The Truth About Bible Principles: Chastity and Abstinence

by sabastious 83 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • sabastious
    sabastious

    Jehovah's Witnesses have a vast array of buzzterms that are fed into them on a regular basis, not the least of which is the term "Bible Principles." For most of my life I was convinced that only members of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society were applying Bible Principles in the correct way. This was mainly because we believed we had the correct translation of the Holy Scriptures which was largely rejected by "Satan's World." I believed that while using a "worldly" translation it would be more difficult to come to "the truth" about "Bible Principles." This seemingly required mitigation process of the Bible was why I beleived the NWT was created.

    I was watching a JW YouTube video about the end of false religion and I came across this comment:

    It is sad to see many deceived today. Many apostates tell ppl that witnesses are wrong and brain washing ppl , but then you go and look at the fruits of their lives and see that they are full of false faith and so many unclean acts, They have nothing better to show you, they only try to beat their former fellow slaves of God and drive ppl away from truth, due to jealousy, anger, contention... all those works of the flesh. It is so sad, keep up the preaching work my friend, Jehovah's blessing.

    The commenter seems to feel perfectly justified in proclaiming all ex members as "full of unclean acts." What this commenter is refering to is the Jehovah's Witnesses understanding of "Bible Principles." It's true that many non Jehovah's Witnesses don't believe in total chastity and abstinence. Many are often found in intimate relationships without legal marriage. To a Jehovah's Witness this is in direct violation of the "principles" spelled out in the Bible. This is how they can feel so righteous about it because it's a simple concept to them: don't have sex before marriage or else you are a "fornicator."

    But can that really be called a Bible Principle? It seems like it could be more accruately described as Bible Law which is what it was written down to be. This Law was written thousands of years ago so wouldn't a Bible Principle that involved such an old law be well adapted to society? There was one glarring difference between then and now: we have contraception. Technology will always throw a broom in the spokes of law, the internet is the latest broom. The technology of writing at one point was a new technology that was royally stirring the pot in it's day.

    Going from Law to Principle requires taking logical steps backward and observing the whole. The whole being the evolution of the human species in relation to the ancient laws written down about them. Why was marriage required for sexual relations back then? If you research the subject you will find a vast amount of information that can be practically applied to the people of the ancient world. You couldn't be promiscuous in those days because there were dire consquences of such actions. Impregnation was often a death sentence.

    From a more religious perspective you have ideas of the soul and the hereafter. Many religious ideals included the concept of human babies as connected to an immortal soul that were considered the children of God Himself. Sexual relations, within the theological framework, would be considered the gateway for the children of God to enter the physical realm. It is not surprising that we find a reverence for the act in the laws of ancient times.

    So, where is the actual principle in all of this? There are many, but the obvious one is in the concept of commitment which seems to be lost by the Watchtower and many other fundamental groups. Chastity and abstinence are religious laws that have become out of date and need to be replaced with modern day principles. The fact is that we should revere an act with so much creative power as accidents can and do happen.

    Taking an ancient law on the subject of sexual relations from a world void of modern medical technology and directly enforcing it upon a modern day populaton is completely immoral and destructive. Now that I am out of the Watchtower and look back I see that they don't teach principles, they just read from a book. The real life principles come from the growth of mankind as we learn more about ourselves simply through making choices and experiencing life as it unfolds before us.

    -Sab

  • myelaine
    myelaine

    dear sabastious...

    you said: "Taking an ancient law on the subject of sexual relations from a world void of modern medical technology and directly enforcing it upon a modern day populaton is completely immoral and destructive."...

    ancient laws/principles were articulated to acknowledge responsibily for personal dignity as opposed to the un-restrained or un-trained passions inherent in man.

    we need to make room for these laws/principles if we want to live in a civilized society, don't you think?

    love michelle

  • lohengren
    lohengren
    The real life principles come from the growth of mankind as we learn more about ourselves simply through making choices and experiencing life as it unfolds before us.

    That is a powerful statement. I wish more people in general could understand this, not just the religious.

    Being hard-headed and closed minded is a choice that you are free to make. However don't expect the rest of us to wait on you as we continue growing and evolving.

  • sabastious
    sabastious
    we need to make room for these laws/principles if we want to live in a civilized society, don't you think?

    I think they should be phased out completely as they have been from governmental law. I believe that the pedophilia rampant in the religions of today is a result of the clinging to ancient laws for longer than necessary. What's actually being clung to in these cases is power over others. I personally do not believe that the ancient laws were established to keep people from giving into sin. I believe such laws ALWAYS had a practicle reason that the lower classes of society were mostly unaware of. Sin is the study of detriment to mankind. The ancient world had a large group of uneducated and a small group of ruling educated elite. Sin meant something entirely different to an educated elite than it did to uneducated peasant. To the peasant sins were understood as certain acts whereas to the elite sin was more complex because of the higher education. Even though modern society is still largely class based the classes are not as rigidly defined as they were in the ancient world. This is why funamental religion discourages any type of higher education and attempt to demonize science. It's a form of terrorism because they are pursposefuly hindering societal progress to maintain power.

    The education of the morality of sexal relations should be a subject that stays within the family. There is no need to have a third party, but that third party is not simply going to hand over the reigns and sit down quietly. Which explains the aggressive atheist movement.

    -Sab

  • EndofMysteries
    EndofMysteries

    I thought a lot about this. In the Old Testament, why were concubines and many wives allowed? That's more then just 1 person. Then seeing how if a man took a women, how in some parts the punishment was for the less value, so he had to pay and take her as a wife. In that culture, the family was compensated, a non virgin was less valued. Also in ancient times, without modern appliances, the men if rich had workers if not they did the strong work and the women did the house work. Also no birthcontrol, so having to take her as a wife to support her and the child. In the old testament, it was and the 10 commandments, ADULTRY. Which is taking another mans wife. It's a sin or unloving act against another person. Having multiple wives, concubines, etc, seemed like legal fornication.

