How did you long-timers do it before the internet / Ray Franz books / abundant information?

by irondork 58 Replies latest jw friends

  • Jim_TX

    I quit going to meetings and such back around 1983 or so. I never got promoted to MS or anything, and had no 'career path' as a JW like others did. I guess I knew something was wrong, I just didn't verbalize (mentalize?) it.

    I withdrew myself from associating with a lot of the JWs, although I still associated with in-laws who were JWs.

    Around 1999 or 2000, I found a web site that no longer exists, for ex-JWs (Tim Campbell's). I started reading what others were saying and realized that I was not alone. There were others who had left.

    So, while I had left many years earlier, I did not know that others had just walked away, too.

    I didn't have any 'bright light' revelation like many who have already posted here, but I just left. I've never been DF'ed for it, that I know of, and I never DA'ed.


    Jim TX

  • slimboyfat

    AnnOMaly that was exactly what I was trying to say, excellent summary. Apostates don't cause a local stink as much as they used to.

    The Internet obviously causes significant problems for the Watchtower, there is no denying that. But I do still think there is a sense in which it blunts oldstyle apostasy too, as people tend to fade these days rather than confront their fellow Witnesses with their doubts and divergences of opinion.

  • mouthy

    Irondork.. No I dont but Randy might have one. I know there is a lot out there
    .I went into an old folks home & gave everything away...I shouldnt have done that....
    I came out of the home....& have very little of my old stuff...

  • cedars

    slimboyfat - your main argument, at least in the title to your post, wasn't so much that the internet weakens "old style apostasy" as you put it, but that it weakens apostasy in general. I think that people having less inclination to have their voices heard locally is a small price to pay for instead having the ability to flood a worldwide information resource with information that exposes the Society for what it really is, a dangerous cult. Sure, I feel less inclined to go evangelizing in my local community regarding the evils of the Watchtower Society than I otherwise would, but by channeling my thoughts and sentiments online I can reach many thousands more than I would do by taking to my local streets with an axe to grind.

    I can remember stories of apostates in my local congregation from when I was a very young child. There were rumours of one family that would sit near the front and heckle the speaker to the point of getting thrown out. I don't know whether they succeeded in attracting any others to their cause through this sort of behaviour, but I doubt it. Instead, they caused a stink and firmly entrenched an apostate stereotype of angry disgruntled hecklers, especially among young ones like me who were too young to understand their actions but had these explained and interpreted through others. I can't think how these sorts of tactics would be more productive than writing well-reasoned articles that thousands can read online from the most remote parts of the earth at the click of a mouse.

    Also, as I've shown on previous posts, there is a correlation (if not necessarily a causation) between countries with a high internet penetration, and those with low growth figures.

    internet impact

    So like I said, the basics of your argument (namely that the internet is good for the Society and bad for apostates) is still "utter twaddle" if you'll forgive my bluntness.


  • Bubblegum Apotheosis
    Bubblegum Apotheosis

    Farkel what kind of lies and backstabbing did you experience? Could you shares some stories with us, I thought 1974 was a time of innocent free love and joy!

    When they mentioned "Old-timers" I thought of James Wood! ;)

  • Bubblegum Apotheosis
    Bubblegum Apotheosis

    @mouthy, the similarities between Miles experience and ours is scarry. We did not experience the worship of money Miles accused the Pentacostals of! He should have stayed a ring-master, don't you think and he lost his Swiss-German wife for a group of hucksters! Miles childhood experience with early Protestant religions made him the perfect target for Assembly of God, whack jobs like Jim and Tammy Fay, Miles finally exposed the con-men and was turned into a pariah! Throughout Miles book, he keeps saying "I hid my logic, common sense, and critical thinking" behind. The power of people coming to praise him was seductive, he became addicted to man made glory, and mouthy he still is preachings with his cantankerous attidude for some conspiracy blog! Strange we both read and found his book a tool to escape with our minds!

  • Aussie Oz
    Aussie Oz

    Didn't need Ray Franz to see the bullshit. One doesn't need to look very hard to see the bullshit.

    very true Farkel, unfortunatley some of us were totally blinded by ''shit-out'', a browner version if ''white-out'' that effects snow bound explorers...

    Interestingly, my teen daughter seems to have seen the bullshit all by herself and son seems to be discovering the same.

    smarter generation that their old man i'd say.


  • mouthy

    Bubblegum.... When I met him ( Miles) he is truly a fine fellow. Just so angry at his losses
    I guess I can understand that ...Glad you read the book

  • slimboyfat
    your main argument, at least in the title to your post, wasn't so much that the internet weakens "old style apostasy" as you put it, but that it weakens apostasy in general.

    Yeah, I know. I changed my mind about the Internet being a bad thing overall for apostates, as I said on posts on both that thread and this one. I agree with the points AnnOMaly made, which was the main argument I was trying to make as I see it.

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