

  Does anyone think America is evil? Or, does she have evil elements that ruin her brand as a great nation?

  **Because I have been accused of all kinds of things, let me tell you my full agenda here: I am Roman Catholic. The Church has been accused of everything but the common cold (but how can we truly know they didn't create it!!), and I am trying to get people to come around to the truth, that there is evil in all elements of society, religion, organizations, nations, etc., just as there are good in all of these. I am of the opinion that America is not evil, but has elements in her that undermine her, just as the Catholic Church (and most religions for that matter, including the JWs) stuggle with the same thing.**

  I would like to avoid criticizing each other's religions and non-religions. I don't hope to convert anybody. I only want us to discuss America and our opinions about where she has been and where she is going, etc....Thoughts?
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  James Brown

  The American people don't have anything to do with the US government.

  They are allowed to vote but they are never allowed to vote for anything that matters.

  Just like the Germans and the Russians were not evil.

  Its always the government and the government is always the same people.

  Sheep are sheep and sheep are to be lead to the slaughter.
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  King Solomon

  Your comparison is faulty: apples and oranges.

  Catholicism is a RELIGION, and operates under theocratic principles, while the US operates under principles of democracy, a form of govt.

  (I know, that's an oversimplification)

  Religions (note the plural) are not necessary to form a social contract that leads to human self-governance. In fact, insisting upon a 'State Religion' (as has been done in the past, with Catholicism) is completely antithetical to the principles upon which the US was founded. So any downside experienced by religious ideology is purely needless, optional, and self-induced.

  However, the US is a Nation built on principles which include freedom of worship, so it's a non-issue.

  But I'll go one step further: since religion claims to appeal to a higher moral agent, it SHOULD be held to a HIGHER moral standard than democracy, and should live up to the standards it preaches....

  BTW, 'evil' is a theological term (defined as violating Gods will), so it is completely meaningless when viewed thru secular non-Biblical eyes (and even there, not all bible-based adopt the same standards of evil; not even to mention the different religious ideals of what is 'evil'). It should be obvious that no action is intrinsically 'evil', as the term is a judgment based on RELATIVE (not absolute) definitions and values.
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  yknot

  Good Afternoon Travis

  Countries aren't evil....they are pieces of land designated by human inhabitants as territorial boundaries either by force or treaty.

  "Great Nations" much like 'Great Men" have faults.....

  The only 'brand' the USA officially peddles is democracy as an ideal form of government
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  jgnat

  Not even close. The US is a great place to live and raise a family.

  http://hdr.undp.org/en/data/explorer/ The US is the medium-size red bubble, red indicating it ranks pretty high on the Human Development Index (HDI).

  Check out "A Walk Across America" by Peter Jenkins, whose personal observations wiped out his disillusionment.

  Now, I am biased of course. I think Canada is even better.
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  Orthodox1

  King Solomon,

  It should be obvious that no action is intrinsically 'evil', as the term is a judgment based on RELATIVE (not absolute) definitions and values.

  Isn't that just your opinion based on relativism?.. The idea that all moral concepts are relative to the individual is an ideology based on an absence of God and morality (which is not provable but requires a sort of faith), which goes contrary to the world-wide agreement on fundamental human laws we all tend toward, even the non-religious. All would say murder is wrong, for instance, even without God's revelations through religion. This belief is coded in our very DNA.

  The idea that morality is relative to the individual, when deep jungle societies have similar commandments as the Judeo-Christian word, is not a likely or new or reasonable idea.

  Regarding the differences in definition of a country and a religion, I do not make much distinctions here, but only compare one large body with agreed-upon principals with another large body of agreed-upon principals. We can easily destinguish between religion and country all day long, but that is not my point. My intention here is to point out that there is "evil", or if you prefer "societal contrarians" among us who do not speak for the entire body, but only speak for their evil, or misconduct within the parameters of agreed-upon principals.

  If the Church says murder is wrong, and one murders, the individual is wrong, not the Church. If some Americans owned slaves, they would be wrong, contrary to the "life, liberty, and persuit of happiness" promised to all who were "created equal", but America herself would not wrong.
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  Orthodox1

  Not even close. The US is a great place to live and raise a family.

  http://hdr.undp.org/en/data/explorer/ The US is the medium-size red bubble, red indicating it ranks pretty high on the Human Development Index (HDI).

  Check out "A Walk Across America" by Peter Jenkins, whose personal observations wiped out his disillusionment.

  Now, I am biased of course. I think Canada is even better.

  You had me agreeing with you until the end! But, I admit I don't know enough about Canada...
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  jgnat

  We have central heating and indoor plumbing.

  The view out my window every day.

  
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  Joe Grundy

  This is just a brief personal opinion. Your question is unanswerable, because no group of people can be defined as 'evil', and certainly no country or state. Everywhere is a mixture of 'good' and 'bad' - however anyone defines those terms.

  But in relation to your stance (cf. other threads) - and again, this is a personal opinion, I believe that the Roman Catholic church, directed as it is by a single 'infallible' leader, is the closest thing I can conceive of as an 'evil influence' on the world over many centuries. More than any individual country or state, so far, and its influence continues.
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  rather be in hades

  Slavery... Racisim... Corporate greed... Atom bombs used against civilians... 53 million aborted... A debt to be paid by generations yet to be born... An oubreak of child-offenders in public schools...

  point one finger and 3 point right back at you...

  "Do not judge others, and you will not be judged"

  - some nameless dude, from way back in the day

  wise words to live by though. if only if only...