    In NT it does say the word fornication. Not sure if Jesus said as well, or just adultry. It seems it may have been added or a later thing.

    I also think, almost everything had a reason. Adultry makes sense, murder, stealing, even pork and shellfish, pork has more parasites then any other meat (how could they have known about that?), shrimp being bottom feeders have a lot of toxins, mercury, etc.

    In countries where marriage and a girl not being a virgin on her wedding night would cause a lot of family problems, it would be unloving to do, it would be negative against people. Or if not taking preventative measures and if a child is born not taking responsibility, that as well. If taking measures, if 2 adults want and won't hurt anyone, or avoid any chance of preg and do the other ways, it doesn't seem it would be wrong. Doesn't seem different then multiple wives and concubines.

    That's what I think at the moment but I'm a work in progress as I continue to learn and figure what I believe in.

  • sabastious
    sabastious
    Being hard-headed and closed minded is a choice that you are free to make. However don't expect the rest of us to wait on you as we continue growing and evolving.

    Hello lohengren, welcome to the forum. It's frustrating to see the damaging effects of hardheadedness because it's so obvious to the ones that grow beyond it, but are still left subject to the ill effects. It's as if we've had our feet nailed to the floor and only after we freed ourselves did we appreciate the increase of available mobility by seeing the ones who still are nailed to the floor.

    -Sab

  • NewChapter
    NewChapter

    Okay, so let me get this straight. I can have sex. Yeah---well alrighty---I'm good with that. Carry on.

  • myelaine
    myelaine

    dear sabastious...

    I hadn't mentioned the idea of sin. I mentioned dignity.

    whether you place a promiscuous person's actions in a file titled "sin" or "not sin" doesn't have much if any bearing on the secular notion of personal dignity.

    there are people who get caught up in their bad choices to the degree that they can't extradite themselves...if the whole country was left to their own devices where would the help (interventions)for these people come from but from those who recognize that there ARE limits to ones ability to control otherwise natural inclinations?...I think that these principles are beneficial as an (intellectual) barrier to wanton even lascivious sexuality.

    you said: "I believe that the pedophilia rampant in the religions of today is a result of the clinging to ancient laws for longer than necessary."...

    pedophiles and those who abuse older children sexually have been known to be married too, they are not just found in the religious sexually repressed camp if that is what you are implying.

    love michelle

  • sabastious
    sabastious
    whether you place a promiscuous person's actions in a file titled "sin" or "not sin" doesn't have much if any bearing on the secular notion of personal dignity.

    Chastity and abstinence are not secular pursuits, they are religious pursuits. If I were to guess I would say you are operating on the false assumption that such a practice has modern benefits that cannot be attained by any other means besides total chastity. Again, technology is what solves all these problems. If no such technology exists then it would be prudent to follow the old law and having faith of reaping secular benefits. But sex can be done today in a way that circumvents past ill effects. If this isn't accounted for then you are not following James' words of making sure you know what there is to know so that sin can be accurately described. Education is of vast importance.

    pedophiles and those who abuse older children sexually have been known to be married too, they are not just found in the religious sexually repressed camp if that is what you are implying.

    I am not saying that being sexually repressed drives people to pedophilia. I'm saying when chastity and abstinence is indoctrinated (<--KEYWORD) into the minds of children what you are going to end up with is sexual deviancy from a percentage of subjects as well as other problems. 1 Cor 5 is the first known record of this phenomenon within the Christian church. This deviancy is not just pedophilia, but also includes incest and bestiality. Check out this video:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_G9awnDCmg

    This video may be comical, but it accurately paints the biological condition of males in our species in regards to sexual activity. I need not remind you that you lack the general experience and understanding of BEING male and your ideas of sexual morality reflects that ignorance. Religious environments that favor chastity and abstinence are creating a culture of sexual deviancy and they are too afraid to admit it the world.

    Let me give you an analogy. Lets say that an ancient native american tribe used to use a particular herb religiously because of a health benefit. Because the herb gives a health benefit the society will revere it and it will be worked into their religious rituals. The tribe will believe that the herb is infused with some sort of spiritual healing properties. Now lets fast foward a few hundred years and go into one of the offshoots of the religion that the original tribe practiced. The herb is still being used, but there is a percentage of the population that is always covered in an ugly rash that shortens their lifespan significantly. The religious leaders are unaware that some in their population have become allergic to the herb that they use religiously, in fact, it doesn't even provide the original health benefit. To the leaders it might appear that the deity that provided the herb is cursing certain people for an unknown reason. One group of people use the religion to benefit their lives whereas with the other it causes harm and death.

    This, to me, accurately describes the problem of thinking that a certain religion is from God. In reality any particular religion did at one point help a lot of people. But, inevitably, at some point the religion is not going to apply and has to be reshaped to fit a new set of people within a new circumstance. Religions are like species in the chain of natural selection. They have to adapt or go extinct.

    -Sab

  • myelaine
    myelaine

    dear sabastious...

    you said: "Chastity and abstinence are not secular pursuits, they are religious pursuits."...

    I realize that chastity and abstinence aren't secular pursuits but one of its "offshoots" the notion of personal dignity, as pertains to sexual activity, is not confined to the christian religion but is a secular "virtue" as well.

    strictly speaking, they are not general "religious" pursuits either...there are and have been religions that practice "sacred sex", sexual religious rites...and don't forget the temple prostitutes.

    maybe it is the case that CHRISTIAN religious principles (and their attendant virtures) spilling out into secular society is disagreeable to you? in which case, revelation 21:7-8 might be disagreeable to you too.

    love michelle

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